The F1 Thread…

WHAT A STRANGE CO-INCIDENCE BOTH AT THE SAMETIME..

Given that it happened almost bang on mid race, I figured it more likely some sort of software bug that hit both at the same point. Interesting (from a geek POV) to find out what it actually was.

Bad luck for Hamilton to have two retirements now – though if RB and the rest can maybe start to catch them up and get between them a bit things could start to get interesting. I think I’d favour LH to be able to get through traffic more than NR. Also don’t forget that it seems reasonably likely that we’ll be seeing grid penalties for engine, gearbox later in the season that’ll move the Mercs (and other cars) several places down the grid putting them well out of place.

Has Massa been taking advice from Maldonado? Make a hash of all the good passing chances before just taking out the opposition.

Interestingly, Perez s on the naughty step for it.

Linky

I did rather think he moved, and very late too. Shame, cause they’d both had fantastic drives, they deserved a lot better than a trip to hospital.

Did merc meant to push a button on lewiss car (worked) but it also transmitted to nicos?

Tell me, have you visited the planet Earth?

Well done, Jenson. Life in the old dog yet…

i love the way “lewislovers” twist everything as a conspiracy against lewis. do you really REALLY think that mercedes would pay all that cash for lewis only to want to nobble him? really!? they have protected lewis in the past ordering nico to stay put – why nobble him now?

Lewis was told to back off and stay put as the ERS was broken and the brakes were overheating behind other cars –
but nooooooo instead wanted to enforce his “dominance” over rosberg and try and win the race. he cooked his brakes.
he threw his points away this week
his excuses will be “cos Iza racer, just like dat Senna”

Congrats to Riccardo – i wonder what he would be doing with a Merc engine in the back ?

^ Please god don’t let a forum of this standard degenerate into the infantile ‘my daddy is bigger than your daddy’ nonsense that plagues the BBC’s F1 stories.

LH’s brakes failed because he was running more rearward brake bias (as per Nico’s radio transmission when he asked how LH’s was different and subsequent message after LH’s failure to change his brake balance as far forward as possible,).

The part of the ERS system that failed was the part that used harvested when the cars where slowing down and took some of the strain off the rear brakes so LH was using his rear brakes far more heavily than NR once the system packed in.

Whislt I would much rather LH won the championship credit to NR for nursing that car home and still getting second.

As for why both systems failed simultaneously that is easy to explain – RB have developed an ERS jammer…

retro83 – Member
I guess Hamilton’s subsequent brake failure could be down to driving style or just from following nico so closely causing an overheat.

Looks like it
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114349

Mr Woppit – Member

Well done, Jenson. Life in the old dog yet…

Bit of luck but some excellent fast laps in there as well. Good drive from him.

Great race over all as well, just a bit galling for Massa.

Its Nico’s title. One Merc driver is consistent, quiet, gets on with it. The other seems to be slipping back into his old ways. Raw speed isn’t enough Lewis. Sorry.

If it was that obvious and LH could have done something about it, the team would have been telling him to drop back from Nico to avoid the brakes failing. They didn’t so it’s just bad luck and clearly not LH’s fault. Much like his other DNF. That people are so keen to stereotype LH as fast but stupid says a lot IMO.

What I found odd was Massa’s inability to pass Vetel after he caught the front three up, he was over a second faster per lap then just had a couple of half hearted attempts to pass, I was hoping he’d breeze past with DRS 😕

Massa has never been much of an overtaker IMO – fast when in a good car and out front but questionable when racing in the field.

I was hoping he’d breeze past

Well he did. Sort of.

Interesting news about Adrian Newey at the weekend too. Looks like RB have paid him a bunch of cash to let him have a go at racing yachts/road cars/Le Mans/whatever and keep him away from the competition. He’d said he was interested in the America’s Cup for a while so perhaps it was more likely that he’d move away from F1 than go to another team, but it’s a canny move by RB to keep him available if they need a bit of help.

I’m not convinced that Rosberg won’t have his share of issues as the year moves on so it’s still way to early to be talking about a champion elect. I do think it’s a bit early to be talking about a Red Bull revival – without the ERS problem the race would’ve been another easy win for Mercedes.

And what does Ricciardo’s performance this year say about 4 times WDC Sebastian Vettel?

