Jeremy Corbyn

Do you actually think anyone bothers reading all the waffle, yours included?

Of course I don't read it.

A fart in a tornado. Utterly pointless.

As a six-year-old government at a time of national turmoil, that kind of lead is worth much more to the Tories than protest polls generated by the unpopularity of a Labour government in office. They are the kind of figures that incumbent politicians dream of.

Don't worry about 'The List' oldmanmtb. As the Glorious Leader himself said "we don't do malice".

The fact that he was sat in a lair underneath a volcano, stroking a white cat at the time, made some question his commitment to the sentiment, but I'm sure it'll all be fine. Everyone of the left is, by definition, lovely and non-violent as they don't eat bacon butties or kebabs.

That in itself would make me violent, but apparently this isn't the case....

Mr Woppit - Member

Not that I'm involved in the imminent bloodbath even in an emotional sense, but IMHO, any leader worth his or her salt would have seen this coming and "lead" the party away from any possibility of the current embarrassment. He's (was) supposed to be leading all the different sections including the PLP.

If the PLP were dying of thirst, and Corbyn said "Let's go to the pub, I'll buy you all a pint", they'd variously declare they weren't thirsty, that nobody would ever vote for people that go to pubs, that there was no such thing as a pub, that buying them all a pint was uncosted and irresponsible, that they were already in the pub, or that though they had always wanted to go to the pub, Corbyn wasn't the right man to take them there. And as they all died of thirst, their last words would be "This is Corbyn's fault for not leading us to the pub.!"

Binners isn't left-wing, he isn't right-wing, he isn't anything ...... [b]he's just "anti-everything[/b]".

Binners is Jeremy Corbyn and I claim my £5

Legal arguments today .. should Corbyn be on the ballot without 50 MP/MEPs EDIT: decision Thursday, could be appealed of course.

oldmanmtb - Member

Commisar Lynch is currently composing his little red troll book and it has a list....

I think the point was already understood when you said [i]"Binners it appears you will be first up against the wall come the revolution...."[/i]

Can you think of another one ?

.

Mr Woppit - Member

binners has a point.

I think it's probably fair to say that quite a few people think that binners has a point, ie, all the Tory supporters on here. They have certainly lavished praise on his unrestrained and eloquent rants. Which is hardly surprising really. I'm sure the one about Rolf Harris making a better Labour leader than Corbyn was a big hit.

Speaker John Bercow tells Labour MP Seema Malhotra claims of unauthorised entry into her office not a possible breach of Commons rules

So they did not break the rules..I am sure this outcome will get as much attention as the claim that was not upheld

Everyone of the left is, by definition, lovely and non-violent as they don't eat bacon butties or kebabs.

That in itself would make me violent, but apparently this isn't the case.

Peace Brother Peace 8)

Binners would rather vote for a child molester? 😯

I miss the days when I was ernies lest favourite guardian leaning pseudo lefty 😉

CaptainFlashheart - Member

Do you actually think anyone bothers reading all the waffle, yours included?

Of course I don't read it.

A fart in a tornado. Utterly pointless.

I have no idea. But I assume that you keep reading mine as you keep responding to my posts.

Or do you get some else to read them for you ?

JY - You're still on 'The List' comrade

Come the glorious revolution..... 😉

Junkyard - lazarus

I miss the days when I was ernies lest favourite guardian leaning pseudo lefty

No need Junkyard, I still don't have much time for pseudo lefties.

I think binners has probably noticed.

I wasn't responding to your post. I was responding to the thread, and referencing your earlier, accurate, comment on the futility of it. But, if it would make you feel like a special little snowflake, you keep on believing that I'm hanging on your every word.

Hint - I'm not.

You've only really made it into the big league when he's trawling through your posts from 10 months ago for quotes

I wouldnt wish that on anyone. Re-reading the shite I posted up last year. Probably while drunk, or sniffing glue, or in a pie coma

Lefties are funny! 😆

clodhopper - Member

Binners would rather vote for a child molester?

That's a bit unfair clodhopper. Binner's point was that Corbyn is less popular than a well-known peadophile. If there's one thing binners doesn't like doing it's to understate the point he's trying to make.

.

