Inability to control dogs

smythe – Member
I’ve not read all the posts

Obviously.

but would like to echo the ones that have suggested you familiarise your kid with some friendly dogs again, and fairly soon. A similar thing must have happened to me when I was younger because I spent a lot of my childhood scared of dogs. It’s not a good thing at all and I’m sure it could have been avoided if I’d socialised with some friendly dogs.

Plainly my fault, then, for not properly ensuring my son was capable of dealing with other people’s out of control dogs. Silly me.

I don’t think the last couple of posts are saying its your fault.

but its not a perfect world, there are dicks out there with out of control dogs/cars/bikes/mouths etc and there is no harm in teaching your son how best to deal with them.

jam bo – Member
I don’t think the last couple of posts are saying its your fault.

but its not a perfect world, there are dicks out there with out of control dogs/cars/bikes/mouths etc and there is no harm in teaching your son how best to deal with them.

But isn’t the implication that if we had “trained” our son, everything would be okay? The onus is not, and should not be, on us to ensure he can “cope” with badly-behaved/bite-y/snappy dogs.

As I mentioned in the first post, the family we were with had a dog with them. It was well-behaved, and my son got on fine with it.

The issue is not with dogs per se, but with badly-trained/badly-controlled dogs. It’s all well and good familiarising him with friendly, known dogs who obey commands – it goes wrong when the dog in question is not well-trained.

Jakester,
You’re coming across badly now. You’re letting your principles blind you to reality (principles which I 100% agree with, by the way).

I loathe most dogs.
I loathe the behaviour of many/most dog owners.
I’m really sorry that your son got hassled by the dog, it was not his fault in any way.
The dog owner in question was an arse and if there was any justice then he would be made to act differently.
I really wish we lived in a fair and just world, but we don’t. As cyclists, that much is bloody obvious.

We should do everything in our power to make dog owners take responsibility for their foul little (and big creatures).

But in the mean time, getting your son to interact with some nice dogs would be time well spent.
You shouldn’t have to, it’s wrong. It’s not your fault, or your son’s. But it would still be worth doing. These people are trying to help you.

And I repeat, I say this as someone who would gladly see 30% or so of dog owners culled from the population.

But isn’t the implication that if we had “trained” our son, everything would be okay? The onus is not, and should not be, on us to ensure he can “cope” with badly-behaved/bite-y/snappy dogs.

Have read and observed this thread so far, but I have to disagree here.

Absolutely the onus is on dog owners to train and control their dogs appropriately, that’s not in doubt and I don’t think in reading this thread anyone is disagreeing with that. I don’t *think* I’ve seen a single ‘it’s just what dogs do’ post at all.

But the reality is that the world isn’t like that, and in knowing that point then it would be appropriate PARTICULARLY now there may be some damage already from this occurrence, to equip your son with the skills to be able to deal with it in future (and also to get some positive experiences with good dogs and owners – because a well behaved dog with a well trained owner can be a joy as you know)

Strawman – but we SHOULD live in a world where child abuse doesn’t happen, and kids don’t need to worry about it or know how to deal with it. But we don’t. So we equip our kids with the tools to deal with it at the same time as trying to prevent it happening in the first place.

the generalist – everything you’ve written is fair and correct.
However in no way, shape or form is the OP a Pillock. You were not there when these 2 incidents happened.
Jakester – I completely understand where you are coming from.
From my own perspective, I was a dog lover as a child but still scared. Curing myself by taking a friend’s completely uncontrollable red setter out for walks. But since I cycle a lot and go out walking I’ve been bitten a few times and am now completely scared.
It’s all the owners fault, as mentioned above they can’t be bothered to put in the time and effort to train them.

I think someone used an analogy with ridinh defencively on the road. In an ideal world we wouldnt have to but we dont live in an ideal world. The op has has vented on the internet which is fine and understandable after a horrible experience, maybe its still too close fir him to consider how to prevent it in the future but just screaming “I have rights” at anyone trying to help is not going to prevent another dog with bellend owners causing a problem in the future.

anagallis_arvensis – Member
I think someone used an analogy with ridinh defencively on the road. In an ideal world we wouldnt have to but we dont live in an ideal world. The op has has vented on the internet which is fine and understandable after a horrible experience, maybe its still too close fir him to consider how to prevent it in the future but just screaming “I have rights” at anyone trying to help is not going to prevent another dog with bellend owners causing a problem in the future.

Spectacularly missing the point, or just trolling?

Some sense here. And yes it is good for kids to learn to deal with dogs, and other risks in life caused by bellends

But AA your characterisation of his response is unhelpful and offensive. Back down.

I love dogs. All owners should understand that they cannot assume that other people will want their dog’s paws all over them, let alone to be bitten. And they should apologise, rather than make excuses. Which one or two people here are beginning to do.

“he never normallly does that” is no substitute for “I am sorry”

People do have a right to be scared of dogs and not to have their space invaded, and in a multi-user environment we all, cyclists, walkers, horse-riders, dog-walkers have to be respectful of each other.