He needs a break?

It is nice to see Williams at the sharper end again. I was expecting big things of panda face with the rate he was gaining ground on the front four but he simply managed to show why he was dropped by Ferrari and got a sore neck for his trouble. Time for sportscars I think.

Indeed – he got on with 4 wins in a row, still managing the win even when the safety car put him at a huge disadvantage due to different strategy. I think Canada is also the first time there was anything he could have done different to come away with a win.

massa had drs, but so did the whole chain

so do lewis and nico get grid penalty next time for engine changes?

impressive stuff though fending off drivers 1-2sec a lap faster when you’re a sitting duck, no ERS, no DRS. Nico could easily have been 5th.

Shame nobody saw Jenson find another couple of places on that last lap (as well as the 2 gifted by carnage).

And I’m sure a naysayer must have said “procession” 🙄

Massa was attacking Vettel on the outside into the chicane, each time all Vettel had to do was slowly slide out to close the door and put him on a good line for the corner. FFS man try putting it up the inside cos you aren’t going to drive round the outside in the 1st part of that chicane.

@nemisis
“If it was that obvious and LH could have done something about it, the team would have been telling him to drop back from Nico to avoid the brakes failing. They didn’t so it’s just bad luck and clearly not LH’s fault. “

err they did tell him and they also told NICO…
or do you think they would just see all that data of the rears overheating and not tell lewis

do you think Lewis would not be all over that in the press telling everyone that the team didnt tell him to drop back and cool it, didnt tell him his brakes were cooking and didnt tell him that its obvious the ERS has failed and the rear brakes work harder

he’d be crying all that out like a baby

instead he says almost nothing,
cos he cannot stand to up for his own mistakes,
he cannot stand mentally to think anyone thinks he could possibly do anything wrong or make a mistake, “coz hez senna maaan!”

…yet the team know the truth…

Blimey. Check out the Red Button. Suzi’s boots and Coulthard’s and Jordan’s trousers! Clown clothes or what?

They must have a bet on to see who can find the most ridiculous trousers.

Is she preggers?

@back2basics – there’s only one element of the Mercedes team that screwed up and that’s the designers.

What do you expect Lewis to do? If he sits back 2 or 3 second he may as well just let Nico stroll to a win. Is only hope is to force him into an error – which he did, and for which Nico received no penalty.

there’s only one element of the Mercedes team that screwed up and that’s the designers.

I know, terrible car they’ve turned out this year, hey. 😯

andytherocketeer – Member
Shame nobody saw Jenson find another couple of places on that last lap (as well as the 2 gifted by carnage).

The directing was rubbish wasn’t it? Cutting to extended shots of the crowd or Phillipe’s brother during key battles.

Also Nico was lucky to get away with his error again (chicane cutting). Big benefit this race as well, probably gained a second or so looking at the lap times.

err they did tell him and they also told NICO…

…after the MGUK units had failed. At which point Lewis then ran at 2ish seconds behind.

In earlier radio messages Nico asked what Lewis was doing that he wasn’t – the team advised him it was brake balance. Lewis was running more rearward bias. And if you know anything about cars you know the fronts do most of the breaking, so you could argue he was protecting the fronts.

As also explained after the race – Nico was running in clear air the whole time, and could pick his braking spots so the brakes were never as hot in the first place.

Nico was also carrying a rabbits foot, St Christopher and 4 leaf clover!

Wolff believes that the peak in temperatures when Hamilton made his second stop for tyres just put him over the edge and triggered the brake failure that ended his race.

Nico Rosberg leads Lewis Hamilton, Merccedes, Canadian GP 2014, Montreal

“We told both drivers to manage the brakes because when you lose the electric motor and you lose the electric braking, the brakes are overheating massively,” he said.

“We changed the balance within the braking system and told them to both be careful.

“Both of them complied exactly to what they had been told to do. It was very marginal though.

“When Lewis entered into the pits, with a stationary car, the temperatures rose and when he went out the pedal just went soft and fell down completely. On Nico’s car he was lucky not to have that.”

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114358

Both drivers did what they were told. Except of course no doubt some people know better than old Toto that it was actually LH’s fault. Presumably they’re protecting him, etc to avoid people seeing the truth that he’s just fast but stupid.

he’s just fast but stupid.