CaptainFlashheart - Member

.....you keep on believing that I'm hanging on your every word.

I would be more than happy if you didn't read my posts. Do you think that you can manage to do that?

binners - Member

Re-reading the shite I posted up last year. Probably while drunk, or sniffing glue, or in a pie coma

You were incapacitated last year ? Well that explains a lot.

It's lucky that you're not posting any shite this year, isn't it ?

Flashy has his man-servant read then give a brief, concise synopsis of every thread then beats him until he comes up with a pithy reposte that suitably amuses him.

It's nothing personal

Did you not know this?

"I wouldnt wish that on anyone. Re-reading the shite I posted up last year. Probably while drunk, or sniffing glue, or in a pie coma"

What's your excuse this year then?

I've just seen this........the man who wishes to be the next Prime Minister going to work this morning :

[img] https://next-geebee.ft.com/image/v1/images/raw/http%3A%2F%2Fcom.ft.imagepublish.prod.s3.amazonaws.com%2F401e2058-5316-11e6-9664-e0bdc13c3bef?source=next&fit=scale-down&width=700 [/img]

Has he no shame throwing his leg over a Raleigh dressed as a geography teacher approaching retirement?

He's even wearing those sandals that I wore when I was six years old.

EDIT : And why aren't those roses red ?

Binners wins...

Ernie why are you so sarcastic and moody all the time, these must be heady days for you ATM. Your efforts are making a real difference. Not far now, stay strong camarada.

I think clicking on this thread is like driving past a crash on the motorway...you know you shouldn't look, but you just can't help it! 🙁

ok thats it there is no way i can vote for a man with a stem like that

Anyone but Corbyn from now on

ok thats it there is no way i can vote for a man with a stem like that

However, I've seen photos of him with other bikes, so maybe he scores well for having n+1. I'm torn.

"If the PLP were dying of thirst, and Corbyn said "Let's go to the pub, I'll buy you all a pint", they'd variously declare they weren't thirsty, that nobody would ever vote for people that go to pubs, that there was no such thing as a pub, that buying them all a pint was uncosted and irresponsible, that they were already in the pub, or that though they had always wanted to go to the pub, Corbyn wasn't the right man to take them there. And as they all died of thirst, their last words would be "This is Corbyn's fault for not leading us to the pub.!""

So not an ideal choice for Labour leader.

I think it's probably fair to say that quite a few people think that binners has a point, ie, all the Tory supporters on here.

Oh. Are you saying, as a Marxist non-Tory, that a Corbyn/McDonnell-led Labour Party will get the vote of the "Middle Englanders" who ensured Tony Blair victories in the past?

I think you may have become delusional.

Beer?

Will there be sandwiches?

Basically Wopster, word from the bunker is...

"If you're not with us, you're against us"

"If you are not part of the solution, you're part of the problem"

Obviously this new kinder, gentler, more inclusive type of politics, as the polls show today, has enormous electoral appeal.

Only a cynic would suggest that the comrades of Momentum have singularly failed to understand the most basic element of a democracy. That it might be an idea to try to convince people to vote for you, rather than, say, lecture them on why they're wrong, abuse and denounce them as traitors, and maybe add in some (extremely)!thinly veiled threats for good measure. And that's just labour members and voters. Before you get on to the charm offensive for floating voters, or undecided potential Tory's....

They're a bright bunch

Mr Woppit - Member

"I think it's probably fair to say that quite a few people think that binners has a point, ie, all the Tory supporters on here".

Oh. Are you saying, as a Marxist non-Tory, that a Corbyn/McDonnell-led Labour Party will get the vote of the "Middle Englanders" who ensured Tony Blair victories in the past?

I would have thought that it was ridiculously clear what I was saying.

But I'll try to make even easier to understand if it helps you. Tory supporters hugely appreciate when Labour Party leaders are attacked and ridiculed. Not just Corbyn but any Labour leader, Ed Miliband, Gordon Brown, Tony Blair, John Smith, Neil Kinnock, etc.

So it's hardly surprising if Tory supporters on here appreciate binners attacking and ridiculing the present Labour leader. HTH, I can't make it any clearer.

