[Closed] Tim Farron

It's a problem for me. I'm a Liberal, but he puts me off the Lib Dems.

You won't get many replies sadly, because the resident STW Tory trolls don't see Farron or the Lib Dems as a threat (they were bedbuddies from 2010-2015 after all).

What bearing do his religious views have on Lib Dem policies?

https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/11923/tim_farron/westmorland_and_lonsdale/votes

I'd like to try to push him through the eye of a needle. Ditto to Wallop.

#FishFinger

What bearing do his religious views have on Lib Dem policies?

http://www.libdems.org.uk/issues

Can't Christians participate in our democracy?

He's my MP and he's a good bloke. Not a natural lib Dems myself but I'll be voting for him to keep the blue ****s out of my constituency. I've met him a couple of times and he never once shoved a crucifix up my anus. He did (help) save our post office and commiserated me when my bike fell in half on Garburn pass.

Of course they can, as long as they promise to lay off on all that crusading lark..

His voting record on LGBT issues is exemplary and his religious beliefs do not appear to impair his ability to be a reasonable human being.
There appears to be a concerted effort to embarrass him by professional excrement-stirrers in the media. Their efforts show more about them than about their target.

Edit to remove profanity that the swear filter missed due to a hyphen.

I'm not keen on his religious views. However, I think too much is being made of them by either anti-religionists or those with a beef with LibDems in general, as shown on the other thread.

Quite dismaying in that discussion is the anger in some men about their ever-weakening grip on what women do with their bodies. But that's another discussion.

I'd consider voting LibDem as I agree with a lot of their policies and would do so if they were a serious threat to either a Tory or Labour candidate. I bet they wish they had Clegg back. He'd have made far more hay out of the febrile post-referendum atmosphere than Farron can.

Anyway, a vote for them in my constituency would do nothing more than increase the chance of a Tory winning and preventing that is the most important issue for me.

, as long as they promise to lay off on all that crusading lar

😀

Well JC has his own thread, and I thought it the most appropriate place to discuss his religious views amongst other stuff.

About as appropriate as a Sadiq Khan thread in the same vien

DD+1.

Which constituency are you in, DD?

It depends whether they put their faith before humanism and old testament bile before the universal declaration on human rights, Cynic-al. It would also be nice if they were remotely christian in their life style and behaviour. Have a read of the good book and you'll come to the conclusion that Farron is going to have a hard time at the pearly gates.

Watch his conference speech from earlier this year and see what you think. As for his religion, it doesn't seem to interfere with his liberal views. Contrary to the impression you might get from the press and social media his voting record on LGBT issues is pretty good.

Religion is more of a 'sin' than any of the 'sins' they decry.

[quote=big_n_daft ]About as appropriate as a Sadiq Khan thread in the same vien

Should such discussion just hijack the thread about the election then (as it was/is)? Because it's being discussed whether there's a separate thread for it or not.

Not that I'm sure what would be so taboo about discussing Sadiq Khan's religious beliefs if anybody was at all interested in discussing that.

Brizzle East wallop - Kerry Mc Carthy.

(Guessing you're South (Karin Smyth)?

As one of the many people who have joined the party I shall of course be voting for him.
There is no other choice.

[quote=zippykona ]As one of the many people who have joined the party I shall of course be voting for him.
There is no other choice.

I've not quite gone that far, but as the originator of this thread I should declare (as I have elsewhere) that I will be voting Lib Dem - and not even having to cross my fingers or hold my nose to do so (assuming we don't get a total arse like our last 2 Lib-Dem candidates have been, in which case such measures might be necessary).

Yep, south. But I know nothing about Karin Smyth!

Kerry McCarthy generally seems like a good egg though.

Surley the point of being a liberal is that you think it's important for people to act according to their own moral judgement..?

In which case, he can very happily vote for LBGT rights whilst still having his own private opinion.

Along similar lines, I can't stand mayonnaise, it's bloody disgusting, but I wouldn't vote for it to be banned if I was asked to. You lot can all eat it. As long as I'm not nearby.

*checks e-mails* 🙁

Sandwich - Member

His voting record on LGBT issues is exemplary and his religious beliefs do not appear to impair his ability to be a reasonable human being.

Neither of those are true

He has voted for registrars ( public employees remember) to be able to discriminate against homosexuals, he has voted to allow religious discrimination.

He has voted agaisnt party policy when it clashes with his religious views

Sandwich - Member

His voting record on LGBT issues is exemplary

Well that really depends on what exemplary means to you, in the context of LGBT rights. If you think they should continue to be discriminated against then yes, probably.

Surley the point of being a liberal is that you think it's important for people to act according to their own moral judgement..?