Abit too harsh. Lewis is very good but the more the new cars become more complex/develop they require more than just an intelligent driver. They need a multi-tasker.

Lewis would have cleaned up in the 90’s/early 00’s era. Now he’d be better off in different formats/America..

And yet he’s consistently one of the best drivers at saving fuel so clearly he seems capable of managing the new requirements fairly well.

Rosberg had plenty of luck yesterday

Rosberg locked up and got a flatspot under braking for the final chicane on Lap 25 which he missed and collected a warning from the stewards. He could have been given a penalty instead

After his first pits stop he almost collected the wall at the exit of Turn 4. He was behind Hamilton on fuel and constantly asked for brake balance advice. On the radio he sounded panicky. It was less of a stunning drive from Rosberg and more of a stunning recovery from the Mercedes engineers who talked him back to a reasonable pace.

Had he not possessed the rear gunner that was Perez, he would have finished fourth behind Ricciardo, Vettel and Massa.

Cracking race though, and really glad to see Ricciardo win

On the radio he sounded panicky

People read too much into how people ‘sound’ when racing IMO – I don’t reckon this actually gives much of an insight into peoples’ state of mind based on my experiences in sport – some people sound very shouty/agressive/panicky when they’re perfectly calm for example.

Interesting to read the comments here and the press. Will watch the final stages when I get the chance (have some rugby etc to catch up on too). From my (not particularly knowledgeable) perspective it does seem Hamilton needs to be a bit smarter sometimes, he comes over as very do or die (s or bust) and given the issues with the car it would have seemed to make more sense to try and protect some points rather than blow the brakes up. I’m glad there is some in team rivalry and actually it looks smart Mercedes are allowing it, and if there where team orders they would have to be for Rosberg.

What do you expect Lewis to do? If he sits back 2 or 3 second he may as well just let Nico stroll to a win

This is exactly what Lewis should have done.

He would have only have dropped 5 points rather than 20 for a DNF. Now he needs another 4 wins in a row just to catch up with Nico again.

Championships are won on consistency rather than outright pace.

I thought Rosberg’s drive was masterful – can’t be easy to suddenly have to switch mindsets from being miles in front and pulling away with one guy to race to suddenly driving a crippled car and having to preserve the stoppers. And if the the Mass/Perez incident had happened a lap earlier, he’d have won anyway.

Perez wasn’t even trying to get past Rosberg and was simply stopping anyone else from having a go at him.
Rosberg was lucky from that point of view and should have been penalised for the ‘oh look I’ve locked my brakes, I’ll have to take the shortcut’ stunt he pulled when LH was very close to passing him.
To$$er.

i loved the way the BBC cut away from the post-race driver interviews after they have just done 70 hard exciting laps, that we the public have just watched and are really interested in, for…..
eddie jordan nonsense review
stupid sound-track-over-the-top-of-cut-clips-of-what-we-just-saw
and then finish the program.

This is exactly what Lewis should have done.

At the early stages in the race when he was pressuring Nico, the MGUK fault wasn’t an issue. And the team weren’t asking him to cool the brakes.

They are driving the same car, he can’t just sit back and cruise past in the last two laps.

Lewis would have cleaned up in the 90’s/early 00’s era.

How? Lauda, Prost and Schumacher were all brilliant at being fast and clever. Hamilton has raw speed that will see him win many races, but unless he can up his thought process then he won’t win many championships.

Rosberg was lucky from that point of view and should have been penalised for the ‘oh look I’ve locked my brakes, I’ll have to take the shortcut’ stunt he pulled when LH was very close to passing him.

He does seem to have lock ups at times that are rather lucky for him and rather unlucky for his teammate

Rosberg was lucky from that point of view and should have been penalised for the ‘oh look I’ve locked my brakes, I’ll have to take the shortcut’ stunt he pulled when LH was very close to passing him.
To$$er.

Very close to but not actually passing. And he coughed that time gain back up.

Very close to but not actually passing. And he coughed that time gain back up.

TBF he didn’t give the time up (and there’s no rule to say you do), HL caught back up again over the following couple of laps because he was consistently two or three tenths/lap faster at that point in the race. DC was openly saying that although Rosberg didn’t gain a place he certainly gained time by missing the corner.