Binners arrives at momentum meeting

But I'll try to make even easier to understand if it helps you. Tory supporters hugely appreciate when Labour Party leaders are attacked and ridiculed. Not just Corbyn but any Labour leader, Ed Miliband, Gordon Brown, etc.

The far ends of the political spectrum depend on a analysis that moves the centre ground towards them. They thrive on creating a tribal politics where you are either for us or against us

Our Croydon Communist et al will vote for Corbyn because it fits their political ambitions, not for any love of his policies (other than being against lots of things and rail nationalisation does he actually have any?) They see it as part of the journey of political enlightenment for the "working class" who they see as a route to a paradigm change over the long term

To this you add social media which allows bits of information to swirl at an unprecedented rate regardless of its basis in reality

This allows someone who potentially can't organise himself out a paper bag, does not actually know what to do to achieve his aims and has some frankly odd views which another would struggle to defend to become the totemic figurehead who can't be deposed due to the risk of a fellow traveler not replacing him

But I'll try to make even easier to understand if it helps you. Tory supporters hugely appreciate when Labour Party leaders are attacked and ridiculed. Not just Corbyn but any Labour leader, Ed Miliband, Gordon Brown, etc.

The far ends of the political spectrum depend on a analysis that moves the centre ground towards them. They thrive on creating a tribal politics where you are either for us or against us

Our Croydon Communist et al will vote for Corbyn because it fits their political ambitions, not for any love of his policies (other than being against lots of things and rail nationalisation does he actually have any?) They see it as part of the journey of political enlightenment for the "working class" who they see as a route to a paradigm change over the long term

To this you add social media which allows bits of information to swirl at an unprecedented rate regardless of its basis in reality

This allows someone who potentially can't organise himself out a paper bag, does not actually know what to do to achieve his aims and has some frankly odd views which another would struggle to defend to become the totemic figurehead who can't be deposed due to the risk of a fellow traveler not replacing him

Obviously this new kinder, gentler, more inclusive type of politics, as the polls show today, has enormous electoral appeal.

Him winning the leadership again will be yet further proof that, electorally speaking, he is shit

Him winning the 'leadership' given the insurgency over the last 12 months is as decisive a victory, and as relevant to the wider electorate, as me walking the upcoming election in our house for best bald fat bloke

Press have a history lesson

Clearly the [s] PLP[/s][b] Jeremy Corbyn MP[/b] openly revolting against and constantly undermining the leader is not a cause of this and just evidence of just how[s] rubbish, [/s] [b] disengaged from the PLP [/b] he is.
Him winning the leadership again will be yet further proof that, electorally speaking, he is [s]shit[/s] [b]still disconnected from the PLP [/b]

@ ernie

You said that only Tories would think that binner had a point.

binner's point is that Corbyn cannot appeal to enough of the English vote (as Blair did) to gain power.

You seem to disagree with this hypothesis (you're not a Tory).

You're either being deliberately obtuse or you are actually missing the point.

7/10 for the sarcasm though. Good effort.

You're either being deliberately obtuse or you are actually missing the point.

7/10 for the sarcasm though. Good effort.

That's a strange comment from someone who has just deliberately and blatantly misrepresented what I said.

I know what point I was making. If you want to make your own separate point then fine - I will choose whether I respond to it or not.

Right now I don't think I'll bother.

So anyway......it looks like the plotters billionaire friends are right behind them :

[url= http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/693486/assem-allam-labour ]Top Labour donor lays into Corbyn and urges party to move to the right[/url]

[i][b]"ONE of Labour's top donors has urged the party to shift away from the far-left direction it has been taken to by Jeremy Corbyn."[/b][/i]

No mention what this "far-left direction" is though. It's a bit like the Republican/ Tea Party Right never felt the need to explain why according to them Barack Obama is a Marxist Muslim extremist.

I particularly liked this quote from Assem Allam :

[i][b]"I believe [Winston] Churchill had a saying, 'It is insane to do the same thing twice and expect different results'."[/i][/b]

Assem Allam certainly knows his cliches but it is the first time I have heard that one attributed to Churchill. I believe that this particular "quote" first surfaced around 15 years ago, Churchill died 50 years ago.

