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A good rule of thumb here - if ninfan ignores your post it's generally a sign that he's lost that particular argument. I'm still waiting for a clarification of who he was suggesting was retaliating...
[quote=ninfan ]"But they didn't just punch back" you cry, "they actually killed people"
Well? What on earth did you expect? They're Nazis FFS!
and you're defending them...
Free speech and all that, you're quite entitled to defend them. Free speech also means other people are entitled to call you a dick when you do.
(though there's an interesting difference in how free speech is protected in the forum rules - I'm hoping I've tiptoed just the right side of the line there).
and you're defending them
Yes, and I've managed to do it without calling people names, comparing them with men's, or ladies (or whatever non-cisgendered identity you prefer) genitalia or telling them to kill themselves.
there's plenty of people on here who think it's acceptable to punch people on the face as long as you don't like their opinions
But can't see that that works both ways
[quote=ninfan ]Yes
It wasn't a question BTW, though thanks for the clarification - in which case I'm inclined to agree with what other people on here might suggest you are [tiptoeing]
Still waiting for a clarification on who was retaliating...
I've managed to do it without calling people names, comparing them with ladies genitalia or telling them to kill themselves.
It's an obnoxious enough opinion to hold with requiring any of that. I'll just compare you with Justin Moore, though you're probably flattered by that comparison http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article167303682.html
Ninfan ,you can't just dismiss me by calling me a lefty. I'm not a lefty. Murder is exactly the sort of behaviour I expect from Nazis, that's kind of their thing, which is why I wholeheartedly condone violence towards them wherever necessary and that their filth be resisted as loudly as possible whenever spouted in public.
You are still talking as if he ran people over in response to violence against him, of which there is no proof at all, unless you have some. If you have proof of this threat he was so desperate to drive through a crowd to escape, maybe you should be giving the Virginia DA a call, rather than moaning on an internet forum, then your mate can go free...
Yes, and there's plenty of people on here who think it's acceptable to punch people on the face as long as you don't like their opinions
I'm not saying I'd punch anyone who's opinion I didn't like.
But.... know ..... Nazi's 🙄
A [b]bit[/b] more than just a slight "difference of opinion" there for most people.
Also, I totally understand that it works both ways, I fully understand that Nazis wish me and many millions like me dead and would, given the right set of circumstances, have me killed. so, yes, I tend towards supporting violence against them.
[b]Because they're ****ing NAZIS!!![/b]
You are still talking as if he ran people over in response to violence against him, of which there is no proof at all, unless you have some.
Hahahahaha. 😆
Of course he doesn't! 🙂
Yes, and I've managed to do it
You really haven't!
You are still talking as if he ran people over in response to violence against him, of which there is no proof at all,
Does he need a reason? He's a nazi remember. If he was a Muslim you'd be saying that he had been provoked by Donald Trumps ban on immigration, so yeah, let's say he was provoked by the left trying to tear down a statue and turning up at the protest to try to punch him in the face
(We'll see what comes out at court.)
Also, I totally understand that it works both ways, I fully understand that [s]Nazis[/s] muslims wish me and many millions like me dead and would, given the right set of circumstances, have me killed. so, yes, I tend towards supporting violence against them.Because they're **** [s]NAZIS!!![/s] muslims
Are you getting it yet?
So are you suggesting he was retaliating?
[quote=ninfan ]Well? What on earth did you expect? They're Nazis FFS!
actually, hang on a minute, what exactly did you mean by this?
If he was a Muslim you'd be saying that he had been provoked by Donald Trumps ban on immigration
No I wouldn't, how ridiculous...
[quote=ninfan ]Also, I totally understand that it works both ways, I fully understand that [s]Nazis[/s] [s]muslims[/s] white men wish me and many millions like me dead and would, given the right set of circumstances, have me killed. so, yes, I tend towards supporting violence against them.
Because they're **** [s]NAZIS!!![/s] [s]muslims[/s] white men
For a better comparison with muslims. Are you getting any yet?
Explain how you managed that?ninfan - Member
and you're defending them
Yes, and I've managed to do it
The extent to which a large number of posters on this thread are making it about ninfan, rather than the events in Charlottesville and USA is depressing.
I find some of ninfan's posts irritating in that he constantly uses the same debating technique of turning around people's own statements against them, which done repeatedly just becomes wearing and destroys meaningful debate. Howevever, there is only one of him, and he is responding to a lot of people on this thread posting some fairly stupid/poorly thought out remarks, e.g. "it's OK to punch Nazis". That sort of statement is just pathetic internet keyboard warrior 'virtue signalling'.
A lot of people who have criticised ninfan for his absolutist approach to the right to freedom of speech and freedom of protest probably need to ask themselves some hard questions about what it is that they really believe in, rather than keep asking ninfan what he believes in and calling him a Nazi apologist etc.
