Trail Etiquette

Most mornings I ride this same loop, bit of uphill then a welcome downhill back home for breakfast, some times this one bit I ride in reverse if I’m feeling energetic. Anyway recently on the odd occasion this amazing young goddess puts in an appearance, she has a couple of dogs and Mylo, my Jack Doby cross breed messes with them and we pass on our normally separate ways.
She rides some sort of cross trail thing not even sure what it is, but generally she’s coming down as I’m riding up and if we meet on this narrow bit I pull over to let her through as you would as general courtesy. But a couple of times now well once when it really mattered I’m on the down section and she’s coming up yet still I gave way. It’s no big of a deal I’m in awe of her magnificence, I’ve never met such a fit woman on the trail before so I’m certainly not going to fall out over it on the odd occasion it occurs but it did pose the question, I don’t really like breaking the flow on a down section, technically who should give?

I should know this all the years I’ve been riding, but what is the drill who technically has right of way, uphill or downhill bike on single track for shall we say same sex riders where there is no gentlemanly male female consideration?

What would you do?

this amazing young goddess

I think you answered your own question. 😆

I always thought that uphill rider has RoW? Since its easier for the downhill rider to get going again afterwards.

Take breakfast out for her…

In 30 odd years of outdoor mountain type activities I’ve always be told the ascending person should have right of way .

I’d agree with everyone above, I’m sure I vaguely remember something on my driving test about giving way to lorries travelling uphill, same sort of concept I guess.

If it were surfing ROW is the man on the wave, personally I’m happy to stop on the way up, I’d rather have free flow on the downhill..

Depends BUT uphill has right of way.
If it is easy to stop and restart I always give way to the downhiller as they are having most fun but I do expect to get right of way if i want it.

I’ve always given way to those heading up hill, so those ascending have RoW.

Courtesy says give way to the one coming up as it’ll be more difficult to get going again if they stop, but I will give way to people barrelling down if it’s easy for me to do so or it looks like it might be a challenge for them to stop/slow in time.

So as is often the case my answer is ‘it depends’ rather than a rigid rule.

Uphill RoW +1

I’m going to need a photo before I can decide.

she’s nice enough, but there’s no coyness, just friendly to an old man on his bike and his peculiar dog…

From Derek’s other thread 😉

So, other than just now up there ^ where is it written uphill has RoW?

I’m now forming a cunning plan of head down uphill crash into her gorgeousness, naturally I shall assist her back into the saddle with all deference, hopefully she won’t just think silly deaf blind old git…

But where do I point to that says it?

Depends if you’re on for a strava PB surely?

Etiquette? It’s not golf, wait for the offer, if it doesn’t come the you offer.

You’re new round these parts, aren’t you?
Most STW regulars would know EXACTLY what sort of bike it was, and which tyres.
And then perhaps notice that the rider was an unusual shape . . . 😉

So, other than just now up there ^ where is it written uphill has RoW?

I don’t think it is, it’s just that as amedias says, it’s much harder to get going up hill than down.

dereknightrider – Member
So, other than just now up there ^ where is it written uphill has RoW?

it’s in the IMBA Rules of the Trail..

4. Yield Appropriately: Do your utmost to let your fellow trail users know you’re coming — a friendly greeting or bell ring are good methods. Try to anticipate other trail users as you ride around corners. Bicyclists should yield to other non-motorized trail users, unless the trail is clearly signed for bike-only travel. Bicyclists traveling downhill should yield to ones headed uphill, unless the trail is clearly signed for one-way or downhill-only traffic. In general, strive to make each pass a safe and courteous one.

and general common sense

IMBA ‘Rules of the trail’ who would ever have thought, so where? No don’t worry I’ll go google..

Rules don’t you just love em..

She’s in trouble now then, running over that poor old man, think I should fake something that needs mouth to mouth?

Knowing my luck she’ll be running next time we meet and she’ll simply vault clean over me..

Its not a rule its etiquette so a question of manners.
Its often relatively easy for the person descending to engineer a safe pass by choosing a rougher line or slowing slightly to allow the pass to occur at a safe place. If this isn’t possible I would just wait at a convenient location when descending.

On the otherhand, when ascending and I spot someone descending I look at the terrain and their riding and assess whether they have seen me and will be able to make a safe pass or not and use the excuse for break if necessary.

Luckily, I am not fast up or down hill so having to stop makes very little difference to me so it doesn’t bother me either way.

amazing young goddess

What would you do?

Hora to the forum! 🙂

Depends, if she has a SUP or goatboat you need take the moral high ground and run her off the trail.
Of course, should she appreciate submariner speed craft or tension in a luff then she would be a keeper and should be wooed appropriately.

For mountain biking personally I always give way if I’m climbing. I couldn’t care less if it’s easier for the descender to restart- I’m climbing to get to the descents and I think the majority of people who have a strong opinion on the subject are doing the same so I’ll not spoil someone else’s fun. Climbing’s already pish, stopping for a moment makes it better not worse.

Hmm gentleman-like conduct vs trail manners, I think you’re doing it right.
As the mountie says: “Good manners cost nothing”*

*except a Strava PB/KOM.

Northwind – Member
For mountain biking personally I always give way if I’m climbing. I couldn’t care less if it’s easier for the descender to restart- I’m climbing to get to the descents and I think the majority of people who have a strong opinion on the subject are doing the same so I’ll not spoil someone else’s fun. Climbing’s already pish, stopping for a moment makes it better not worse.

