Pinion E-Drive

Pinion E-Drive System: E-Bike Gearbox Motor

by 68

Pinion have crammed a motor into the gearbox. Here’s details of the Pinion E-Drive System AKA Pinion Motor.Gearbox.Unit (MGU).

Pinion E-Drive
Pinion E-Drive

TLDR: Pinion E-Drive System

  • 85Nm (but “in the first four gears, the MGU delivers up to 160 Nm of torque to the rear wheel”)
  • 600 watts peak power
  • Max. support up to 400%
  • Four riding modes (Eco, Fly, Flow, Flex)
  • Batteries: ‘Ultracore’ 470, 720 and 960
  • Range extender option
  • 9 or 12 gears (E1.9 and E1.12 respectively)
  • Up to 600% gear range
  • “From 9th gear onwards the system is almost silent”
  • Electric shifting
  • Semi-automatic shifting options
  • “Smart.Shift System can shift while riding, while being stationary and under load! It can shift for you, it can shift manually, it can instantly shift multiple gears at once and it’s virtually maintenance free.”
  • Sealed against water and dirt
  • OIl change every 10,000km
  • No derailleur, no cassette, no chain (it’s belt drive)
  • Greatly reduced unsprung mass (more than 500g lighter at rear wheel)
  • Made in Germany
The ‘S’ suffixed motors are Speed Pedelecs

Pinion press release in full:

WORLD’S FIRST. MOTOR AND GEARBOX. FINALLY UNITED.

The drivetrain is the heart of an e-bike. Until now, this has consisted of two separate systems – a gearshift and a motor, which usually come from different manufacturers and yet somehow have to work together. The consequences are bad shifting performance, high wear, followed by high maintenance with enormous costs. The Pinion Motor.Gearbox.Unit (MGU) is here to change that.

Pinion brings together what belongs together. The Pinion MGU is the e-bike technology of the next generation – because it combines motor and gearshift into one unit. It combines a powerful electric motor with proven Pinion gearbox technology and electric shifting of up to 12 gears in a compact package to create a completely new drive system for e-bikes. Motor and gearbox are optimally matched and work together like never before. Pinion motor-gearbox units offer durable shifting and motor performance at the highest level. Designed to work worry-free and reliably, with no significant wear and minimal maintenance. One oil change every 10,000 km! That’s it!

As a world first, the Pinion E-Drive System with its core Motor.Gearbox.Unit (MGU) will be presented to the public for the first time at Eurobike 2023. The following launch partner brands are offering e-bikes with the Pinion E-Drive System in various categories for the 2024 model year: Rotwild, Simplon and Bulls are launching unique E-MTBs with perfectly balanced weight distribution and impressive performance. Kettler, Flyer, Tout Terrain, Pegasus, Zemo and I:SY will offer e-trekking bikes, e- cargo bikes as well as e-compact bikes. Speed pedelecs with Pinion E-LINES series MGUs are in the lineup of various brands

THE HEART OF THE SYSTEM – THE PINION MGU

The Pinion MGU combines a wear-free electric motor and the innovative Pinion gearbox with 9 or 12 gears in a compact all- in-one package of comparable size and weight to current mid-mounted motors with separate gear shifting. Controlled by electric shifting and powered by Pinion’s own hardware and software, the Pinion MGU is the heart of a completely new drive system for e-bikes.

The internal development of all integrated electronic components is the key to ensuring that all parts of the system work together as one unit to deliver lightning-fast, crisp shifting in all situations and on all terrain. The Pinion MGU operates reliably over the long term with no significant wear. The MGU is located centrally and low in the bottom bracket area, resulting in optimal weight distribution of the e-bike. The elimination of the external rear derailleur and cassette is also accompanied by drastically reduced maintenance. An MGU and its integrated shifting technology operates virtually wear-free and requires nothing more than an oil change every 10,000 kilometers. In addition, the system significantly reduces the unsprung mass at the rear wheel, which results in better suspension performance and ultimately leads to greater comfort and traction.

The roots of the motor inside the Pinion MGU is a state-of-the-art e-machine for industrial applications, manufactured in Germany and redesigned for use in an e-bike. The motor offers extremely high efficiency and a highly dynamic power density without sacrificing shifting performance.

All MGU versions are based on 48 volt technology and offer approximately 85 Nm of torque compared to conventional motors without integrated gearbox. However, due to the integrated gearbox, the output shaft values are not directly comparable with those of ordinary mid-motors. In the first four gears, the MGU delivers up to 160 Nm of torque to the rear wheel. The peak power is 600 watts, and 800 watts for the S-pedelec versions. The maximum support is up to 400%, and that at a permissible input torque of up to 250 Nm.