I hate dogs. I think it is safe to say that I am possessed in some way, as 99% of dogs will make some sort of move towards me. I know that this is in part due to my being ‘overly’ wary of them, but it’s a bit of a vicious circle.
Since I like being outside and cycling on shared use paths I have interactions with dogs and their owners most days.
A particularly memorable experience was when I was walking along a beach and from about 100 yards away a large boxer dog came runnuning towards me. Thinking oh no here we go I stood still. It got up close and I froze. It then opened its mouth and put all my genitalia in its mouth! (it was a big dog) – two seconds later it ran off.
All dogs should be muzzled and kept on a short, non-extending lead IMHO.

gauss1777 – Member
It then opened its mouth and put all my genitalia in its mouth! (it was a big dog)

… But had a very small mouth 🙂

They should just ban the blooming things(possible exceptions for Police /rescue dogs and sheepdogs, guide dogs etc). Get every dog in the country neutered, stop imports and the problem would be over in around 15 years. The parks and streets would be cleaner and there’d be a lot less whinging every November too.

After years of trying to access outdoor spaces with schools, and daily stepping on sh*t or putting up with dogs and owners using the space as a private dog toilet, who strongly object if you suggest they put the animal on a lead for 5mins, I think I now agree.
I (and many others) have developed ways of classes dealing with dogs running up to classes outdoors – it was a becoming a few times a day thing. We now teach whole classes to stop stationary and hug themselves until the hound has left.
So yes please, lets get rid of all but working dogs.

Guy in a house near mine regularly let his big dog out on some common ground on the way to my house and every time it I passed it barked and acted aggressively toward me – getting closer every time. Once I knew it’s routine, I took a spray gun of bleach and let it have some. That’s ok because
a – I was only playing, if I wanted to really hurt it I would have
b – I’ve never done that before
c – It’s the owners responsibility to teach the dog to stay away from bleach spray wielding pissed-off people

It never barked at me again.

It then opened its mouth and put all my genitalia in its mouth! (it was a big dog) – two seconds later it ran off.

Sorry but I have to ask – with the genitalia?

It then opened its mouth and put all my genitalia in its mouth! (it was a big dog) – two seconds later it ran off.

“The defence rests, your honour.”

I have to admit, I’m curious as to whether Fido left in possession of the wedding tackle.

thegeneralist–
But in the mean time, getting your son to interact with some nice dogs would be time well spent

Jakester–
As I mentioned in the first post, the family we were with had a dog with them. It was well-behaved, and my son got on fine with it.

🙄

with respect, teach your kid to deal with dogs. if he had known how to its very likely he wouldnt have been chased, and also from the initial post you did not see what caused the dogs to run after him so who is to say your kid didnt throw a rock at the dog.

sorry if this offends about a million people but as a dog owner i know that they very worst people you meet out and about are those that act stupid and scared around dogs. dont blame a dog for a persons inability to deal with one.

dont blame a dog for a persons inability to deal with one.

Never do, I always blame the owner. The owner should assume that people may not like dogs, be afraid of them or simply don’t want them to come to them. All the owners responsibility.

The entitled morons have arrived…with respect that is…

gavtheoldskater do you want to read the whole thread and think again about this, out walking with a friend and their dog who is well behaved etc etc? Being an apologist for people who cannot be bothered to train or control their dogs does dogs cause no good.

You are responsible for the actions of your dog, not the people your dog meets unless they do something totally aggressive. People have a right to be scared of dogs when there are entitled owners out there who don’t get that someone might be scared of dogs because of previous experiences.

Google “eggshell skull rule”. Stop victim shaming.

If I were the OP I’d stop reading this thread, like so many STW threads, after a few pages it makes one start understanding why we all are where we are today. 🙁

gavtheoldskater – Member
with respect, teach your kid to deal with dogs. if he had known how to its very likely he wouldnt have been chased, and also from the initial post you did not see what caused the dogs to run after him so who is to say your kid didnt throw a rock at the dog.

I am. I can say with absolute certainty that that didn’t happen. He knows full well that that sort of behaviour would result in serious trouble on my part. That’s because I take my responsibilities as a parent seriously, and that is with a small child that could not cause one tenth of the damage an out of control dog could.

Complete and utter, frankly offensive, cobblers.

sorry if this offends about a million people but as a dog owner i know that they very worst people you meet out and about are those that act stupid and scared around dogs. dont blame a dog for a persons inability to deal with one.

Seems to me you’re part of the problem.

I wasn’t blaming the dog. I was blaming the owner – people just like you.

Google “eggshell skull rule”. Stop victim shaming.

I don’t think anyone disagrees with that. The bit that seems to be causing contention is – to take your analogy – suppose your child did have an eggshell skull. Would you just send them out like that and then if something bad happens say that it’s the other person’s fault. You’d be 100% right but the kid’s still got a fractured skull. Or would you make them wear protective headgear to make them better equipped to deal with the imperfect happening?

theotherjonv – Member
Google “eggshell skull rule”. Stop victim shaming.
I don’t think anyone disagrees with that. The bit that seems to be causing contention is – to take your analogy – suppose your child did have an eggshell skull. Would you just send them out like that and then if something bad happens say that it’s the other person’s fault. You’d be 100% right but the kid’s still got a fractured skull. Or would you make them wear protective headgear to make them better equipped to deal with the imperfect happening?