I also liked :

[i][b]Tim Johnston, from the hard-right group Momentum, a key ally of Mr Corbyn, rebuked Dr Allam's idea of a "centralist Tory party".[/b][/i]

I guess that when you submerge yourself in nonsensical rhetoric it must be quite easy to get mixed up.

.

I also noticed that another wealthy Labour donor, Ian Rosenblatt, said today that he was backing Owen Smith but that he didn't expect him to win the next general election, should he become Labour leader.

Well that certainly throws a spanner into the works with regards to why it is so imperative to replace Corbyn as Labour leader.

Of course no one actually believes that Owen Smith stands a better chance than Corbyn to become the next prime minister, it's just no one outside the Corbyn camp is prepared to say it, well until now that is.

They don't attack Corbyn on policy - they just say that the only reason they want him replaced is that he is allegedly "unelectable", just like their preferred man, apparently.

[quote=binners ]Him winning the 'leadership' given the insurgency over the last 12 months is as decisive a victory, and as relevant to the wider electorate, as me walking the upcoming election in our house for best bald fat bloke

its not its the very issue as this is the schism.

I dont understand why you think Labour MPs can ignore the labour party.

Well if a load of people I've never seen before, despite having lived here for years, all rock up out of the blue and claim to be the true representatives of the hosehold, then vote for some other bald fat bloke. The one who lives at the bottom of the garden and throws rocks and bottles at the house, The one everyone's been rolling their eyes at and trying to ignore, because frankly he's a bit odd, and he wins, then clearly I'm In a bit of a pickle

I'm sure that won't happen though.

If it does, your suggestion is I just accept that and move out, right?

The Labour Party isn't someone's house with a locked front door.

It is not someone's personal property. It was formed to represent trade unions in parliament, the clue is in the name. Today it exists to represent the interests of all working people.

Obviously the Labour elite and their wealthy billionaire donor friends have a different idea. But they were very happy to encourage people to join, and they were even very happy to allow people who aren't even Labour Party members have a say, when they believed that it would work in their favour.

Suddenly becoming a genuine mass movement, something which the Labour Party once was, and which it should still be aspiring to be today, is a really bad idea.

That's the problem when you involve people - sometimes you can't control their opinions.

Obviously you would prefer that it once again became a small narrow clique. How do you propose to do that - through purges and expulsions? Forming your own small narrow easy-to-control party might be easier.

Misrepresented, eh?

I think it's probably fair to say that quite a few people think that binners has a point, ie, all the Tory supporters on here

Yeah, right. 🙄

Guess we've all been listening to the Corbyn Story:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07lw2kd

It is not someone's personal property. It was formed to represent trade unions in parliament, the clue is in the name. Today it exists to represent the interests of all working people.

Sorry, are you saying that it didn't represent the interests of all working people prior to 1983, when the electoral college was introduced?

Suddenly becoming a genuine mass movement, something which the Labour Party once was, and which it should still be aspiring to be today, is a really bad idea.

Again, if it was a successful mass movement in the past, when the PLP exclusively chose the leader, then what makes you think that it's got anything to do with a leadership selection system that was only introduced in 2014?

You can see why the PLP is worried....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/26/labour-as-far-behind-tories-under-jeremy-corbyn-as-when-michael/

[img] [/img]

Such a Golden Era for the British working class. I can fully understand why Jezza wants to take us back there. It was great, wasn't it?

Mr Woppit - Member

Misrepresented, eh?

"I think it's probably fair to say that quite a few people think that binners has a point, ie, all the Tory supporters on here"

Yeah, right. 🙄

What's the rolling eyes for Woppit - you think the Tory supporters on here don't agree with binners ?

Are you reading a different thread ?

binners - Member

[img] [/img]

Such a Golden Era for the British working class. I can fully understand why Jezza wants to take us back there. It was great, wasn't it?

And this is the man who repeatedly accuses others of engaging in "sixth form politics".

[i]"Oh I think I'll post a picture with a smartarse comment, that sounds grownup"[/i] 🙂

"Oh I think I'll post a picture with a smartarse comment, that sounds grownup"

outofbreath - Member

Guess we've all been listening to the Corbyn Story:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07lw2kd

"Tory supporters"

Question for everyone. I've always thought the Tory party didn't have as many "supporters" as some of the other parties.

