Is it racist…

And meanwhile we’re not allowed to call someone a bell end on Singletrackworld, even if they’re clearly a massive bell end.

Political correctness gone mad.

I think gay is ok to describe gay things … but if it is used in a derogatory sense to describe something you don’t like then it is not ok.

And that would be an example of “intent and context” – the very thing I’ve argued for and you’ve said doesn’t matter. 😕

but not offensive to other people, just because certain people are offended by something doesn’t mean its wrong or right.

To quote Stephen Fry

“It’s now very common to hear people say, ‘I’m rather offended by that.’ As if that gives them certain rights. It’s actually nothing more… than a whine. ‘I find that offensive.’ It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. ‘I am offended by that.’ Well, so **** what”

and Christopher Hitchens

“If someone tells me that I’ve hurt their feelings, I say, ‘I’m still waiting to hear what your point is.’ In this country, I’ve been told, ‘That’s offensive,’ as if those two words constitute an argument or a comment. Not to me they don’t. And I’m not running for anything, so I don’t have to pretend to like people when I don’t.”

Yes, good point because those people who want to carry on using terms like Chinky or **** ar just like Stephen Fry and Christopher Hitchens. I’m sure they would both have supported their argument

Ah, the old ‘bait and switch,’ well played.

😀 a bit disappointed you didn’t see it coming

a bit disappointed you didn’t see it coming

Like the baby balloon, mostly I’ve just let myself down.

And meanwhile we’re not allowed to call someone a bell end on Singletrackworld, even if they’re clearly a massive bell end.

That’s “bell” and “end” going into the filter, STW is going to look like a redacted CIA dossier soon.

That is, of course, nothing to do with the choice of words.

Perhaps the relative “offensiveness” of using “lanky” as opposed to “gay” in an insulting way, however mildly, is that being lanky is very, very unlikely to result in someone being disowned by their family, discriminated against in the workplace (and the job market), excluded from social activities, assaulted in the street, murdered, not being treated equitably by the police and, come to that, other public services, vilified in (certain sections of) the press, and in some countries imprisoned or even hanged to death.

This is the aspect of these things that a roomful of middle class affluent white males (of which I’m one) seems to miss for some reason

To save typing, please take the above sentiment as my answer regarding “****” and “****” also.

For future debates, this is also most of the answer to the question “why don’t we have straight pride then?”

I understand your point Cougar and it’s kinda what I was trying to get at earlier too: banning a word from general usage just abandons it to the bigots. And I’m sure that can work. But disarming/reclaiming the word instead takes that power back from the bigots. It’s an interesting process.

I was trying to say the same about 400 pages ago. Take the meaning and power away from those who use it to hurt others and you begin to erode the negative connotations. A much better approach than letting the bigots keep it IMO. Slightly different, but reminds me of this stroke of utter genius.

Nazis against Nazis[/url]

That’s “bell” and “end” going into the filter

Hey, I’ve got an idea.

Put all the racial slurs mentioned in this thread in the filter now, it’ll make it much more interesting to read.

Yes, good point because those people who want to carry on using terms like Chinky or **** ar just like Stephen Fry and Christopher Hitchens. I’m sure they would both have supported their argument

if I had been using their quotes to defend the use of chinky when suggesting a meal then you would be right but I wasn’t.

Make a list of all the racial slurs in this thread so far. And put them in “word replacement list” or whatever it’s called.

Make it so they are replaced with popular breakfast cereal names.

This thread would be hilarious to read 😆

Make a list of all the racial slurs in this thread so far. And put them in “word replacement list” or whatever it’s called.

Make it so they are replaced with popular breakfast cereal names.

Even better idea.

As long as they don’t include the one that turns the milk brown.

but not offensive to other people, just because certain people are offended by something doesn’t mean its wrong or right.

