Lance, latest have we done it yet.

You reckon Liggett is going to apologise to all the people he called liars including the US govt investigators who he said were paying people to lie in court about Lance?

no, i expect he will try to deflect the real issue and apportion blame to somebody/something else.

even Phil Liggett now understands whats been going on…

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/cycling/cycling-commentator-phil-liggett-says-lance-armstrong-made-a-fool-out-of-him/story-fnanprbk-1226500195180

You reckon Liggett is going to apologise to all the people he called liars including the US govt investigators who he said were paying people to lie in court about Lance?

Do you reckon Liggett actually remembers saying any of that? He exists in his own little bubble and is well past the point where a dignified retirement would have suited him nicely.

glitch bump

Ligget has dementia.

No it’s not the same thing, that’s the same as lance’s “tough week” “these allegations” etc.

Its pretty clear IMPOSSIBLE FOR HIM TO BE CLEAN – I see no way for ambiquity.

no, just interested in how the staunch supporters/enablers react to the news,

What do you mean by enabler here – Hora was Motoman 🙄

i guess facing the reality that your idol is a fraud and a cheat is a bitter pill to swallow, or not?

Of course it is and the sensitive way you have handled the goading has really helped and led to him providing an open and honest answer.
FFS we all have heros and we have all seen heroes fail..its not nice. There was a time when we all beleived in LA or Contador for example. When you realise of course it is not a good day and a “tough” week.
I dont see any need for the attitude tbh

It is a very clear statement now let it go – he had said the same on other threads about LA.

I’ve already said that when George came ‘out’ that its impossible for him to be clean. If someone who has never tested positive admits to doping then its a world of shit.

Banned!

“Armstrong has no place in cycling” UCI recognises the USADA report.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/oct/22/uci-lance-armstrong-press-conference-live

“Armstrong has no place in cycling” UCI recognises the USADA report.

Looking more like a assassination every minute.

they had no choice as WADA would have tried to strip them of the right to organise cycling IMHO

Is McQuaid’s position tenable? “Why took over as president I made the fight against doping my priority. It remains my priority … there’s still more work to be done. I have no intention of resigning.”

we got this with it being his number one priority 😯
Either complicit or shit and either is a reason to resign

There was a time when we all beleived in LA or Contador for example.

who is this “we” shouldn’t that be ‘I’ ?

Looking more like a assassination every minute

More like assisted suicide. Armstrong knew what he was doing and, so it would appear, so did everyone else. A lot of people are going to be trying to get their money back now!

Think a big line needs to be drawn under this and a fresh start made.

who is this “we” shouldn’t that be ‘I’

Not content with just goading one person now….bless.

Ok Only I ever thought LA and Contador was clean everyone else knew they were dirty cheats even Phil ligget- yes that makes sense thanks for helping me 🙄

Seriously troll someone else 😕
YAWN

Think a big line needs to be drawn under this and a fresh start made.

Just like 1999.

What a grubby sport

Think a big line needs to be drawn under this and a fresh start made.

Just like 1999.

Hopefully a bigger, better line!

What a grubby sport

So which are the clean sports?

More like assisted suicide. Armstrong knew what he was doing and, so it would appear, so did everyone else. A lot of people are going to be trying to get their money back now!

Smacks of scapegoating to me. Did people go after Millar, Contador etc for their money back? Did they have all of their victories stripped? Did any doping agencies offer immunity to other dirty riders in return for testimony against ONE rider? Did any others get banned for life?

He hasn’t done himself any favours by being a dick to so many people BUT there are some serious double standards here I can see.

McQuaid says placings for the seven Lance Tours will be discussed in the Friday meeting. Maybe they should’ve had that meeting before today? It’s quite an important one.

Indeed.

Did any doping agencies offer immunity to other dirty riders in return for testimony against ONE rider?

That’s one of Armstrong claims.

That’s one of Armstrong claims.

I thought it was widely reported that it happened? I didn’t think USADA had even denied it?

Seriously troll someone else
YAWN

hang on a sec, i have posted a lot of info in this thread right from the beginning, all that ashenden stuff and relevant opinion from various creditable and knowledgeable blogs/articles that was contrary to the enablers blind faith in LA’s ‘achievements’.

as a non believer right from the start i had no wish to be included in the “we” collective gullible lance fans that you mentioned.

troll? you can jog-on*

*not because you have or had a different opinion on LA as that’s an essential part of the debate.

Smacks of scapegoating to me. Did people go after Millar, Contador etc for their money back? Did they have all of their victories stripped? Did any doping agencies offer immunity to other dirty riders in return for testimony against ONE rider? Did any others get banned for life?

LA was offered the opportunity to ‘come clean’ and assist with the investigation – he chose not to. Others did & had minimal/reduced punishments.

If LA had ‘fessed then the statue of limitations would’ve applied & he’d still have 5 of his TdF titles.

Smacks of scapegoating to me.

Its not scapegoating if you go after the ring leader. You’d accept a plea bargain from a Mafia foot solider to get the top dog.