Nope - because that takes you into the area of allowing religious or racial discrimination if you have a strong moral stance that you must

Tarnation - I have let myself get sucked into this

Laters peeps

What are all those Remainers going to do now ? There goes their saviour. Turns out he is just a very naughty boy 😉

[quote=tjagain ]Tarnation - I have let myself get sucked into this

You already were, way before I started this thread!

Oh indeed. comment meant for both threads 🙂

What is this lib dem party about? 😆

Farron's Christianity was actually one of the main reasons why I was so wary of the party but two things brought me round:

A: The more Lib Dems I meet the more I'm reassureed that if Farron's faith lead to any attempt to enact any kind of homophobic policies he'd be out on his arse. The party at large would not wear it for a minute.

B: No political leader or party is going to be perfect, if you decide to wait for perfection you'll be waiting forever, if the party is broadly inline with your beliefs then join it, then you can influence it.

So, yup, fully paid up Lib Dem now.

Was excuciating seeing him give that contorted answer to his 'position' on homosexuality - just the political incompetence of it. Interviewer ambles down the green, gently lobs a gentle, telegraphed, long hop down the wicket, and the batsman contrives to wallop himself in the bollox with his own bat.

Nick Clegg is in a different league - very able, to use a Toryism. But politics dictate he has no standing at the present time.

Nick Clegg is in a different league

Christ yeah, he's accepted by everyone who's worked with him as being seriously talented. When he was working as a researcher multiple political parties were fighting to get him to join them, and the liberals won. (I suspect because he realized he'd be a big fish in a small pond.)

He probably thought when he became leader he'd made the right call. I expect hes now wishing he'd joined the Tory party, he'd a least be a minister and who's to say he wouldn't be leader?

Yeah I've never understood the flak Clegg receives - I've always been impressed by him.

Yeah I've never understood the flak Clegg receives - I've always been impressed by him.

Clegg would have made a good tory. He was an awful lib dem whos actions led to the parties collapse

Cos he's an Oxbridge robot that could've played for any of the teams in his inexorable March to success and didn't really give a shit which team that was? Rather than someone who found themselves? there due to some affinity with the policies of the party?

Isn't this the problem with politics these days? it would seem anyone with any conviction in their beliefs is ridiculed and doesn't get anywhere. In order to get somewhere, you need to be somewhat of a policy/belief chameleon.

So is he ok with homosexuality or not? It really isn't a difficult one to clear up...

Just caught him on Peston, reverted to that when my recording of Line of Duty finished - I thought he came across pretty well and certainly not a homophobe.

Just to highlight where things stand.
Current standings according to Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_elected_in_the_United_Kingdom_general_election,_2015
Has the Tories with 330, official majority is 16. Given the Lib Dems lost 49(?) seats at the last election and the anti brexif feelings a lot of people are experiencing it will not take much for the situation to change.
Will UKIP be effective? Will Lab go to Tories? Will the remain tories to to the Lib Dems?

An increase in Lib Dems and possibly a return by some of the bigger names to the party and it's leadership could put them in a very strong position going forward.

It's the reason that everyone needs to get out and vote and think about their choies.
May might have calculated it all out but that doesn't mean that is how it will play out. As said many times if you can get the young out to vote the answer isn't always what you expect.

Another member here although I'll admit I didn't vote for him to be leader.
I'd like us to have a resurgence but I think it will take us a couple of elections to get back to where we were post the coalition, after the tonking we got at the last general election, which was mirrored in our local district council elections I ran in what had been a strong ward for the Lid Dems and all 3 seats went to the the conservatives from Liberal, and the conservatives took a strong hold on our district council holding all but Four seats.
I was asked if I'd consider standing this time in the general but have declined.

Actually, I respect Tim Farron for being a person with his own religious beliefs, and holding his own societal political beliefs. It's his politics that I am going to be voting for, not his faith. The fact that he can differentiate the two makes him all the stronger in my opinion.

Just to qualify:

[b]I will be voting tactically against the Conservative Party in this election because I believe in the NHS, and I believe in being a strong member of Europe. That makes me a Lib-Dem[/b].

This Tory shit-shower need to go.

wallop - Member

Yeah I've never understood the flak Clegg receives - I've always been impressed by him.

The thing people often forget about Clegg, is that he actually did really badly in the 2010 election. The Lib Dems lost 5 seats. The only reason it looked like a success was the lack of a majority- not his doing, he just happened to be in the right place at hte right time and his diminished party was still big enough.

So that's his high point, an unsuccesful election, which was immediately followed by the coalition years, of which nuff said frankly- his own book is critical enough to condemn him. And well worth a read btw

[quote=mikewsmith ]May might have calculated it all out but that doesn't mean that is how it will play out. As said many times if you can get the young out to vote the answer isn't always what you expect.

