Labour Party problems

Jeremy Corbyn supporters celebrate emergence of new thing to blame for his lack of success

What is cowardly though is not putting themselves up for a byelection.

The accuracy of the label isn’t the point. The point is that if a party is accused of being abusive then responding to that accusation with abuse confirms the point.

If the tweet had said “We respect these MPs but we dispute what they said” then people will think “Labour doesn’t seem that abusive to me, maybe the accusation is false.”.

You don’t need to be some cunning Blairite spin doctor to work this stuff out.

Lammy is on LBC today, handling this very well, as he so often seems to be able to do.

Goodness me!

If you want an example of UK electoral law loopholes: The Independent Group, which looks/swims/quacks a lot like a political party and is asking for donations, is actually a private company. So it isn't subject to electoral law rules requiring them to declare financial backers.

— Jim Waterson (@jimwaterson) February 18, 2019

and to think, they chose the very day that a Commons Committee report into Cambridge Analytica and Facebook was published… 🤔

Here’s the @CommonsCMS report. #CambridgeAnalytica https://t.co/5Q2bKypPXC

— David Carroll (@profcarroll) February 18, 2019

Registering is optional. …and unless you plan to fight an election as a party there’s no point anyway. Plenty of time to register if this “thing” takes off and it might not/probably won’t take off.

Registration of a political party is not compulsory and you can
only apply to register a party if you have an intention to contest
elections. Independent candidates can contest elections
without a party being registered.
The main benefit of registering is that your party name,
description and emblem can appear on the ballot papers.

http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0004/107680/intro-registration-rp.pdf

I do hope they’ll demonstrate the courage of their convictions by standing for election, seeing as they’re so keen on a second referendum.

Why is JC calling on them to submit to by-elections?

Surely he is on the verge of forcing a GE?

I’m not sure how many Labour MPs are facing deselection, I don’t really believe the reports of 100, but say it were fifty. You’d have to assume that all of them would jump before pushed and join the “independent group”. The party would want to avoid having 50 odd mps on the sidelines and voting with a ‘Remain’ agenda. So a disgruntled remain MPs club might help some moderates avoid deselection…

Why is JC calling on them to submit to by-elections?

So he can replace them with Leavers. They’d be mad to do that their votes are important in the next month or so.

After the SDP split tho, Foot resigned & LAbour dropped their anti EEC & nuclear dissarmamnet policies, but the SDP MPs never returned.

That’s not quite what happened: The Limehouse Declaration was January 1981. Foot resigned (and Labour dropped their anti-EU stance) following their disastrous showing in the 1983 General Election. They still had unilateral nuclear disarmament as policy when they fought the 1987 election. While you could argue that the dismal Labour performance in 1983 was in part due to the SDP, the dropping of those policies (and leader) were very much not a direct response to the split itself.

At least 5 of the 28 Labour MPs who defected to the SDP eventually rejoined the Labour Party, although not as MPs, just as party members.

For me this is the inevitable result of having a totalitarian Leader like Corbyn in charge of Labour, he’s already shown that he will attempt to purge anyone who doesn’t sing his Hard-Left, Protectionist hymn sheet.

There’s a huge vacuum in politics for someone to represent, the now, majority of people who want to remain in the EU, the Lib Dems are still tainted by their time in Government.

Centrist Labour voters like me don’t want a return to 70s by “rebalancing” our economy to that of an emerging nation under the myth that you can have a weak currency and “strong wages” because history and basic economic understanding tells you, you can’t.

My local Labour MP is often at odds with Labour over Brexit and is calling for a 2nd vote, I hope she’ll jump ship too.

For me this is the inevitable result of having a totalitarian Leader like Corbyn

First a terrorist supporter, then a racist, now a totalitarian. Have you been reading the sun recently?

@jivehoneyjive – Gavin Shuker was on the radio and was asked about the “private company”. His answer: “Yes, the one director is me. You have to have something along those lines under electoral rules and in the time available that was the easiest option.”