Thanks to its operational design, a Pinion gearbox offers more reliable shifting than conventional bicycle derailleurs and is far better equipped to handle the high loads imposed by an e-bike motor. Proven for more than a decade and used by over 100 bicycle manufacturers, the technology is reliable, durable and needs extremely low maintenance. There is no rear derailleur that can get out of line or break off. In addition, gearboxes are sealed against water and dirt. Based on proven automotive gearbox technology, Pinion gearboxes rely on highly efficient spur gearing with two sets of gears connected in series. Depending on the configuration, the gearbox offers 9 or 12 speed in the MGU with an unmatched range of up to 600%.

Using a modular approach towards designing the Pinion E-Drive System allowed Pinion to develop several distinct configurations and versions of the MGU. Depending on the individual use-case, each version has either 9 or 12 gears and is actuated by electric shifting. Furthermore, the software of the system comes in two distinct base tunes – ‘Comfort’ for efficient and harmonic commuting as well as reliable long-distance touring and ‘Performance’ for super-agile off-road riding. An additional dedicated version for Speed-Pedelecs rounds out the offer. Each version comes with a different motor and gearbox configuration featuring individual tunes and settings perfectly tailored to the intended use. MGUs are available in the Pinion E-Line, as E1.12 and E1.9 versions and as E-Speed versions E1.12S and E1.9S.

SEMI-AUTOMATIC ELECTRIC SHIFTING WITH PINION SMART.SHIFT FUNCTIONALITY

Next to offering near-instant engagement at the pedals and an natural ride-feel thanks to the motor and gearbox working in harmony, the Pinion E-Drive System also includes semi-automatic shifting capability. Pre.Select allows the system to automatically shift into the perfect gear for the bike’s speed when coasting downhill, providing the rider with the right gear to get back onto the pedals without having to frantically shift up or down first. And then there is Start.Select. When, for example, a cyclist stops at a traffic light, the MGU can automatically shift into a preselected starting gear. The days of awkwardly trying to get the bike going in the wrong gear are officially over. The MGU and its Smart.Shift System can shift while riding, while being stationary and under load. It can shift for its rider, it can shift manually, it can instantly shift multiple gears at once and its virtually maintenance free.

HMI AND SYSTEMINTEGRATION

Thanks to FIT as a system integration partner, the Pinion E-Drive System offers bicycle manufacturers a high degree of modularity as well as a proven and reliable service infrastructure. The FIT ecosystem offers various interfaces, displays and batteries that can be combined in a variety of ways to create a customized e-bike tailored to the specific application. With a focus on connectivity and individual ease of use, the FIT E-Bike Control App allows the pre-configured MGU setups of all support modes to be customized according to personal preferences.

MADE IN GERMANY

All Pinion units are developed in Germany and assembled at the company’s headquarters near Stuttgart by experienced employees. After completion, each MGU passes an extensive “end-of-line” test run. Here, the quality, functionality and load resistance of the motor-gearbox units are ensured before delivery. The majority of all components belonging to the MGU; from the electric motor to the gearbox and gearing components are produced by our qualified partners in Germany and other European countries. The Pinion MGU project is funded by the German Federal Ministry of Economics and Climate Protection on the basis of a resolution of the German Bundestag.

pinion.eu


Home Forums Pinion E-Drive System: E-Bike Gearbox Motor

  • This topic has 68 replies, 38 voices, and was last updated 1 year ago by b33k34.
Viewing 28 posts - 41 through 68 (of 68 total)
  • Pinion E-Drive System: E-Bike Gearbox Motor
  • aldo56
    Free Member

    You can still use tensioner for a belt system.

    Geometron / Nicolai used this on their pinion gearbox  G16. Someone local to me had one and I’m told the belt lasts ages and requires no looking after.

    tomhoward
    Full Member

    As do Zerode

    BruceWee
    Free Member

    Would a belt limit the suspension design as it would be more diffficult to resolve chain growth/shrinkage with a tensioner as the shock moved through its stroke?

    Another reason to use a jack-shaft, I reckon.  Put the pivot wherever you want and keep the belt path simple.  Might need some sort of EBB at the pivot to correctly tension the Pinion to pivot belt which might be a bit complicated though…

    FunkyDunc
    Free Member

    Is this why Shimano have gone live with an auto shift ebike groupset, because they can not compete with this?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZ2MS1GTpag

    Scienceofficer
    Free Member

    I’d take that range in a heartbeat.

    aldo56
    Free Member

    I also have no interest in e bikes but this is a super cool development. The rear suspension must be buttery and one less thing to smash off of a rock. You would imagine much less servicing required, especially with a belt.

