Jeremy Corbyn

They’ve even got a song

kelvin
Full Member
Dynamic…

😆

I didn’t even last 20 seconds. Does he say “Strong emphasis here!” at any point?

Time to turn this into a “Jeremy Corbyn was right” thread…?

I’l start us off…

"The government seems complacent"

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn says he has written a letter to the prime minister asking why advice on coronavirus "is different to that given in almost every other European country"https://t.co/FzdphI1mdR pic.twitter.com/73NLoYmDKR

— BBC Politics (@BBCPolitics) March 15, 2020

Time to turn this into a “Jeremy Corbyn was right” thread…?

He was right about most things. But boo! hiss! he’s a dirty racist! etc…. 🙄

Binners is on the Cummings thread saying we need to reform the system which is what Corbyn and McDonnell were planning to do. It’s very weird.

But boo! hiss! he’s a dirty racist! etc

said no one. He was incompetent as leader of a political party. Not everything he ever said or did was wrong. My issue wasn’t with corbybism wetf that is. It was with Corbyn. Anyway, only replying because this thread is up at the top here. Let it quietly die.

said no one.

Yup, I believe that Margret Hodges called him a “**** racist”, not a dirty racist.

said no one. He was incompetent as leader of a political party.

Yep. And if you want to go back and see what people were saying, I was saying we should close borders and lockdown back when we had 9 cases in February 2020. Admittedly I didn’t get a slot on the news.

I believe that Margret Hodges called him a “**** racist”, not a dirty racist.

I believe that children are the future….

Sorry. Losing it here. Not on this thread she didn’t which is what dazh refers to.

Yup, I believe that Margret Hodges called him a “**** racist”, not a dirty racist.

Is that the same Margaret Hodge who enjoys wealth and privilege as a result of her family owning a steel company which made millions in apartheid South Africa, from the brutal racist exploitation of black people? Oh, it is. Is that the same Margaret Hodge who promised homes for ‘indigenous people’ when pandering to the kind of people who voted for the BNP? Oh, it is. How inconvenient…

I dunno… I try to be positive… and off they go…

 I try to be positive…

There’s nothing positive in regards to Corbyn. He’s a decent man who was destroyed by people who should have been supporting him. People say he was an incompetent leader or flawed character, and that may be the case if you define a good leader as someone who is ruthlessly focused on their own ambition and willing to manipulate others to achieve that. But just think for a second of the possibilities of having a leader/PM who shows compassion and empathy for people at the bottom, and who recognises the injustices and unfairness wired into our society. We’ve never had a PM like that, and I now doubt we ever will. Corbyn was a massive missed opportunity, and instead we went down the road of populism, division, selfishness and apathy. It’s tragic really.

I was going to do trains next. Universal broadband (in relation to education) after that. But hey, if you can’t say something good about the man, without setting off the ranting… I’ll leave it.

I was going to do trains next.

Corbyn’s greatest  (and unwitting) achievement was exposing the right wing of the labour party for the cowardly, craven, power hungry and venal bunch of arse****s that they are. It’s not an accident that they’re tanking in the polls

 He’s a decent man who was destroyed by people who should have been supporting him

Alternatively; he was and has returned to being a serial rebel that showed no loyalty to any party leadership before, and perhaps unsurprisingly others felt unable to show loyalty towards him when he was leader?

But just think for a second of the possibilities of having a leader/PM who shows compassion and empathy

But undoubtedly this was not enough appeal; given his cultural identity as a left-wing metropolitan liberal representing a ‘comfortable’  North London constituency, allegedly ‘a world away’ from the concerns of most uncommitted Labour voters.

For me, Corbyn’s “failure” was his lack of commitment to the ambitious of leadership and governorship, and that ambiguity and the lack of engaging in the day to day business of politics…ie a lack of cohesion, visibility, and adaptability ultimately provided uncommitted Labour support with a reason not to vote for him. You can spread the blame around (and I’m sure it will continue) BUT at the end of the day, Corbyn tried to re-create the Labour party rather than lead the party he inherited, and folk can argue the toss about whether that was the right thing to do, but the outcome of that struggle between principle and power was already played out in the 80’s and it was as ugly then as it is now, and some of the blame for that lands at his feet.

For me, Corbyn’s “failure” was his lack of commitment to the ambitious of leadership and governorship

That’s how I saw it. I liked his ideas/way of thinking but a person to be the leader of the Labour party he was not. He was buggered right from the start with his past that was so easy to play on.

Anyway, didn’t we do this whole discussion a few years ago. Are there not better things to discuss in 2021?