Many people on this thread probably like to think of themselves as being fairly liberal, but in reality they are showing themselves as being quite authoritarian, and there is a long history of the left wing believing it has a moral superiority and that that justifies it taking action 'for the greater good' to restrict people's freedoms in ways that would never be accepted from right wing governments, e.g. the Blair Labour government's attempts to extend the police power to detain suspects for up to 90 days without charge and to introduce ID cards.
I get a feeling from some of the comments on this thread, that some people do feel morally superior in being able to call someone else a Nazi or a Nazi apologist. If so they are incredibly shallow.
I doubt Bernard Kenny wasted his time arguing on internet forums, and for all I know he was a UKIP voter who wanted to deport all immigrants, but when it really mattered he showed that he was a far better man than probably most of us.
I really like how the random lefties spend forever..
Well if nothing else at least you've moved on from "[i]all[/i] lefties" as if the left is some homogeneous groupthink.
As inconvenient for you as it is, I consider myself left leaning and have agreed with your points on free speech and violence.
"But they didn't just punch back" you cry, "they actually killed people"
Well? What on earth did you expect? They're Nazis FFS!
You argued that running someone over in a car was a perfectly reasonable response to the [i]suggestion[/i] of being punched in the face.
That does sound a [i]bit[/i] like you are defending nazi violence, which we have established you think is repugnant.
ninfan? ninfan? no edits of your posts for the last 10 minutes, are you OK hun?
aracer, Nazis are neither a race or religion, they are an ideology based on mass murder, therefore the comparison doesn't really stand up. Most Muslims don't wish anyone dead and neither do most white men. Nazis, on the other hand, definitely want a lot of people to die.
ninfan » Also, I totally understand that it works both ways, I fully understand that [s]Nazis muslims white men[/s] communists wish me and many millions like me dead and would, given the right set of circumstances, have me killed. so, yes, I tend towards supporting violence against them.
Because they're **** [s]NAZIS!!! muslims white men[/s] communists
The game can go on all day, once you begin to justify violence based on someone's political, racial or religious affiliations then it's only a matter of time before it comes back on you.
they are an ideology based on mass murder,
Totally not like a religion then 😆
Good point
[quote=ninfan ]ninfan » Also, I totally understand that it works both ways, I fully understand that [s]Nazis muslims white men communists[/s] ninfans wish me and many millions like me dead and would, given the right set of circumstances, have me killed. so, yes, I tend towards supporting violence against them.
Because they're **** [s]NAZIS!!! muslims white men communists[/s] ninfans
OK, I'm going to simplify it.
[b]Anyone who belongs to a group whose stated primary aim is to murder large groups of people deserves a punch in the face.[/b]
Totally not like a religion then
I get your point, and I am no great fan of organised religion. But there are those within organised religion who promote peace and tolerance.
There are literally no Nazis doing that.
whose stated primary aim is to murder large groups of people
Have you read Mein Kampf?
Have you read Mein Kampf?
Is this like when a Jehovah's Witness knocks the door and asks you if you've read the bible?
[quote=ninfan ]Have you read Mein Kampf?
I hope you're not about to post spoilers
asks you if you've read the bible?
I've read most of that too, and the Koran, and the communist manifesto
I didn't walk away that the impression that any of them particularly promoted actual mass murder
Your point ?
[quote=ninfan ]and the communist manifesto
Personally I preferred The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte, though neither is really a patch on The Da Vinci Code
I've read most of that too, and the Koran, and the communist manifesto
What, just the Communist Manifesto? That's barely a pamphlet!
Come back to me when you've read all three volumes of Capital, then we can have a real debate about Marx's theories (his ideas around the tendency of the rate of profit to fall, for example) rather than just the tired old undergrad bollocks about permanent revolution.
Don't see what all this willy waving has to do with a Nazi murdering someone with a car, though...
your point
Well, the comment above was that the Nazis "stated primary aim is to murder large groups of people"
So, if it's not in mein kampf, then where is it stated?
[url= https://s27.postimg.org/4ocyqq8j7/IMG_0802.jp g" target="_blank">
OK, just for ninfan, I'm gonna put out a slightly revised final draft...
[b]Anyone who belongs to a group whose stated primary aim is to murder large groups of people [u]or has historically done so[/u] deserves a punch in the face.[/b]
Also, great picture Drac.
I dont really see nazi's as being political, I guess thats where ninfan and I disagree. Its just hate, I dont see how nazi's can have a public event without advocati g hate and violence. Hence a swift slap in the chops is an approriate response.
So, if it's not in mein kampf, then where is it stated?
FFS really???
[url= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebensraum ]Lebensraum[/url]
I am surprised the mods have not closed this down yet.
On many many sides it's just a race to the bottom. Of patience or trollololing.
Especially for jimjam. He's had enough and started tagging walls out of frustration.