To quote Stephen Fry

“It’s now very common to hear people say, ‘I’m rather offended by that.’ As if that gives them certain rights. It’s actually nothing more… than a whine. ‘I find that offensive.’ It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. ‘I am offended by that.’ Well, so **** what”

and Christopher Hitchens

“If someone tells me that I’ve hurt their feelings, I say, ‘I’m still waiting to hear what your point is.’ In this country, I’ve been told, ‘That’s offensive,’ as if those two words constitute an argument or a comment. Not to me they don’t. And I’m not running for anything, so I don’t have to pretend to like people when I don’t.”
I was asked the name of my team leader while I was dropping a car off at a dealership today, apparently because a customer was offended by something he’d said. I was a bit nonplussed because I hadn’t heard him say anything untoward at all, but apparently an ambulance driver who was outside had heard him talking to the rest of the team, and as usual there was a fair bit of profanity being swapped back and forth, and this bloke, clearly a very sensitive little soul, got all offended over the language being used!
I’m really not sure on who’s behalf he was being offended, but I can’t help feeling he’s in the wrong job if he gets all bent out of shape by other adults using profane language among themselves, unless he demands an apology every time someone uses naughty words in his hearing.
It really does seem that there are some who are making a profession out of being offended on behalf of others who couldn’t give a rat’s ass. 🙄

an ambulance driver

No such thing.

And that would be an example of “intent and context” – the very thing I’ve argued for and you’ve said doesn’t matter.

It’s about meaning.

if I had been using their quotes to defend the use of chinky when suggesting a meal then you would be right but I wasn’t.

You were defending the use of gay in a pejorative sense? I’m not sure they would have supported that argument any more.

clearly a very sensitive little soul, got all offended over the language being used!
I’m really not sure on who’s behalf he was being offended, but I can’t help feeling he’s in the wrong job if he gets all bent out of shape by other adults using profane language among themselves, unless he demands an apology every time someone uses naughty words in his hearing.

Dear me, how about a close look at the language you use?

Dear me, how about a close look at the language you use?

How about the gentleman just feels offended and gets on with his day? Nobody died. Are you one of the people that watches a programme on the television in its entirety and then writes to the regulator to complain about it?

It’s about meaning.

Is it? The two uses of “gay” you described have the same basic meaning, but the intent differs.

And you wanted to ban all use of the word “chink” regardless of the meaning, intent or context.

Are you one of the people that watches a programme on the television in its entirety and then writes to the regulator to complain about it?

Better that than one who doesn’t watch it and complains.

Better that than one who doesn’t watch it and complains.

I now have images of somebody reading a synopsis in the Radio Times and getting really vexed.

In a similar context I remember an American politician in the 90’s complaining about rock musicians corrupting the youth with their obscene lyrics. Said politician singled out a track by Eels as being obscene and hateful towards women. The track was about Mark Everett losing his sister to suicide and mother to cancer. One of the saddest, most profound songs in his ouvre.

Funny how so called foul language can be used to great emotional effect.

I understand your point Cougar and it’s kinda what I was trying to get at earlier too: banning a word from general usage just abandons it to the bigots. And I’m sure that can work. But disarming/reclaiming the word instead takes that power back from the bigots. It’s an interesting process.

Not only did I counter this argument a few pages ago (eg Black people still find a white person using the N word offensive, despite it being reclaimed) – but why should they go through the arduous process of reclaiming every word which becomes the new insult of choice.

I may have posted this on here recently, but it’s so very appropriate for some of the more obtuse/stubborn posters on here…

A point that has passed us all by: After 11 pages of squabbling this topic was definitively settled. Surely that’s unique in STW history? After 11 pages agreement is surely unheard of?

Admittedly we’ve spent another 5 pages squabbling about other stuff….

Not only did I counter this argument a few pages ago..,

You offered a counter. I’m not sure it was effective. 😀

If you read what I wrote I said that if you want to ban a word from general usage then “I’m sure that can work”.

Yes, it could well be that something as racially charged as the N-word can never ever be reclaimed back.

But language is pretty fluid. I don’t see many people gasping these days if you say you were out riding on the moors for instance. So who knows how it’ll be in a couple of hundred years?

why should they go through the arduous process of reclaiming every word which becomes the new insult of choice.

To fight racism and bigotry?

if you say you were out riding on the moors

You were WHAT ! *faints*

To fight racism and bigotry?

It’s much easier just to make it unacceptable in public or around others.

If you want to be a racist, do it at home. The same goes for religion.

It’s much easier just to make it unacceptable in public or around others.

If you want to be a racist, do it at home. The same goes for religion.