Alternatively; he was and has returned to being a serial rebel that showed no loyalty

There’s an enormous difference between rebelling in a commons vote and calling someone ‘a f***** racist’.

his lack of commitment to the ambitious of leadership and governorship, and that ambiguity and the lack of engaging in the day to day business of politics

Exactly the sort of approach we need IMO. If recent events have proved anything it’s that politics and governorship are completely dysfunctional and unfit for purpose. Like I said, a massive missed opportunity.

Corbyn tried to re-create the Labour party rather than lead the party he inherited

All he tried to do was take it back to it’s founding principles of working people representing the interests of working people in parliament. That’s long overdue and absolutely necessary. A labour party which represents private and corporate interests is redundant and irrelevant, as Keir Starmer is finding out from his poll ratings.

he was and has returned to being a serial rebel that showed no loyalty

Or you could say he stuck to his principles. One of these assessments is positive, one negative. You could choose either. Aren’t we always complaining on here that MPs just toe the party line and we get no representation? And yet here we are condenming someone for doing just what we want?

All he tried to do was take it back to it’s founding principles

I don’t think Corbyn had either the internal support, the personal support, or the leadership skills to take on the task of remolding the party into something else. The Labour party’s founding principles has always been an uneasy alliance between liberals and socialists, right from the difficult birth of the party. As an historian of the Labour movement; Corbyn knows that better than most. But as a party that at it’s most successful when it’s leadership has managed to “paper-over the cracks” then by that measure; he failed, and having been through the same thing in the 80’s the idea that he thought he was the man to re-fight that battle is frankly absurd.

Or you could say he stuck to his principles

Oh for sure, one of Corbyn’s strengths was/is that he’s utterly authentic, and often spoke his undiluted and honestly given opinions, but the flipside of that (especially difficult for a political leader) was that many voters found his ideas not to their liking

well said nickc

that he thought he was the man to re-fight that battle is frankly absurd.

Any examples or evidence of him ‘battling’ the right of the party? All I saw was him trying to build consensus. Whether it was bringing MPs from the right into the shadow cabinet (many of whom refused), adopting a second referendum policy to appease liberal remainer centrists, or resisting calls from the left for expulsions of the likes of Mann et al who were transparently working against the aims of the party, he went out of his way to bring both sides together. And in return they called him a racist and destroyed his reputation. There was only one side fighthing factional battles back then, and it wasn’t Corbyn or the left.

adopting a second referendum policy to appease liberal remainer centrists

To try and head off a monster of an election defeat…

Both main parties reacted to the split in support… Johnson was more committed to pulling voters back to binary voting patterns (and arguably had a much more straight forward task in doing so)… and the Conservatives are still gaining ground off the back of that.

But anyway… I just wanted to start listing examples of Corbyn being right… and maybe look at learning the positive lessons from where he has been shown to have been correct.

and maybe look at learning the positive lessons from where he has been shown to have been correct.

Like respecting the brexit referendum result? Not sure that’s what you mean 😏

they called him a racist and destroyed his reputation

Would that be his reputation as a proper sanctimonious, self-righteous PITA? His 70’s throwback dinosaur one? His dangerous Marxist one? Or his terrorist sympathiser one?

Like respecting the brexit referendum result?

Labour would have even fewer seats now if that path had been followed. Hard to imagine with the seat count they did end up with, but one of the lessons of recent years is… “yes, things could/can be even worse”. People forget so quickly just how badly Labour were doing with their “better, but just as vague” Brexit approach. Yes, the Conservatives were doing even worse at that point… both parties had to change something.

Anyway… I’ve tried… positive comments about Corbyn, showing where he has been shown to be right, was my intention…. thought it might be something different to discuss… rather than go around the same old shit all over again. I apologise for my naivety.

All I saw was him trying to build consensus

Cool, so we both agree he was doing a pretty poor job of being a Leader then. It’s safe to say that most of the PLP that Corbyn inherited didn’t want to be in a party remade in his image. He lacked the leadership skills to influence the direction of the party, and lacked the power base (within the party) to effectively control it’s messaging, and the MPs within it. If he went “out of his way” to bring the sides together then he signally failed to do that as well didn’t he?

Part of the role of being a good leader is understanding the need and wants of the folk you’re leading as well as “Follow Me” message that everybody feels they can get behind. perhaps the reason he failed to be a leader so comprehensively is that all the people he was trying to lead felt he wasn’t the person they wanted to follow?

For me, Corbyn’s “failure” was his lack of commitment to the ambitious of leadership and governorship, and that ambiguity and the lack of engaging in the day to day business of politics…ie a lack of cohesion, visibility, and adaptability ultimately provided uncommitted Labour support with a reason not to vote for him.