File under “Nothing to see here”.

First a terrorist supporter, then a racist, now a totalitarian. Have you been reading the sun recently?

Not a terrorist supporter, but y’know, happy to hang out with whoever fitted when it was lefty chique to say we should talk with freedom fighters, but then happy to watch a peace negotiated and enabled (chiefly) by his own party be endangered by a Brexit that very few of its members (appear to) support. So, terrorist supporter? No. Complacent and hypocritical when it suits, yes.

Mostly though, the labour party leadership is being shown up again as incompetent. Parties do not fall apart under competent leadership.

And if you can find a word to describe Corbyn, Milne and MacDonnell’s leadership that works better than “totalitarian”, I feel that that’s a bit strong too, what would it be?

You’re right Daz. Theres nothing remotely totalitarian about making all your MP’s sign a ‘Loyalty Pledge’ to the glorious leader, is there?

Jeremy Corbyn demanding Loyalty? in writing?! You really couldn’t make it up?

It did scupper another thing often said about him though… that he hasn’t got a sense of humour

This must make running a GE very tempting to May.

She could end up with a proper majority.

with depressing predicatblity the likes of Len McCklusky have come out & attacked them personally.

Youd hope that somewhere in the labour leadership, thered be a bit of soul searching & reflection to wonder whether there are problems with the way the party has handled some key issues.

The abuse machine is up and running.

Theres nothing remotely totalitarian about making all your MP’s sign a ‘Loyalty Pledge’ to the glorious leader, is there?

Sorry you will need to help me here.
Why is an (admittedly stupid) loyalty oath proposed by a random activist website and not pushed by the whips a sign of a totalitarian leader?
What is a tad more totalitarian is tactics such as parachuting candidates into areas and blocking the local constituencies from choosing their own candidates. Or trying to force existing MPs to be deselected via the NEC.

Bit of a damp squib- The way its been hyped I was expecting Blair to gallop into the commons on a white horse draped in EU colours (conveniently blue) And for him to collect front bench heads on the end of his lance whilst the all the back benchers cheered.

Also why dont they join the lib dems? Its got all they want.

Why is an (admittedly stupid) loyalty oath proposed by a random activist website and not pushed by the whips a sign of a totalitarian leader?

Because it allows people who have never accepted Corbyn as leader to abuse him while complaining about abuse when it’s aimed elsewhere. I suppose that if you can’t get the result you want via democratic means, then the next step is to support the sabotage of the party you claimed to care about.

Evidently, rank hypocrisy doesn’t bother them.

You’re right Daz. Theres nothing remotely totalitarian about making all your MP’s sign a ‘Loyalty Pledge’ to the glorious leader, is there?

Or deciding that a vote of no-confidence lost 174-40 doesn’t count, because it doesn’t. He’d rather force 23 of his shadow cabinet ‘resign’ (out of 31) for not being loyal enough to the cause.

In reality they should have left many years ago. Anybody that thinks Corbyn is hard left is not someone who should be a Labour MP. Why are they not already in the Liberal party as would seem a better fit?

Hard-Left, Protectionist hymn sheet.

Can you provide some examples of “Hard-Left” so I can try and understand what leads to people thinking this?

Evidently, rank hypocrisy doesn’t bother them.

Like the rank hypocrisy of claiming to democratise a party, while ignoring the parties wishes. Or are there still some deluded followers who believe that St Jeremy will throw his weight behind a second referendum if they can’t secure a GE, because in case you haven’t noticed he has failed to secure a GE.

Of course outmanouvering the party at conference has been perhaps his smartest bit of politicking, but is is also as you say “rank hypocrisy” and treacherous.

Why are they not already in the Liberal party as would seem a better fit?

The libs are too left wing for Chuka.

Theres nothing remotely totalitarian about making all your MP’s sign a ‘Loyalty Pledge’ to the glorious leader, is there?