This is the thing - can we duplicate last year's unexpected voting results in this election? I certainly can't see why it wouldn't be possible given this is far from a normal election and given that the relative turnout seems to have swung last year's results, turnout is also likely to be assymetric this time. As you suggest, all it will likely take is to motivate the young to vote. Given I seem to be collecting a lot of FB friends half my age recently I'm wondering therefore whether to break my self-imposed avoidance of commenting on political stuff on FB (if I'm judging them correctly I don't need to influence which way they vote, simply whether they vote).

bugger - now I'm discussing the election on the thread intended to clean up the election thread 🙄

I guess the leaders names threads are the election threads, if not what is it about - somebody tell me the rules and get me a sub forum quick 😉
What is clear is there needs to be some solid policy announcements very soon.
So far Caps on fuel payments, not sure about Trident and UKIP bigots are the headlines
http://www.bbc.com/news/politics
Yes he needs to sort the homophobic question but he needs to follow that with a clear direction and reasons why people should vote for him. The reason a lot of people get disenganged is the points scoring negative campaining about how bad the other lot would be. However I would reserve a special place for the current government and it's recent problem with promises. A few of those bill boards would be good.

The reason a lot of people get disenganged is the points scoring negative campaining about how bad the other lot would be

I don't think there's enough actual debate about policies, how they would work and what they would achieve. Too much smoke and mirrors.

I've worked for/with and been friends with BACs for years and despite my initial misgivings, they're a great bunch of people. I'm totally non-religious and was still invited to parties, gatherings, weddings etc. They're a great bunch of people with superb ideals which when transposed from religion into their general work/business/personal activities, make them a seriously sound group of people.

Tim Farron's religious views, especially given his voting record, are far from a negative point for me.

TJAgain. [url= http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/jennie-rigg/tim-farron-lgbt-record_b_16095906.html ]Jennie Rigg[/url] would dispute your reading of the man. She's probably more qualified than you or I to make that call.

His voting record on LGBT issues is exemplary and his religious beliefs do not appear to impair his ability to be a reasonable human being.
There appears to be a concerted effort to embarrass him by professional excrement-stirrers in the media. Their efforts show more about them than about their target.

^This. I'm looking forward to voting for them on June 8th! 🙂

Do people believe that a person can seperate their values from their language and behaviours?

Everything we do, say and think is related to our values - why should an MP be any different? If Farron holds strong beliefs about homesexuality, I believe these values will play out in his working life.

Edit: Seen post above. Just voting for a policy is one part - how about all the parts leading up to new policies being introduced e.g. the priority he puts upon the bits of work he wants to spend time on.

edenvalleyboy - Member
Do people believe that a person can seperate their values from their language and behaviours?

Everything we do, say and think is related to our values - why should an MP be any different? If Farron holds strong beliefs about homesexuality, I believe these values will play out in his working life.

Sandwich - and she would be wrong as a more detailed analysis shows

I have read that open letter. Its written by a lib dem activist.

Try this analysis of his voting
https://stavvers.wordpress.com/2017/04/20/tim-farrons-homophobic-and-anti-choice-voting-history-in-easily-shareable-format/

http://bethgranter.com/blog/2017/04/tim-farron-has-voted-against-lgbt-rights-and-womens-rights/

He can attempt to weasel out of it all he wants but his record is clear. anti abortion and homophobic

and to add, TM will change her mind to suit her best interests and JC seems to like sacking people who defy his personal beliefs. Who you going to choose?

Who am I going to chose? I would vote for the candidate most likely to beat the tories even if that would mean holding my nose and voting lib dem
https://www.tactical2017.com/

@mikesmith - the person IS the belief system. It's basic sociology (not meaning that to come across as patronising).

Another way of looking at it. People also know how to integrate. Your friends will undoubtedly act one way in front of you (with them knowing your beliefs) and another in the comfort of their own value driven circle of friends.

Do you tell everyone you know all of your values? I bet you don't. You adapt to your social surroundings to fit in an be accepted.

Sandwich - Member
His voting record on LGBT issues is exemplary...

Do you know this, or are you just repeating what you heard on The Last Leg, verbatim? 🙄

@mikesmith - the person IS the belief system. It's basic sociology (not meaning that to come across as patronising).

Clegg gets a lot of stick from me (long term Lib Dem voter and donor) as he showed he has absolutely no convictions. Having stood on a platform of no tuition fee increases he waved through a threefold increase to £9k pa and he described the Alternative Vote as as "grubby little compromise" before campaigning for it in the Referendum 😯 He stands for absolutely nothing.