By which I mean, Labour and the Greens are "movements". Many of their supporters support them like a football team or a religion. They feel loyalty, and they feel they're part of something.

I'm not sure the Tory Party has as much of that. I think the Tory Party is just a party you can vote for if they seem to have the right policies. When another party came along with 'better' policies, many more Tory voters would happily vote for the alternative without feeling they were betraying anything.

So, many Green Voters would identify themselves as "a green", I don't think as many people who voted Tory feel they're "a Tory".

Discuss.

Tory supporters are people who go out and vote Tory during elections, opinion pollsters tend to call them "Tory voters", I didn't think it was complicated.

The reason you don't see them is that they are already in control.
They don't need to protest, or make themselves visible - the country is already serving them.

It continued to serve them under Blair, so they didn't really need to make themselves known then either.

If Corbyn goes much further you can expect to see them raise their heads a bit more, but mostly it'll be the kind of behind-the-scenes manipulation that money does so well.

The Tory party had 3 million members in the 1950s and under Thatcher membership was still about 1 million. Now about 150,000 but I think there is a supporter option.

You not feelin' the 80's love comrade? Come on brother... join us!.... we're having a sit in in the common room! It's the future!

[img] [/img]

Tory supporters are people who go out and vote Tory during elections, opinion pollsters tend to call them "Tory voters", I didn't think it was complicated.

So does voting conservative taint you forever, are the floating voters impure?

Or just more tripe from the Croydon Communist

So does voting conservative taint you forever, are the floating voters impure?

Or just more tripe from the Croydon Communist

Floating voters are defined as such by pollsters,in the same way as they define Tory voters, Labour voters, SNP voters, etc.

BTW I like the [i]"more tripe from the Croydon Communist"[/i] very amusing. Although I have to say that you sound a little angry. Try not to read any more tripe?

Double post

mefty - Member

The Tory party had 3 million members in the 1950s and under Thatcher membership was still about 1 million. Now about 150,000 but I think there is a supporter option.

My understanding is that until fairly recently the Tory Party didn't issue membership cards as such, ie, you couldn't be a card-carrying party member. Instead you joined your local Conservative Party Association, which for many people represented more a social involvement rather than political activity.

I might not have got that entirely correct but it help would explain those dramatically high numbers in 50s, 60s, and 70s, and the relatively low figures today - I believe party membership cards are now issued.

Conservative Party has many activists and supporters including amongst the young. Political party membership has fallen across the board (prior to the £3 fiasco) as many people don't really see the point of being a member as everyone gets to vote and they are not interested in attending local meetings etc. Leafletting and other election work is done by volunteers who may or may not be party members

Ernie why don't you get your head round the fact that many "Tories" here are ex Labour voters. Ditto UKIP and the SNP. All these parties supporters are made up to a significant degree by ex-Labour voters. The SNP is a center-right party focused primarily on a single populist issue.

I'm liking ernie's new "trying to win the argument by ignoring the issue" tactic.

Doesn't mean the Labour Party hasn't screwed it's chances of being actually elected, though.

But then ernie doesn't want to deal with that, he's only interested in the hoo-hah inside the 6th form common room...

jambalaya - Member

Political party membership has fallen across the board (prior to the £3 fiasco)

The £3 fiasco, as you call it, has absolutely nothing at all to do with membership figures, I think you know that.

Btw you can join the Tory Party for as little as £5, if that's too much you become a supporter for £1.

And of course I can get my head round the fact that Tory supporters have in the past supported Blair/New Labour. Just look at Rupert Murdoch - you don't get much more right-wing and reactionary than him ffs.

Mr Woppit - Member

I'm liking ernie's new "trying to win the argument by ignoring the issue" tactic.

Don't lie, you don't like it at all, otherwise you wouldn't have mentioned it.

Nifty footwork.

Here's an indication of Corbyn's reliable judgement skills. This is what has happened to a whole country after being run by people who Corbyn has said, he admires...