“I pledge to work for the achievement of a Labour led Government under whatever leadership members elect. And I accept a Labour led government is infinitely better than any other election outcome.”

How is the above either a personal pledge of loyalty to Corbyn, or in any way controversial to a labour MP? I would have though that it’s the absolute bare minimum of what should be expected of them? If they don’t like it they can easily stand as independents. What is sad is that some feel a pledge like this is necessary because the actions of their colleagues are casting doubt in the minds of the voters as to what a labour MP should be doing.

First a terrorist supporter, then a racist, now a totalitarian. Have you been reading the sun recently?

Yeah but – Tesco beans.

You’re right Daz. Theres nothing remotely totalitarian about making all your MP’s sign a ‘Loyalty Pledge’ to the glorious leader, is there?

Fake news. There was no such “oath”. It was a pledge to support Labour, not Corbyn.

Why didn’t Corbyn leave throughout the Blair/Brown years? Why didn’t Skinner leave? When the party wasn’t left enough for them?

Surely the Socialist Workers Party would have been a better fit?

Like the rank hypocrisy of claiming to democratise a party, while ignoring the parties wishes. Or are there still some deluded followers who believe that St Jeremy will throw his weight behind a second referendum if they can’t secure a GE, because in case you haven’t noticed he has failed to secure a GE.

I see. So your accusation is based upon what Corbyn may do or not do, rather than what he has done, i.e. follow party policy. Thanks for clearing that up.

Or deciding that a vote of no-confidence lost 174-40 doesn’t count

So what you are saying is the general party members should have been ignored in favour of the party elite. Starting to sound a tad totalitarian here.

He’d rather force 23 of his shadow cabinet ‘resign’

what? Seriously why dont you just claim he bites the heads of kittens or something?

You don’t think that the very existence of ‘Loyalty oaths’ are a bit….you know…..

Why didn’t Corbyn leave throughout the Blair/Brown years? Why didn’t Skinner leave? When the party wasn’t left enough for them?

You’d have to ask them. It’s possible that they didn’t wish to give up a life-long commitment to the Labour movement because they happened to disagree with the then leader.

Surely the Socialist Workers Party would have been a better fit?

On what basis?

You don’t think that the very existence of ‘Loyalty oaths’ are a bit….you know….

Absolutely, but seeing as the labour leadership never asked for one it’s a moot issue. I do however see working for the achievement of a labour government as opposed to a tory one a simple basic requirement of being a labour MP. It’s amazing some think this is an unacceptable ask.

You don’t think that the very existence of ‘Loyalty oaths’ are a bit

Good to see you going for an inane photo rather than addressing the couple of minor flaws in your claim. Lets quote you again.

Theres nothing remotely totalitarian about making all your MP’s sign a ‘Loyalty Pledge’ to the glorious leader, is there?

So rather than just using a photo and hope people will forget do you or do not stand by it.
Bearing in mind the flaws in it including:
It references the party not the “glorious leader”.
There is no requirement to sign it
It was done by a third party website and not central office.

It references the party not the “glorious leader”.
There is no requirement to sign it
It was done by a third party website and not central office.

Yes, but apart from that, binners was 100% correct.

Anyway, the 7 Dwarves didn’t last long. Angela Smith will have to be expelled following her reference to people “with a funny tinge” this lunchtime. Or is that JC’s fault as well?

It’s possible that they didn’t wish to give up a life-long commitment to the Labour movement because they happened to disagree with the then leader.

Yes, I suppose that’s possible. It’s easy putting one’s principles to bed for a few years isn’t it – it’s a commitment by some and hypocrisy by others.

It’s easy putting one’s principles to bed for a few years isn’t it – it’s a commitment by some and hypocrisy by others.

Yes, that’s why Corbyn fell into line and voted for the Iraq war.

Reg demands your loyalty!

Yep. Another dumb picture.

Yes, but apart from that, binners was 100% correct.

You will note that being completely undone by the facts hasn’t got in the way of binnersbot posting one of his small stock of pictures.