IMO the Lib Dems will not see a resurgence in this election. The coalition was a disaster for them and the prospect of an Labour/SNP alliance remains a key driver of the Tory vote in Lib Dem target seats in England.

Who am I going to chose? I would vote for the candidate most likely to beat the tories even if that would mean holding my nose and voting lib dem

There's nothing like voting with your hatred.

You aren't standing for anything; just against one thing.

It would make more sense if you voted for Labour because you believed in it against all common sense. It's how UKIP made great strides.

and the prospect of an Labour/SNP alliance remains a key driver of the Tory vote in Lib Dem target seats in England.

This. Although I think the lib dems are well aware of it.

the problem he faces is , given how the to books contradict each other on issues such as homosexuality, he is either a very poor christian or a very poor liberal.

Clegg was rubbish in that he capitulated on his principles to enable the Tories - I almost feel sorry for him /the party but not quite.

It's less than a week since the election was called. With over a month to go and a lot of ground to cover many things will change. We still have to see how the tories try and appease both side of their own support along with the kippers. May has to defend her record and changes of mind and all parties need to launch their Manifesto and more importantly their Brexit Plan.
It always appeared that TM wanted to commit to nothing until it was too late for any changes, she needs to come out with more of a plan than she has manged so far.

So the real message is give it a week. Then come back with the predictions.

There's nothing like voting with your hatred.
You aren't standing for anything; just against one thing.

In a two party system the best I can ever do is vote for the party most likely to beat the Tories * in the area where I live as nothing is worse that Tory rule.

You can call it hatred if you like or tactical voting as most folk do.

* does not include UKIP

Junkyard - Farrons position on christianity / the bible is the standard evangelical one " "Christianity is not a bit true. It's either wrong or utterly compellingly true" ie as he still states he is a Christian then to him every word of it is 100% true and right and he must follow the bible 100%

This is why he is dangerous in a way moderate Christians who accept the bible as a guide, as parables etc is not.

More analysis of his positions - from someone who is a christian and a lib dem

http://scottish-liberal.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/tim-farron-is-either-wrong-or.html

So will those criticising his views on homosexuality be happy now he has set his stall out at last?

greentricky - Member
So will those criticising his views on homosexuality be happy now he has set his stall out at last?

Bloody grubby line of questioning from the beginning.

Personally, I am going to be voting for the Lib Dems; I live in Oliver Fing Letwin's stronghold constituency. The only chance of one less nasty Tory is to vote Lib Dem. Frankly, Farron's religious views don't even enter into the equation. It's tactical [i]against the Tories[/i].

The Lib Dems are the only party around here that actually campaign for local people, and local people's concerns; the Conservatives have the luxury of sitting back in the knowledge that they are safe, despite the amount of cuts they are imposing on local and county NHS services, Mental health services, children's services, schools, special educational needs services, bus services, civic services . . . the list just goes on and on, yet still agricultural and silver haired people will still vote for the ftards.

But, hey . . . 'sovereignty', right?

In Dorset any national election vote for the Greens or Corbyn's shower-of-shite Momentum rabble is a vote that might as well not be cast.

So will those criticising his views on homosexuality be happy now he has set his stall out at last?

Not until partakes in gay sex on the fourth plinth in Trafalgar Square, but DD +1.

Clegg was rubbish in that he capitulated on his principles to enable the Tories

If Farron is perceived to be a threat by both the Tory/UKIP trolls on this forum and the Corbyn/Momentum trolls on this forum . . . well, that only strengthens my support for him.

I'd rather vote for somebody who recognises and reconciles a conflict in his beliefs than vote for the out-and-out spite merchants.

[url= https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/04/cruel-hounding-tim-farron-bloodsport-secularists/ ]Good article[/url]

With some great contributions from one chap in the comments section...

Tim Farron is the man of the moment. The voters have had enough of roast swan bones tossed down at them from the High Tables of Oxford, they are sick of Jamie Blair's overpriced Italian drizzles and they think Corbyn's vegetarian burritos will give them flatulence. The British people are pleading for Tim Farron's sausage, chips and beans. Forget the sandal of Corbyn, forget the kitten-heeled jackboot of the Maytriarch, it is the brown piss-catcher shoe on the foot of Farron that will be stepping into Downing Street on whatever the date is in June.

and

He's mild, he's bland, he has to rule this land, Tim Farron, Tim Farron.

"Good article"

Agree with every word. Mind you it's pretty much all been said on this thread already.

The trouble is that article does not address the problem - Farrons longstanding homophobia and his complete refusal to answer the questions.

He could have killed the whole line of questioning very simply by making a clear statement that homosexuality and homosexual sex is not a sin - but he can't do this as he is an evangelical Christian fundamentalist who believes every word of the bible is 100% true

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39703444

Seems like a straight answer to me.