Lance, latest have we done it yet.

These eleven (11) teammates of Lance Armstrong, in alphabetical order, are Frankie Andreu, Michael Barry, Tom Danielson, Tyler Hamilton, George Hincapie, Floyd Landis, Levi Leipheimer, Stephen Swart, Christian Vande Velde, Jonathan Vaughters and David Zabriskie.

did you get that from his opening post on his thread?
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/usada-releasing-armstrong-evidence-today
I think he may have meant has anyone else come clean on twitter tbh

I meant who has came out and released a statement or whatever today as JY said.

Ahh, I may have miss read that. Mine was from the USADA site, same thing though. Helluva read. Wonder whats in the other 800 odd pages?

The other 800 pages is the evidence, statements, etc (appendices & supporting evidence)

http://cyclinginvestigation.usada.org/

See the different tabs…

wouldn’t fancy trying toget my bike through US customs in this 😆

As for the difference between Lance and the current winners there is one key difference. Evidence. There has always been suspicion about Lance due to bits of evidence but his “never failed a test” mantra and willingness to sue meant it never really got mainstream attention.

There isn’t the same suspicion based on evidence of current winners. People who know more about these things than you or I give the view that these people, Evans, Heijerdal (sp?), Wiggins, are clean.

That doesn’t mean we should be complacent and ignore evidence if it does appear but in my view it means we can enjoy the sport for what it is, without having it ruined by an assumption that any outstanding performance is drug fuelled.

http://d3epuodzu3wuis.cloudfront.net/Hincapie%2c+George+Affidavit.pdf

hincapies testimony is worth a read

From GH’s statement, Rider 4 – Bobby Julich or Andrea Peron.

After reading GH’s statement and recently David Millar’s book, I can almost empathise with these guys. To be at that level of fitness and still not be able to compete clean must be soul destroying.

It will be very interesting to see what tack LA takes after this, now that continuing denial is not a viable option. I can’t see it in his personality to take any blame for what’s gone on but I can see a definite PR machine rumbling to make him a hero once again and portray him as a ‘victim’ who only did what was necessary for the benefit his cancer charity!

he is still denying it as vociferously as always from his lawyer today

(The) statement confirms the alleged ‘reasoned decision’ from USADA will be a one-sided hatchet job – a taxpayer-funded tabloid piece rehashing old, disproved, unreliable allegations based largely on axe-grinders, serial perjurers, coerced testimony, sweetheart deals and threat-induced stories,”
Breen said the agency was “ignoring the 500-600 tests Lance Armstrong passed, ignoring all exculpatory evidence, and trying to justify the millions of dollars USADA has spent pursuing one, single athlete for years.”
He added: “USADA has continued its government-funded witch hunt of only Mr. Armstrong, a retired cyclist, in violation of its own rules and due process, in spite of USADA’s lack of jurisdiction, in blatant violation of the statute of limitations.”

That statement is surely beyond spin and just untrue/inaccurate and a lie.
others were charged for example, it explain why the statute of limitations does not apply, it clearly has jurisdiction etc

Someone needs to have a word with him and explain the bubble is burst

It will be very interesting to see what tack LA takes after this, now that continuing denial is not a viable option

Is he not a bit stuck because of the next civil whistle blowing case being brought by Landis on behalf of the US government? Presumably if he actually admits to this he is in lots of trouble due to that, SCA, promises to sponsors on being clean etc. Simeoni must be smiling today

Like it Yunki 😀

For me the key parts of the statement Junkyard shared are where the proceedings are described as a “hatchet job” and a “witch hunt” He/they are now getting past trying to convince people who follow cycling as we are a lost cause (except Lance’s road dog Hora) and are now aiming at the general public who will have little idea of the way doping/testing works in cycling,surely this is now a dangerous game? All going to turn into even more of a car crash than it already is,as he has backed himself into a real corner with the above press release.

As an aside,have you seen how cheap livestrong sunnies go on fleabay now?

I’m just as suspicisous of current winners and their team mates. The ability of two riders in particular to reel in breakaways of several strong riders day after day is uncanny. The current directeur sportive of one successful current team tested positive in 89 though was not punished. He rode with Lance for much of his career and was also dricteur sportive of one of Lance’s teams.

As you mean Sky, why not just say it?

I assume there are still drugs cheat in all sports but the systematic cheating that characterised pro road cycling at that time and LA and his team in particular are a thing of the past.

I think they’re probably very much still with us. I’m worried they might be very close to home.

He added: “USADA has continued its government-funded witch hunt of only Mr. Armstrong, a retired cyclist, in violation of its own rules and due process, in spite of USADA’s lack of jurisdiction, in blatant violation of the statute of limitations.”

Well they tried that in court, the judge said USADA did have jurisdiction, are they now calling the judge a liar? Isn’t that statement sailing rather close to contempt or something similar, any legal eagles know?

a retired cyclist

bless, gives the impression of some doddering old man looking around slightly bewildered at all the attention that is suddenly being focused upon him.

MSP – Member
Well they tried that in court, the judge said USADA did have jurisdiction, are they now calling the judge a liar? Isn’t that statement sailing rather close to contempt or something similar, any legal eagles know?

No contempt – not said in court. Just makes them look like clowns.