Do you actually believe that rubbish? Corbyn was never going to be allowed to succeed, by the people who really run our society; the owners of global corporations, the media barons, and their assorted arse-licking lackeys. As Dazh has said, Corbyn’s leadership exposed the venal scum that infect the Labour party, people who have absolutely zero interest in the needs of ordinary working people, and people for whom politics is just a fun game to play to further their own egotistical ambitions. Corbyn had the overwhelming support of Labour party members, but party members are irrelevant to the self-imposed elite who really control things. It was Blair who sold out Labour’s values and principles, and installed a bunch of sycophantic malleable **** who would do what they’re told to by their lords and masters. There are some people on here who would welcome someone like Blair, but if that’s what you really want, then just stop pretending you ‘care’, and just vote tory. If you do care, then forget Corbyn; the real problem you’ve got to knowledge is right in front of us. Labour needs to be rid of the Blairites and right wing scum and look to it’s working class voter base for new figures to lead the party forward. Otherwise, it’s truly dead.

self-righteous PITA? His 70’s throwback dinosaur one? His dangerous Marxist one? Or his terrorist sympathiser one?

Funny isn’t it because yes he did have all those reputations among his right wing enemies (yourself included), but he still got enough party members to vote for him to win the labour leadership who were more bothered about his reputation as a committed campaigner and honest politician who wouldn’t compromise himself in the way the likes of Andy Burnham and Yvette Cooper did. He then got more people to vote for him than any of his predecessors had for over a decade on the basis that he was on the side of normal people rather than a tiny elite, rather than the terrorist sympathising marxist extremist you’d have had them believe.

On the other thread you were bemoaning our broken political system yet now you’ve reverted to type. Please make your mind up.

It’s safe to say that most of the PLP that Corbyn inherited didn’t want to be in a party remade in his image.

And that’s the crux isn’t it, because the PLP does not equal the labour party. The PLP is largely an unleadable rabble of self interested narcissists. Is the job of the leader of the labour party to represent the interests of members and working people who organise themselves into unions and vote labour, or is it to maintain the power and privelege of a couple of hundred labour MPs and associated hangers-on? It’s pretty obvious what Starmer thinks his job is, and it’s why Corbyn is still so popular among the membership.

Funny isn’t it because yes he did have all those reputations among his right wing enemies

The very right wing enemies he had to beat. Can you see why he was not a good choice for leader now?
The baggage harmed him from the start and with his past it was all easy pickings.

And that’s the crux isn’t it, because the PLP does not equal the labour party.

But for better or worse; they’re the only bit that matters.

Is the job of the leader of the labour party to represent the interests of members and working people who organise themselves into unions

40% of Unite workers voted Tory in the last election…

I reckon Daz and bridges should join forces and form a new political party with a catchy title reflecting their values and aspirations. Something like “Voters? They’re all ****s! Utter ****ing ****s the lot of you!” 😀

“Voters? They’re all ****s! Utter ****ing ****s the lot of you!”

Wasn’t me who calls them all racist idiots. I seem to remember when I suggested voters wishes should be taken seriously I was called a nazi sympathiser.

But for better or worse; they’re the only bit that matters.

Well lets be honest, given where they are now you can only conclude that it’s for the worse. The trouble is labour MPs (excepting a small minority) don’t really want to represent their electors. They want to be like their tory colleagues, lording it up and taking all the perks and priveleges that their positions enable. In many ways they are worse than the tories, who are more honest about their intentions.

Well, we’ve already established that you’re worse than Hitler

Voters? They’re all ****s! Utter ****ing ****s the lot of you!” 😀

Wasn’t that your passing shot before the door hit your arse on the way out of your local pub binners?

Have you gone back to say sorry yet?

I thought we’d managed to get past your obsession with my local pub and its racist regulars.

Do you want me to take you down there one night? I think the crushing disappointment of its reality is the only way to get you over your quite disturbing compulsion

I think the crushing disappointment of its reality is the only way to get you over your quite disturbing compulsion

You should both come to the Golden Lion in Tod, the racists, brexiteers, smackheads, stoners and craft ale drinking hipsters all coexist in perfect harmony 🙂

Do you want me to take you down there one night?

Are you allowed back? Have you been back to say sorry?

Tbh it would be a long drive but I think I would fit in nicely with the local clientele.

We could compare opinions of the mouthy git who draws pictures. And has blood pressure problems.

EDIT : You can rely on me telling them what a great guy you are, they just need to ignore the bluster, but I’m sure they already know that.

Go on ……go back and say sorry. You know you want to really.

Ah the clear fresh air of the Corbyn memorial thread 🙂