Most religions have special buildings for the followers, churches, mosques, synagogues etc. We should have a building for bigots where they can go and say racist words to each other. Safely away from the rest of us. After we’ve lulled them in to attending for a bit, we can simply lock them in. No more racism!

If you want to be a racist, do it at home. The same goes for religion.

Or a church?

We should have a building for bigots where they can go and say racist words to each other

Britain First HQ.

It’s much easier just to make it unacceptable in public or around others.

Well no it isn’t. It’s already unacceptable to say lots of things in public but that doesn’t really stop people saying them or make racism go away.

If you want to be a racist, do it at home.

In some ways that seems worse to me.

At least if someone spouts racist guff in public then people can see them for what they really are and react accordingly (i.e. challenge it, disown/unfriend them, whatever).

Most religions have special buildings for the followers, churches, mosques, synagogues etc. We should have a building for bigots where they can go and say racist words to each other. Safely away from the rest of us. After we’ve lulled them in to attending for a bit, we can simply lock them in. No more racism!

To be fair, that would be a fitting end for humanity before we nuke ourselves or wipe ourselves out with bio-engineered viruses. Round up the racists in a synagogue looking thing, and then have Hipsters in ironic Germanish uniforms set fire to it and then machine gun them – we can be a valuable lesson to future non-human archaeologists.

Well no it isn’t. It’s already unacceptable to say lots of things in public but that doesn’t really stop people saying them or make racism go away.

Better reclaim rape then – maybe teh wimminz can re appropriate it by just learning to enjoy it?

As I said, it’s a strange kind of liberal that wants to ban words and curtail free speech.

Stranger still when they start suggesting a Final Solution. 😯

Better reclaim rape then – maybe teh wimminz can just learn to enjoy it?

WTF is wrong with you? How does that follow from anything I have said?!?

WTF is wrong with you? How does that follow from anything I have said?!?

It doesn’t. Not in the slightest.

WTF indeed 😯

In some ways that seems worse to me.

At least if someone spouts racist guff in public then people can see them for what they really are and react accordingly (i.e. challenge it, disown/unfriend them, whatever).

I wonder idly whether that’s what’s been happening since the 80s, util Brexit legitimised it all again.

To be fair, that would be a fitting end for humanity before we nuke ourselves or wipe ourselves out with bio-engineered viruses. Round up the racists in a synagogue looking thing, and then have Hipsters in ironic Germanish uniforms set fire to it and then machine gun them – we can be a valuable lesson to future non-human archaeologists.

😯 well you’re a cheery one aren’t you! Reclaiming rape? I know this threads gone off on a tangent, but I didn’t think we’d end up here.

On a more light hearted note, can you spot the chink in his armour? Lower arm on the guy on the right and near the collarbone on the bloke on the left? See context! If you think this is racist then you’re a closet racist!

Edit – other way round, curse you left and right, curse you to hell.

WTF is wrong with you?

Tom_W is prone to make angry exaggerated claims, the reasons for that are outside the scope of this forum. HTH.

The Frankfurt School’s 11 step programme of cultural subversion:

Step 1 : Create Racism Offences . .

To fight racism and bigotry?

can i just clarify, are you saying that you want to fight racism and bigotry by using the word ****?

well you’re a cheery one aren’t you! Reclaiming rape? I know this threads gone off on a tangent, but I didn’t think we’d end up here.

I didn’t know that rape was an offensive word….or me conflating racism with rape was offensive.

God.

PC gone mad.

No.

I’m suggesting that one reason people may want to “go through the arduous process of reclaiming” words is to fight racism and bigotry.

i.e. Pretty much the same reasons people might want to go through the arduous process of challenging racist behaviour and language.

And no I don’t want to use the n-word. Or rape anyone.

I’m suggesting that one reason people may want to “go through the arduous process of reclaiming” words is to fight racism and bigotry.

i.e. Pretty much the same reasons people might want to go through the arduous process of challenging racist behaviour and language.

It’s easier to stem things at the source, instead of fighting fires by continually “reclaiming” whatever new word that racists decide to invent.

Isn’t it. I think trying to claim otherwise is really, really clutching at straws.

I wonder idly whether that’s what’s been happening since the 80s, util Brexit legitimised it all again.

Racist politicians legitimised it in the run up to Brexit, not people making it socially unacceptable by disowning or unfriending racists.