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/venezuela-cross-border-buy-food-inflation-mismanagement-colombia-a7156711.html ]Buggered.[/url]

Ernie why don't you get your head round the fact that many "Tories" here are ex Labour voters

It is amusing to see ho many of you RW claim to have voted for Blair claim to have joined the labour party to vote for corbyn - whilst blaming "militants for entryism" even though he won the vote without their votes. Its also heartwarming to see how much you care about an effective left wing, sorry almost left of centre opposition to hold the govt, you just voted for, to account - whats up do you not even trust Tories.

Mr Woppit - Member

Nifty footwork.

He says before quickly trying to link Corbyn with the situation in Venezuela. 🙂

Anyway back on topic :

[url= http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/26/labour-mp-seema-malhotra-claim-corbyn-office-violation-not-rule-breach-speaker?CMP=share_btn_tw ]Alleged violation of Labour MP's office by Corbyn aide 'not a breach'[/url]

[b][i]Bercow said: “Having taken advice, I am satisfied that there is nothing in your letter or in the information subsequently elicited by the deputy serjeant at arms which would justify regarding these events as a possible breach.” [/i][/b]

This hasn't received quite the news coverage which the original story received. Time to move onto the next smear I guess.

Owen Smith is doing a campaign launch speech type thing. At Orgreave. It's on Five Live

Can I just check? We've not passed through a time portal back to 1983, have we? I'm expecting Cliff Richard to roller skate past me at any moment 😯

He says before quickly trying to link Corbyn with the situation in Venezuela

No ernie, that's an ACTUAL link, as in: People admired by Jeremy Corbyn bring an entire country to ruination.

7/10 for obfuscation, though.

"People admired by Jeremy Corbyn bring an entire country to ruination."

🙄 Perhaps best not to mention the assorted scum that various tories have admired over the years, then...

Obviously you want to use diversionary tactics and discuss Venezuela, I'm not going to get sucked into that. Besides, you are probably unaware that the opposition in Venezuela won a very large majority in the legislative elections last year and are no longer the opposition. And you are probably unaware of this in yesterday's news.

[url= http://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/Clinton-Emails-Reveal-Direct-US-Sabotage-of-Venezuela-20160726-0041.html ]Clinton Emails Reveal Direct US Sabotage of Venezuela[/url]

Obviously you want to use diversionary tactics and discuss Venezuela

Agree.

I'm not going to get sucked into that.

Very wise.

Besides, you are probably unaware that the opposition in Venezuela won a very large majority in the legislative elections last year and are no longer the opposition. And you are probably unaware of this in yesterday's news.

Clinton Emails Reveal Direct US Sabotage of Venezuela

Ahhh, that looks a little bit like being sucked into a diversion.....

Not really. I'm not going to argue about it 🙂

Woppit doesn't like that though, despite saying that he does.

Obviously you want to use diversionary tactics and discuss Venezuela, I'm not going to get sucked into that.

Says ernie, after trying a diversionary tactic to discuss Venezuela.

Nope. Quite happy to carry on discussing Corbyn's incompetencies.

Anyway..... whatsisface's speech....

Banker bashing? Tick. Workers rights? Tick.

Not very Blairite at all

It's almost as if the PLP have recognised they have to re-engage with a core vote, and move to the left on key issues, but not so far left that you're spouting CND stuff, and refusing to sing the national anthem.

Hmmmmmm...... there might be something in that

Maybe they could call it centre left or summink. New Old Labour?

Edit double post

[url= https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/309065744954580992?lang=en ]https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/309065744954580992?lang=en[/url]

A moron's idea of a genius.

Owen is realising that Corbyn/McDonnell policies haven't been widely broadcast in the midst of all the attacks, so is stating them as if he's invented them.
[img] [/img]

Clinton Emails Reveal Direct US Sabotage of Venezuela

The Scooby Doo Defence - the plan would have worked if it wasn't for you [s]pesky kids[/s] / a free press / Yankee Imperialism / Red Torys / voters.

What's wrong with refusing to sing the national anthem? It's a shit, awful dirge, about an unelected head of state who apparently enjoys the position by 'divine right'. And it's not very nice towards the Scots.

I admire anyone who refuses to sing it. And I think anyone who does sing it, is deluded and apparently happy to be subservient to an unelected leader. If they actually know the words, that is.