My view entirely, who needs RoW climbing? Any excuse to stop and most days you spot hotshots walking their bikes up why would you need to give way to them? Sounds like an old rule…

Not as I said that it is any big deal in this case, but it does seem wrong.

but for some reason you can’t shoot them then **** them

oh hang on thats a copy and paste from a reply I was going to make to another thread – but it looks funnier here so I’m going to leave it there

where is it written uphill has RoW?

Highway code. Seems irrelevant to a trail but the Highway code has its origins in the early days of motoring and cars weren’t as capable or roads as accommodating as they are now – the principle would be the same on a bike or car or a horse & cart – that you wouldn’t interrupt the progress of someone traveling up hill.

With MTBs theres the trail centre thing where you’re separated from other users and everything is one-way to allows riders to enjoy descents unimpeded and we maybe now take that for granted – but outside those circumstance its the uphillers that get priority

uphillcursing – Member
Depends, if she has a SUP or goatboat you need take the moral high ground and run her off the trail.
Of course, should she appreciate submariner speed craft or tension in a luff then she would be a keeper and should be wooed appropriately.

I don’t even want to consider those words in the same sentence as her glory, she wouldn’t even know or say them and if she did she would simply smile enigmatically but would be thinking ‘tosser’ of anyone who even contemplates such deviances.

Her name by the way (I asked her husband who also walks those dogs and admired my bike) is Alice which proves fate has brought her to me for that was ‘my mothers name’ and when we eventually are formerly introduced I shall take great pleasure in the delivery of that immortal line.

Being serious and not baiting Derek, i agree with the majority on here. The climbs are to be endured for the joy of the decent.

Any excuse to stop and most days you spot hotshots walking their bikes up why would you need to give way to them? Sounds like an old rule…

Giving way to walkers? Whatever next!

I think you should fail to give way next time, and woo her with a robust discussion on how she interrupted your flow.

The rules dictate uphill rider has right of way, common sense and decency dictates that whoever is enjoying themselves the most (the descender) shouldn’t have to stop enjoying themselves.

I think you need to take the time to get the camera out when you do your gentlemanly “ladies first” act. We need picture of this goddess, so we can help identify her bike obviously.

I give way to climbers if I can, but many like myself are happy to jump out of the way when ascending, if I see someone coming down, alway happy to have an excuse to get your breath back

If it’s a cracking descent and not just some random bit of trail that happens to be going downhill then obv give way to the descender. Have been thwarted many times by small groups of nobbers who insist on riding/pushing alongside one another uphill, like the last one is going get picked off by an axeman or a werewolf or something

i suppose their needs to be some sort of general agreement. i’d suggest most proper mountain bikers have a degree of common sense about this stuff. in my experience, its other trail users that complain no matter what you do.

for me though its simple. if i was climbing up a trail and saw someone coming down, id pull over. simply because id remember the effort getting up and the reward is clattering back down again. as long as you get acknowledged for doing so – im happy.

I’m sure yoda could put it better…

The engine may be knackered but the brakes are still good: thus re-starting on a slope is difficult, so give way to old duffers ascending.

Oh, and give way to females always. Like holding open doors and stepping off kerbs, it gets you noticed, sometimes.

Sorry about that. I’ll have a word to my wife and get her let you pass next time. 😉

As per many others up there, for me the person heading uphill has priority, though if I’m climbing and I’m being nice I might well give way, and if I’m descending and offered a clear path I will accept gratefully (and try not to crash)

Highway code rule 155 support this

155
Single-track roads. These are only wide enough for one vehicle. They may have special passing places. If you see a vehicle coming towards you, or the driver behind wants to overtake, pull into a passing place on your left, or wait opposite a passing place on your right. Give way to vehicles coming uphill whenever you can. If necessary, reverse until you reach a passing place to let the other vehicle pass. Slow down when passing pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders.

https://www.gov.uk/general-rules-all-drivers-riders-103-to-158/general-advice-144-to-158

Same applies when skiing – people further down the hill have priority

Give way to people below and beside you on the hill. It is your responsibility to avoid them.

ALPINE RESPONSIBILITY CODE

As for “I hate climbing, I’ll happily stop” – I struggle with climbs and count it as a personal achievement to get to the top in one go. If I was close to cleaning a climb when some **** came barrelling through and forced me to put a foot down, I wouldn’t be very happy about that. not bloody happy at all.

z1ppy – Member
I think you need to take the time to get the camera out when you do your gentlemanly “ladies first” act. We need picture of this goddess, so we can help identify her bike obviously.

I can’t help you with the bike I wasn’t paying attention to the bike bit, my interest for some reason quickly passed to the saddle as she went by, probably because of all the saddle discussions that have been going on on the old peoples thread.. Here’s a nice saddle site to look at

So I can just hear it now ‘Hello darling how’s your run/ride?” ‘Fine dear except that old pervy guy on the mountain bike with the weird dog has started taking pictures of me…’

I believe under british law it is forbidden to immediatly give way, rather one should partake in the “after you” social convention. First proceed to make sure that both of you come to a halt in the tighest of spots the,while mirroring the attempts of the other party to move past you to make sure the impass continues while polity repeat “after you” .

this amazing young goddess puts in an appearance

I’m in awe of her magnificence, I’ve never met such a fit woman on the trail before

Is this really about trail etiquette, or are you using that as an excuse to stop and grab and eyeful when she goes past? 😉

If it was a sweaty bloke, would you be having the same problem?