I call whataboutery…

I call whataboutery…

Call it what you want. I’d say analogy.

Again – Honestly – i don’t think anyone’s disagreeing with you that ideally you shouldn’t have to teach your son how to deal with this situation because in an ideal world it wouldn’t arise. But it’s not an ideal world, it likely will arise again, and so you should equip him accordingly.

And frankly, it’s now getting to where you seem to be putting your fingers in your ears and going ‘Lalala not listening’ and that makes you seem a bit of an arse as well as the dog owners that refuse to accept that it’s their responsibility too.

dont blame a dog for a persons inability to deal with one.

Its not some random persons responsibility to learn how to deal with your dog. Its your job to ensure it doesnt interfere with other people both for the sake of those people and the sake of your dog. After all some people may have rather effective, albeit damaging, responses to an untrained dog jumping at them.

As for throw a rock at the mutt. Well if it was sufficiently under control then the owner would have been able to spot that.

know that they very worst people you meet out and about are those that act stupid and scared around dogs. dont blame a dog for a persons inability to deal with one.

Absolutely! I went out for a stroll with my shotgun the other day, and the number of people acting scared around me was amazing. I was minding my own business taking a few shots in the park when some stupid kid ran in front of me and got hit! Don’t blame the shotgun for a person’s inability to deal with one.

As for throw a rock at the mutt.

That’s the “she was asking for it anyway” defence, I believe.

sorry if this offends about a million people but as a dog owner i know that they very worst people you meet out and about are those that act stupid and scared around dogs. dont blame a dog for a persons inability to deal with one. my dog terrifying or biting your kids is your problem, not mine

FIFY

I dont know what it is about dogs that makes people on here react the way we do. Everyone seems ok with slowing down for horses and accepts that you have to behave differently around them if you dont want to be kicked to death yet get all uppity at te idea that dogs can be a bit unpredictable at times, what with being living things and all and so you can mitigate your risks with a bit of give and take.
The runner who a few pages ago talked about all the times he’d been bitten and refused to stop running when an excited dog approaches him is a classic case, he seemed happy that he’d kept running and been bitten. Now obviously he shouldnt have to blah blah blah, but tbh I’d prefer not to be bitten

Can’t remember the last time I was in either real or imaginary danger of being attacked by a horse.

The runner who a few pages ago talked about all the times he’d been bitten and refused to stop running when an excited dog approaches him is a classic case,

When you say “refuse to stop running,” do you mean refusing to slow down / wait, or refusing to give up running?

If it’s the former, he was an idiot.

I dont know what it is about dogs that makes people on here react the way we do. Everyone seems ok with slowing down for horses

Odd. I recall people complaining about cases where horses were clearly unsuited to being out in public. However the majority of the time they are actually kept under control by their riders and just as I would give a clearly unhappy dog on a lead some distance I do the same with horses.
The problem with dogs though is the keeping under control bit seems to be considered optional. You can rest assured if I was on a sustrans path and some horse decided to run up to me to “say hello” since it is just being friendly I would be even more unhappy with its owner than I would be with the owner of a dog which did the same thing.

theotherjonv – Member
And frankly, it’s now getting to where you seem to be putting your fingers in your ears and going ‘Lalala not listening’ and that makes you seem a bit of an arse as well as the dog owners that refuse to accept that it’s their responsibility too.

Er, I think you may be reading a touch too much into my responses, there, pal. But hey, you keep on keeping on…

I am. I can say with absolute certainty that that didn’t happen. He knows full well that that sort of behaviour would result in serious trouble on my part.

With the certainty of a dog owner?

See where I’m going with this?

With all respect this has just turned into a circlejerk, FWIW though I’m with the learning how to not further antagonise a dog being a good thing. Even if you shouldn’t have to. Nobody has blamed you or your child but you seem hell bent on blaming everyone here who is trying to help.

I was bitten by a horse when crossing a field on a public footpath when I was 16. No rider on it though…

…so perhaps if all dogs had riders?

…or failing that, responsible owners who like a horse rider sought to control their animals?

No – it would never work… 🙄

Can’t remember the last time I was in either real or imaginary danger of being attacked by a horse.

Nor me, and I ride by a lot of horses (wild and with riders onboard)

Never once been chased down the trail by a horse. Can’t say the same for dogs…

squirrelking – Member
I am. I can say with absolute certainty that that didn’t happen. He knows full well that that sort of behaviour would result in serious trouble on my part.
With the certainty of a dog owner?

See where I’m going with this?

No, because he was within 6ft of me the whole time, and wasn’t therefore 50Ft away out of sight, like the dog in question… 😕 Try reading the post…

I see that when the dog owners can’t mount a reasonable defence they just resort to name calling. Classy.

OP should train and arm child with a katana. The discipline learned by martial arts will equip him to meet life’s challenges head on and he will be able to meet unruly dogs head on by cutting their heads off!

Can’t remember the last time I was in either real or imaginary danger of being attacked by a horse.

Cattle would have been a better example. Seem to remember they’re about even with dogs for fatalities.