[img] 
[/img]
[quote=ninfan ]So, if it's not in mein kampf, then where is it stated?
In the Rommel Papers? No spoilers though please, that's next on my reading list after Pride and Prejudice.
The extent to which a large number of posters on this thread are making it about ninfan, rather than the events in Charlottesville and USA is depressing.
It's called maintaining a tradition
I am surprised the mods have not closed this down yet.
Freedom of speech, innit.
asks you if you've read the bible?
I've read most of that too, and the Koran, and the communist manifesto
I didn't walk away that the impression that any of them particularly promoted actual mass murder
The inhabitants of Jericho might not have agreed with you on that one.
@thm Clarification please - who are you blaming then ninfan or them?
I agree it almost ends like this rather than an intelligent debate on complex issues.
I get it Toryboi, you're a troll....a particularly repugnant troll....
But when it's so easy to shoot your sh1t full of holes I can't resist!
😆
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40948414 ]Theresa May now condemning Trump[/url] for his failure.
JamieEspecially for jimjam. He's had enough and started tagging walls out of frustration.
😆
I am surprised the mods have not closed this down yet.
Sometimes we like to watch the world burn, that and it's not broken any rules other than a few individuals.
The PM said: "I see no equivalence between those who propound fascist views and those who oppose them."
If Maybot can say it, I think that says it all.
As an aside. In 6 months time The Donald won't be president. Calling it now.
It's nice to be reminded occasionally that even Maybot isn't quite as shit as Trump.
As an aside. In 6 months time The Donald won't be president. Calling it now.
I said this six months ago...
It's nice to be reminded occasionally that even Maybot isn't quite as shit as Trump.
Took her long enough though.
But then again.
teamhurtmore - Member
It's called maintaining a tradition
Which one?
You refusing to make a point and chipping in with sarcastic comments every few pages?
Ninners trolling for attention whilst pushing the Devil's Advocate stance as far as possible?
You must be so proud that these ancient traditions still survive...
[quote=Jamie ]As an aside. In 6 months time The Donald won't be president. Calling it now.
that's what they said six months ago.
that's what they said six months ago.
Yeah. But that was them. This is me.
You can trust me.
Honest.
[quote=Drac ]But then again.
Ah, so do we now have to condemn Maybot, or risk being seen as endorsing her views on Trump?
usty Spanner - Member
teamhurtmore - MemberIt's called maintaining a tradition
Which one?
I think it's the one were ye make perceived lofty observations every now and then in support of the local ring wing loonball in the hope that they buy ye a sub! 😆
Have we done the Vice HBO report yet?
If not, pull up a poof, open a packet of Seabrooks and enjoy.
Remember
Fear leads to anger
anger leads to hate
hate leads to nazis
Have we done the Vice HBO report yet?
3 times now but was worth reposting.
Well been watching US and Canadian news this morning as I trudge through Van airport after no sleep and nobody is supporting Trump's views there - well except for the KKK and the nazi's but they are just an oppressed minority.
The worst bit is how completely unsurprising it is that he has managed to isolate himself so much, no fresh Approval polls this week so be interesting to see if it drops further.
As an aside for the amount of show security on borders and airports once again they miss the fact that the biggest threats already live there and are proud to be Americans in whatever way they see fit.
FFS Donny is at it again:
Fear leads to anger
anger leads to hate
hate leads to nazis
So Nazis are the Dark Side? They won't like that.
ninfan - MemberFunny that, because if you were near me and suggesting punching me in the face was appropriate then I'd run you over with my car to get away from you
This post exposes ninfan on so many levels.
He likens himself to a murdering nazi.
He suggests a wholly illegal course of action.
He defends the actions of a murdering nazi.
He repeats the lie that the murderer was acting in defence.
He uses the murder of an innocent woman to try and score points.
What a despicable being.
I wouldn't ban him for being despicable mind, I'd ban him for being a trolling liar.
If the issue really is freedom of speech, where is the condemnation of a group of people (nazis) that want to deny that right (amongst others)?
It's utter hypocrisy.
The alt-right don't like star wars because it's got a multicultural agenda
Or whatever insecure tosh they like to arouse themselves over
http://www.nme.com/news/donald-trump-alt-right-supporters-boycott-new-star-wars-movie-rogue-one-1902965
Which is even funnier as Rogue 1 was the first decent star wars film in decades !
Even Theresa the Appeaser has had to condemn Trump, dark times for the sith !
Trump's interview yesterday was pure paranoid fantasy, there may be something tactical there he's trying to cling onto that core tea party vote who hide behind the free speech bobbins because really they agree with the guys waving swastikas and flaming torches around.
So Nazis are the Dark Side? They won't like that.
It's the better uniform thing all over. The baddies always look cooler.
Wheres the 'are we the baddies' Nazi sketch when you need it.