Agree (and this isn’t a troll), the reason why I was holding my support for Lance was I didn’t think it was conceivable for Lance to be ‘clean’ this long without the assistance of the UCI, and/or incompetent doping controls, and/or corrupt doping testers etc.

Lance won’t come clean as if he does he’s going to jail for perjury.

Glitch…?

Lance won’t come clean as if he does he’s going to jail for perjury.

I don’t think it matters if he comes clean or not, if the evidence points to him lying under oath, then he committed perjury. It will be interesting to see if this actually happens, and why the investigation was closed down when there is so much compelling evidence.

“Watershed moment in the pro peloton?? “

If the positives out of the below can be taken then yes I believe it’s a watershed moment.

Read the riders’ statements

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/danielson-vande-velde-and-zabriskie-accept-usada-bans

Ok, meant to say that Lance won’t come clean voluntarily. Suspect he’ll go down for this.

Also, I’m quite surprised by people saying how disappointed they are by riders like Hincapie and Barry. Are you following the same sport I’ve been following? This can’t really come as a surprise to anyone. They were put in incredibly difficult situations during some dark times for cycling, and given the same alternatives I’m sure most of us would probably have made the same choices. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to read Millar and Hamiltons books for starters.

Let us say that you went to a party and on the way back home you were stopped by the police for speeding. Then the cop made you take an alcohol test. It showed that you were not drunk. He took another one and it showed the same thing. He took you to the hospital and their test showed you were not under the influence of Alcohol.

The cop then goes to the party and thay say “oh, he was drunk”. So now you are pronounced GUILTY.

Armstong had hundreds of test and he passed them all, but now (just because some people who don’t like him or have already been caught and are just determined to drag him down with them,) he’s guilty?

It’s a good job that at the end of the day it’s just about riding a bicycle around the place, so pretty insignificant in the scheme of things.

Joao – are you still in denial about lala? After all the evidence published over the last few years?
Blimey.

Let us say that you went to a party and on the way back home you were stopped by the police for speeding. Then the cop made you take an alcohol test. It showed that you were not drunk. He took another one and it showed the same thing. He took you to the hospital and their test showed you were not under the influence of Alcohol.

The cop then goes to the party and thay say “oh, he was drunk”. So now you are pronounced GUILTY.

Armstong had hundreds of test and he passed them all, but now (just because some people who don’t like him or have already been caught and are just determined to drag him down with them,) he’s guilty?

You’re joking, right?

And if they had records of bank transfers to the off licence?

Joao, if a load of others at the party were also tested and shown not to be drunk, then all admitted to having been boozing heavily all night… what conclusions would you come to?

Joao, if a load of others at the party were also tested and shown not to be drunk, then all admitted to having been boozing heavily all night… what conclusions would you come to?

That the testing system was dodgy?
That the other party goers were hacked off?

The whole saga is just very sordid and very sad.

Nike still supporting Lance. Quite surprising really.

Joao – that’s the shittest analogy I’ve ever heard.

Also check up what WADA accepts as evidence, sworn testimony is included, not just positive tests.
The UCI and ASO have signed up and accepts WADA regulations.

Take your head out the sand, it’ll hurt your eyes.

Nike still supporting Lance. Quite surprising really.

I suppose with the “Just do it!” slogan their support is quite appropriate.

How about Oakley, Trek etc?

Joao – that’s the shittest analogy I’ve ever heard

Sorry. I nicked it from elsewhere, so unfortunately can’t claim any credit for it’s shittiness.

Joao, if a load of others at the party were also tested and shown not to be drunk, then all admitted to having been boozing heavily all night… what conclusions would you come to?

I’d conclude their statement to be unreliable at best, blatant lying at worst.

If never failing a drugs test can be trumped by some blokes saying “he did it”, then what’s the point in all the drug testing.

Anyway, I’m clearly out of my depth amongst all the doping & legal experts here 😀

Joao – that’s the shittest analogy I’ve ever heard

Sorry. I nicked it from elsewhere, so unfortunately can’t claim any credit for it’s shittiness.

Joao, if a load of others at the party were also tested and shown not to be drunk, then all admitted to having been boozing heavily all night… what conclusions would you come to?

I’d conclude their statement to be unreliable at best, blatant lying at worst.

If never failing a drugs test can be trumped by some blokes saying “he did it”, then what’s the point in all the drug testing.

Anyway, I’m clearly out of my depth amongst all the doping & legal experts here. I didn’t realise STW was populated with so many globally-renowned lawyers & scientists 😀 … unless we’re all just repeating stuff we found on the internet & agree with?

That the testing system was dodgy?
That the other party goers were hacked off?
The whole saga is just very sordid and very sad.

1, Yes
2, Can’t see how that is true. In this case all your mates have come forward and said that they were all shit-faced despite the fact if they’d kept their mouths shut nobody would have known
3, Agreed. It’s a shocking period in professional sport in general and particularly for cycling. This hopefully will begin to really draw a line under it

If never failing a drugs test can be trumped by some blokes saying “he did it”, then what’s the point in all the drug testing.

Millar never failed a drugs test.

2, Can’t see how that is true. In this case all your mates have come forward and said that they were all shit-faced despite the fact if they’d kept their mouths shut nobody would have known

The tests say one thing and the person says the opposite.
Lance, as one person, had the power to influence and oversee this structure of professional doping yet USADA doesn’t have the same level of influence.
Just saying like. [/devil’s advocate]