Yesterdays shooting & todays protest.

You need to link me doing that, Duckman. Withdrawing from an debate when when you’re getting insulted is not a flounce, it’s refusing to be a victim and thus depriving the bully of his satisfaction.

I’m still against face covering in public which is I assume what you are referring to, correct me if I’m wrong.

I’m all for republican values and the secular state so when a local preacher started handing out homophobic “Manif pour Tous” tracts outside my local school (same street) I went home, raided Madame’s wardrobe and went back to have debate with him (and thus distract him from handing out his tracts).

I was totally comfortable doing it as the guy was the same colour as me, similar age, same religion (if I have one) and male. Had he not been I’d have thought twice about challenging him because I’d have risked accusations of racism, being anti-religious or sexism – even though the focus of my intervention was the homophobic nature of his tracts. Because as Junki notes, even when your target has nothing to do with the sex, religion or ethnicity of your adversary you risk having the anti-religious, sexist or racist card pulled.

that’s a cool story bro….

but what relevance does your fascinating anecdote have to combating the (slightly) racist bile that gets spat all over the forum on a daily basis?

the (slightly) racist bile

How does that work?

How can you be “slightly” racist?

And if it’s only slight, then how could it be bile?

Racism: Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one’s own race is superior.

A lot of the stuff on here that is called racism by the hand wringers, never, ever, suggests that they are superior to another race of people.

It is pretty fundamental to the definition.

A lot of the stuff on here that is called racism by the hand wringers, never, ever, suggests that they are superior to another race of people.

It is pretty fundamental to the definition.

Just watch how much they jump up and down when someone points out that Muslim isn’t a race…

Is there any chance we could get back to talking about Bradford at some point?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>other threads

Well, this bit made me laugh, you’ve not quite grasped shorthand yet, have you?

😀

gobuchul, I agree.
But a focus on criticising the behaviour of one particular group, behaviour seemingly inherent in humanity regardless of race or religion, is indicative of the type of behaviour eloquently outlined in Yunki’s post.

The superiority is evident from the hypocricy, surely?

just lols 😆

hateful bastards with hateful agendas brought about by fear and cowardice and tempered with wilful ignorance

I’m afraid of spider bites, but if I spent a huge amount of my life raising awareness of dangerous spiders, and attributing all sorts of global issues to spiders, making up lies about spiders, trying to get people to be as scared of spiders as I am and imagining spiders are trying to take over the planet and destroy the human race people would think, quite rightly, that I had a bit of a phobia..

hateful bastards with hateful agendas

I agree, lefties really do hate anyone who dares disagree with them, don’t they?

😆

you’re a funny lil man

This thread must be a candidate for a “sticky” by now? 😉

Only in your trousers.

Some really interesting stuff in here worthy of a sensible discussion.

QED

So, enlighten us then.

The M62 shooting is such a simple story, containing so few facts, that people with an agenda have filled in the blanks for themselves.

The full truth may never emerge, because:

1. The family and friends of Yassar Yaqub can’t be trusted to give an honest account.

2. The police can’t be trusted to give an honest account.

But the truth doesn’t matter. Because right-wing authoritarians have already decided that Yassar Yaqub was a gangster, and that alone justifies his killing by the police at the side of a motorway.

Right-wing authoritarians must be delighted. The police have shown themselves to be tough on crime, they did NOT show preferential treatment to a Muslim, and they have sent out a “powerful message” to the criminal fraternity.

So guys, what are you still bitching about?

ninfan – Member

Just watch how much they jump up and down when……

I notice that you now repeatedly describe people who disagree with you as “jumping up and down”.

Is this your latest school yard taunt………it’s so hurtful! 🙂

I find your limited use of vocabulary when engaged in a debate with someone fascinating ninfan.

1. The family and friends of Yassar Yaqub can’t be trusted to give an honest account.
2. The police can’t be trusted to give an honest account.

Sounds like a case for Jeremy Kyle.

I’m not particularly interested in the arguments going on in this thread, nor do I have any opinion yet on this incident, since the accounts and explanations of what happened have not been made public yet.

But something that seems to be becoming more widely recognised, particularly in the context of police shootings (UK and elsewhere), and might be interesting to some, is the idea of unconscious bias. It’s something I was unaware of until after Mark Duggan was shot by the police. There are plenty of articles about it, this is just one.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/11/science-of-racism-prejudice

It’s quite interesting, if you like understanding how things work.

I think the Police will find it very difficult to be anything other than honest, to be fair.

I have no idea what happened.

But if it means we have a bit more focus on the extent of the heroin trade locally and nationally then some good may come out of it all.

And we did have genuine riots a few years ago.
Hopefully we’ve moved on a bit since then.
The comparative lack of focus on race in the media seems to reflect the feelings of most people I’ve spoken to.

You’ll always get people who focus unecessarily on one thing, but everyone else just gets on with their lives.

I think the Police will find it very difficult to be anything other than honest.

You don’t have to do much googling to realise that the opposite is the case, unfortunately.

I’m an optimist.
🙂

It’s a sad thing that someone has been killed & It’s just as sad that it won’t stop anyone else dealing drugs (If that is indeed what the deceased was)
There’ll be some happy drug dealers who’ve already taken over his customers.

thegreatape – Member

But something that seems to be becoming more widely recognised, particularly in the context of police shootings (UK and elsewhere), and might be interesting to some, is the idea of unconscious bias.

Macpherson made that point in his 1999 report into the Met when he described institutional racism as :

“The collective failure of an organisation to provide an appropriate and professional service to people because of their colour, culture, or ethnic origin. It can be seen or detected in processes, attitudes and behaviour which amount to discrimination through unwitting prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness and racist stereotyping which disadvantage minority ethnic people.”

Note “through unwitting prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness and racist stereotyping”.

I have no doubt at all that UK policing has improved massively in that respect since the Stephen Lawrence tragedy. But it would be foolish to assume that all cases of unwitting prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness and racist stereotyping, no longer occur within UK police forces.

esselgruntfuttock – Member

It’s a sad thing that someone has been killed & It’s just as sad that it won’t stop anyone else dealing drugs (If that is indeed what the deceased was)
There’ll be some happy drug dealers who’ve already taken over his customers.

Good point well said.

I think this racism argument is gonna come up again and again and here’s why…..

That’s possibly the most insightful thing you’ve ever posted on here. Well said.

But it would be foolish to assume that all cases of unwitting prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness and racist stereotyping, no longer occur within UK police forces.

Indeed – only a fool would think that. While there have been improvements within the police about understanding and reducing conscious prejudice over the last 15-20 years, I’m not sure that the presence of unconscious bias – being subconsciously prejudiced even when consciously resolved not to be – is particularly well understood or appreciated, certainly not at a grassroots level anyway.