Ninfan quite clearly, hasn't actually read Mein Kampf, here is what THE authority on Hitler has to say.
The historian Ian Kershaw points out that several passages in Mein Kampf are undeniably of a genocidal nature.[10] Hitler wrote "the nationalization of our masses will succeed only when, aside from all the positive struggle for the soul of our people, their international poisoners are exterminated",[11] and he suggested that, "If at the beginning of the war and during the war twelve or fifteen thousand of these Hebrew corrupters of the nation had been subjected to poison gas, such as had to be endured in the field by hundreds of thousands of our very best German workers of all classes and professions, then the sacrifice of millions at the front would not have been in vain."[12]
So his understanding of Mein Kampf is like his understanding of freedom of speech, it is non existent.
undeniably of a genocidal nature
That wasn't the allegation though was it? It was "they are an ideology based on mass murder" which it doesn't
You appear to have forgotten that the removal of the statue and renaming of the park is also undeniably an act of cultural genocide as well
Here he is promoting actual genocide, because after all no one remembers the armenian genocide.
http://www.armenian-genocide.org/hitler.html
You honestly arguing hitlers and nazisms aims weren't genocidal? 😆
btw mein kampf was written in 1925, in case you didn't notice, he got a wee bit bolder in the following years! 😆
hitlers and nazisms aims weren't genocidal?
Straw man
Are you claiming that cultural genocide isn't an inherent form of genocide? The ICC think it is: https://www.theguardian.com/law/2016/feb/28/iccs-first-cultural-destruction-trial-to-open-in-the-hague
😆
ninfan - MemberYou appear to have forgotten that the removal of the statue and renaming of the park is also undeniably an act of cultural genocide as well
There we have it.
Pulling down a statue and renaming a park are akin to murdering six million Jews.
That wasn't the allegation though was it? It was "they are an ideology based on mass murder" which it doesn't
You can't create a "master" race without removing the "inferior" ones, so yes it's an ideology based on mass murder.
You're not equipped for this.
ninfan - Member
your point
Well, the comment above was that the Nazis "stated primary aim is to murder large groups of people"So, if it's not in mein kampf, then where is it stated?
Here's yer question ninfan, I answered it. Why you changing the subject?
Do you accept that Nazism is inherently about mass murder/genocide or not? a simple yes or no will do.
ninfan - MemberAre you claiming that cultural genocide isn't an inherent form of genocide?
Strawman.
No he wasn't.
It of course isn't, so you're wrong anyway.
It's often a part of genocide, but you don't have genocide without mass murder.
That's part of the definition.
Pulling down a statue does not equate to mass murder.
Again, you're ill equipped.
Are you claiming that cultural genocide isn't an inherent form of genocide? The ICC think it is: https://www.theguardian.com/law/2016/feb/28/iccs-first-cultural-destruction-trial-to-open-in-the-hague
/p>
No - genocide isn't mentioned.
I don't think ninfan actually understand Nazism at all - I think he just gets a stiffy over all those jack boots & their snazzy flags!
The extent to which a large number of posters on this thread are making it about ninfan, rather than the events in Charlottesville and USA is depressing.
teamhurtmore - Member
It's called maintaining a tradition
[img] 
[/img]
Who's joining me in a protest march if we're forced to abandon our tradition of politics threads turning into a trollathon by ninfan?
Troll lives matter.
Troll lives matter.
Troll lives matter.
You appear to have forgotten that the removal of the statue and renaming of the park is also undeniably an act of cultural genocide as well
Do you know when this statue was elected and by whom?
Clue: it wasn't Confederates, so I'd like to know whose culture it is that you think is being eradicated?
undeniably of a genocidal nature
That wasn't the allegation though was it? It was "they are an ideology based on mass murder" which it doesn't
Am I reading this correctly? You're arguing that their ideology isn't based on mass murder, they're just a bit genocidal? So... what, that makes it all alright then, does it?
Honestly, how can you have a sensible debate with someone who will insist for six pages that something isn't black and then when presented with proof that it is actually undeniably they will proudly proclaim that it's actually obsidian?
something isn't black and then when presented with proof that it is actually undeniably they will proudly proclaim that it's actually obsidian.
I didn't know he worked for Apple 😉
There seems to be some question about what Hitler wrote. Maybe we could ask The Orange One ...
Donald Trump appears to take aspects of his German background seriously. John Walter works for the Trump Organization, and when he visits Donald in his office, Ivana told a friend, he clicks his heels and says, “Heil Hitler,” possibly as a family joke.Last April, perhaps in a surge of Czech nationalism, Ivana Trump told her lawyer Michael Kennedy that from time to time her husband reads a book of Hitler’s collected speeches, My New Order, which he keeps in a cabinet by his bed.
https://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/2015/07/donald-ivana-trump-divorce-prenup-marie-brenner