USADAs case shows that LA ran the most sophsitciated and widespread doping program in sporting history. What is for certain is that he was the main beneficiary of doping during that perior even if he wasn’t in charge.

In these circumastance I think the reduced bans are justified and fair.

Paul Kimmage giving him both barrels

http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/cycling-big-reveal-of-cancer-jesus-3266380.html

But the piece was spiked by the newspaper’s lawyers. Later that summer, I wrote at length about Armstrong’s return to the Tour de France and it happened again — two weeks work, spiked by the lawyers. So it has been pleasing this week to see his face in so many newspapers. The cancer Jesus exposed. Justice finally done.

Smacks of scapegoating to me. Did people go after Millar, Contador etc for their money back? Did they have all of their victories stripped? Did any doping agencies offer immunity to other dirty riders in return for testimony against ONE rider? Did any others get banned for life?

You do know that they went after Ullerich and stripped him of some of his results and gave him a 2 year ban all despite him being retired and all dont you? You know the same time as Contador got 6 months…

And they should just ignore the biggest cheater in the sport just because he’s ‘moved on’? what anti-doping signal does that send?

If Armstrong had cooperated then presumably they’d have let him keep his first 4 or 5 under statute of limitations. Like the rest of the posties. This is what usually happens, cooperation/admission of guilt = reduced ‘punishment’.

I didn’t think USADA had even denied it?

Everyone who has admitted doping has now been banned, like Lance himself they couldn’t be banned till the investigation ended. What is there for USADA to deny?

So, who gets the titles now?

AFAIK, Kloden was about the only clean* rider to have been on the podium alongside him!

* – Probably. Possibly. Perhaps. Etc.

So, who gets the titles now?

I’m thinking I might be in with a shout.

LA was offered the opportunity to ‘come clean’ and assist with the investigation – he chose not to. Others did & had minimal/reduced punishments.

Contador never came clean did he?

Its not scapegoating if you go after the ring leader.

Ring leader? I don’t buy that for a second. All these claims the LA made people dope is just a fairytale. They’re grown men FFS.

And they should just ignore the biggest cheater in the sport just because he’s ‘moved on’? what anti-doping signal does that send?

How does anyone know that he’s the biggest cheater in the sport? sensationalist rubbish IMO. And at what point have I suggested that he be left alone?

Everyone who has admitted doping has now been banned

Banned for life? Stripped of all titles?

Did they have all of their victories stripped?

IIRC, if Lance had of gone through arbitration or admitted to doping the penalty incurred would have been less. I believe he would even have retained some of his tour wins.

He knew this, or he didn’t read his racing license when he signed it.

The above is a little hazy tbh, I’m sure someone can confirm either way.

ooOOoo – Member
What a grubby sport

As has been pointed out before USADA do not test American Football players etc. who clearly dope.

Not saying that LA is okay due to this; but it does seem to be massively hypocritical stand point on the part of USADA.

All these claims the LA made people dope is just a fairytale. They’re grown men FFS.

Nobody ‘made’ them do it – but if you were young and desperate to succeed at the sport you’d dedicated your life too, and were put under severe pressure to believe this was the only way……

I don’t think you can brush it off that lightly.

How does anyone know that he’s the biggest cheater in the sport?

Well name me anybody else who has been stripped of more than 7 TdF wins and I’ll show you a bigger cheat… 😀

Even the UCI are calling him one FFS!

Okay, hows about the biggest cheater ever caught, you happy with that?

Did people go after Millar, Contador etc for their money back? Did they have all of their victories stripped? Did any doping agencies offer immunity to other dirty riders in return for testimony against ONE rider? Did any others get banned for life?

In order:

1, No idea. Going to say no, given the UCI comments that the rules don’t cover it
2, Yes, for the period they were found guilty. I don’t think they’ve stripped Lance of his world championship for example
3, WADA rules allow for reductions in minimum bans for people materially helping cases
4, Ferrari and del Moral so far. Probably Celaya and Johan to come. Arguably though, Leipheimer should be doing an 8 year ban as this was his second offense.

As has been pointed out before USADA do not test American Football players etc. who clearly dope.

Not saying that LA is okay due to this; but it does seem to be massively hypocritical stand point on the part of USADA.

American football is not an olympic sport so not covered under the USADA or WADA mandates.

@piemonster:

As mentioned up there^^, if he’d come clean then the statute of limitations would have applied meaning anything that happened more than 8 years ago would be inadmissable. He’d have kept 5 TdF titles.

well worth listening to. only available till 9pm tonight.

lance sounds like a right nasty piece of work.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01ngqxd/5_live_Sport_Peddlers_Cyclings_Dirty_Truth/

odd that the UCI are still after kimmage yet take USADA’s investigation as true?

I don’t think you can brush it off that lightly.

Perhaps not. But we all have a choice. LA didn’t hold them down and inject them. They all had to answer the question “should I cheat” and they all said yes.
I don’t believe that he can be held up as the chief big daddy drugs pusher of cycling.

American football is not an olympic sport so not covered under the USADA or WADA mandates.

Fair enough