    One step closer to a motorcross bikes…

    stevextc
    Free Member

    BruceWee

    Hold off a few years and see what their reliability and warranty policy is like, would be my thinking.

    Or wait for their warranty policy….

    My hunch is the service and warranty on something they make themselves in Germany will be A1. The Q might be about which parts are user-serviceable or replaceable, but with a customer base in durability-minded riders already I’d be amazed if they hadn’t designed this to take a chunk of market share by addressing the patchy rep or warranty concerns some other systems have.

    I was watching the interview with Rob (rides eMTB) and they very specifically steer away … they pre-empted by saying “The thing most of your viewers will ask” and then started talking about weight not warranty!!!

    They aren’t making the motor and he keeps mentioning 10’s of thousands of km… and though their existing customer base might be durability minded their new one is “disposable bike” minded.

    He managers to slip in a few lies on maintenance as well… saying the only maintenance is an oil change “like suspension”… conveniently “forgetting” suspension also needs seals replaced.

    Given this is a lot more complex and involves electronics and eggs in baskets I’d want to see spares and such available from them. It remains to be seen of they offer the same warranty as the gear boxes or less.

    “To activate the 5-year warranty on your Pinion P-Line, register the gearbox on our website.

    Proof of an annual oil change is a prerequisite for any warranty claims. Service is documented on the warranty card that accompanies the gearbox and is included in your user manual.”

    b33k34
    Full Member

    @tomhoward a very long wait I think

    *waits patiently for the electric shifting gubbins to be retrofitted to existing c1.12 gearboxes.

    SMART.SHIFT GEARBOX
    Pinion Smart.Shift gearboxes differ from the P and C line gearboxes in their internal structure. The shifting mechanisms and sensor technology are the main differences. Smart.Shift gearboxes are based on the C-line and are marked with an „i“. (C1.12i, C1.9i, C1.6i).

    Smartshift

    b33k34
    Full Member


    @stevextc

    He managers to slip in a few lies on maintenance as well… saying the only maintenance is an oil change “like suspension”… conveniently “forgetting” suspension also needs seals replaced.

    Given this is a lot more complex and involves electronics and eggs in baskets I’d want to see spares and such available from them. It remains to be seen of they offer the same warranty as the gear boxes or less.

    As far as I’m aware there are no ‘service’ items on e bike motors – you run them until they break and then either get them fixed or replaced.

    As an ex owner of a Pinion (and Rohloffs) the oil change is a simple cheap process. Seal replacement is likely to be a factory/distributor job but based on what I’ve seen that might be an 10 yearly job rather than annual. (there was someone on here who managed to wreck a few Rohloffs but that was repeated total immersion in deep water.

    I reckon their gearbox tech (and sealing) is well proven. The unknowns are around the motor and electrical systems through the bike (eg I’ve seen specialized bikes have issues with water getting into the top tube display/controls)

    Scienceofficer
    Free Member

    Or wait for their warranty policy….

    2 years on the Pinion website.

    tomhoward
    Full Member

    @b33k34, if you follow their insta comments, and I do, there’s a lot of hinting that it’s coming in the future.

    Whether they mean it’s a new GB with a stand-alone battery remains to be seen.


    @chipps
    be a dear and probe them at eurobike? Pretty please 😊

    1
    BruceWee
    Free Member

    Or wait for their warranty policy….

    I think we all know that a company’s stated policy and what they provide in reality are often two very different things.  Just search ‘Giant warranty’ on this forum for some recent examples.

    Saying that, this can go both ways and many companies will often go beyond their stated warranty policy.

    Trouble is, you don’t know what it’s like until a couple of years after the first units have been sold.

    1
    tomhoward
    Full Member

    In fairness, I’ve heard nothing but good things about pinions gearbox warranty. Lots of ‘it’s not covered by warranty but send it back and we’ll have a look’ only for a fully refurbished gearbox to be returned, FOC.

    stevextc
    Free Member

    Or wait for their warranty policy….

    2 years on the Pinion website.

    I must have missed that (or its new).
    I can only find the gearbox warranty.
    Seems like a gap between that and

    The Pinion E-Drive System is therefore extremely durable whilst wear on the drive system is extremely low due to the elimination of external shifting components. The maintenance interval? A 10-minute oil-change after 10.000km. That’s it. Really.

    BruceWee
    Free Member

    In fairness, I’ve heard nothing but good things about pinions gearbox warranty. Lots of ‘it’s not covered by warranty but send it back and we’ll have a look’ only for a fully refurbished gearbox to be returned, FOC.

    Yeah, if they can combine a genuinely superior product with ‘above and beyond’ levels of support then they could end up cornering the entire market.

    Edit: depending on the price, of course 🙂

    stevextc
    Free Member

    BruceWee

    I think we all know that a company’s stated policy and what they provide in reality are often two very different things. Just search ‘Giant warranty’ on this forum for some recent examples.

    Saying that, this can go both ways and many companies will often go beyond their stated warranty policy.

    Trouble is, you don’t know what it’s like until a couple of years after the first units have been sold.

    I am confident they will exceed the low bar set by Giant but whilst I’m sure it will be mechanically sound the electronics and sensors are another thing. This is the main end-of-life in other eMTB motors (bearings and stuff can usually be sourced and changed … )

    Even if they can survive financially if they end up with a high failure rate there is still the supply issue and not having a bike until its done. This pretty much seems to be what has caught out other motor manufacturers.

    It seems to me like they are combining (in a sealed non serviceable box) the most reliable and least reliable things in MTB.

    I still find it disturbing in the interview he doesn’t acknowledge proper (full) suspension servicing rather dismisses it as an oil change.

    tjagain
    Full Member

    Imo ime fork seals only need to be changed when leaking ie repair.  I’ve never had any leak and have always just changed the oil in forks.

    Multiple forks over many years with annual oil changes

    stevextc
    Free Member

    tjagain

    Imo ime fork seals only need to be changed when leaking ie repair. I’ve never had any leak and have always just changed the oil in forks.

    Multiple forks over many years with annual oil changes

    I’ve got 4 sets of 2015 forks that have been mainly oil changes (technically 3 since last week when I gave a set away to a friend) and whilst I say “mainly” they have all been fully rebuilt once or twice.

    I personally do mostly oil changes (warranty however requires sticking to the service schedule)… unless seals are damaged but the differences are

    1/ it is because I can take the fork apart and actually check and not void my warranty AND
    2/ I can buy service items (new seals).
    3/ I can buy assemblies (from CSU to lowers to dampers) should it be damaged beyond the above
    4) I can stick a fork on from ANY manufacturer into a “mount” (headset) that is standard. should damage be beyond the above

    So whilst I’m confident pinion can make a long lasting gearbox… I’m far from confident about the electronics and sensors as no-one else has managed this in a MTB environment. When (not if) the motor fails you’re totally screwed short of buying a new motor (assuming you can). You can’t even as far as I can see keep using the gearbox unassisted … or rip the whole thing out and stick on a rear mech and shifters…

    It’s a combination of the least and most reliable parts in MTB all stuck together in a non serviceable unit only directly replaceable with the same.

    monkeyboyjc
    Full Member

    If your wondering how it rides around a carpark…

    The auto shift seems to be great for commuters and shoppers, also love the auto shift to 4th gear when stopped. Remains to be seen how it’ll cope on a tech climb.

    2
    a11y
    Full Member

    Nicolai released info on their Saturn 16 with Pinion MGU earlier – intriguing. Not really a looker but if it combines a motor, a gearbox and a Nicolai frame with decent (for me) geometry, then I don’t care what it looks like.

    MGU1

    MGU2

    MGU3

     

    joefm
    Full Member

    want!

    welshfarmer
    Full Member

    “Not really a looker …..” ???

    To me that is a fine looking bike. If it wasn’t going to cost the thick end of 10 (i’m m aking an educated guess!) then I would consider it for sure

    Rubber_Buccaneer
    Full Member

    It’s ugly but I trust Nicolai to make a bike that functions well so I’ll take one in plain black please.  Except the price, it’s going to be ‘ow much!!’ isn’t it.

    desperatebicycle
    Full Member

    As far as ebikes go, I think that looks pretty cool. As far as pricing goes (suggests €11,000 on facebook) I’ll never be able to buy one! Well, maybe I could afford it, but I just wouldn’t.

    mashr
    Full Member

    The top tube lining up with the seat stays helps it a lot… then you get to the headtube. OTOH the headtube looks a decent length so it might even get off the hook there too. Will gloss over having to re-mortgage the house to get one, otherwise I’d ride it

    a11y
    Full Member

    “Not really a looker …..” ???

    To me that is a fine looking bike. If it wasn’t going to cost the thick end of 10 (i’m m aking an educated guess!) then I would consider it for sure

    I was anticipating the common opinion on here of Nicolai’s looking a bit challenging, nto that I agree. I think it looks fine, as fdar as ebikes go.

    alpin
    Free Member

    Saw that Nicolai in a shop here in Italy the other week. Bugger me it was heavy!

    Zero interest in e-MTBs, but fast Pinion motor would be great on a cargo bike like my Bullit.

    b33k34
    Full Member

    I used to import Nicolai and have always loved the functional aesthetic but the seat tower on that is really fugly and the head tube isn’t much better.

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