spokes coming loose on new wheels?

is it normal for spokes to come loose after the first few rides on a new set of wheels? i bought a set of hope pro evo and stans flow from merlin, they build them for me and when i put the wheels on the bike the spoke tension seemed fine. i have so far rode the bike around 12 miles last week going to work and back which is all on rode. today i did around 10 miles off road, nothing to hard with big drops etc. had a rest half way around and checked the spoke tension by hand and found the front was the same as when i fitted it but the rear seemed looser ( am testing by sqeezing the two spokes together were they cross over). carried on riding and when i got back to the car i noticed some were very loose, i could undo the nipple by hand and the rim now has a slight buckle in it? were do i stand with this, send it back and get it sorted or fix it myself?
have never built a wheel or adjusted spoke tension before so dont even no were to start. any info or guides out there on how to do this?

sam

No, spokes should not loosen. Tell merlin what has happened, I’m sure they will sort it out for you.

You can do it yourself – Park tools website has a great guide, but you shouldn’t have to do it. Merlin wheels are usually pretty good though.

I’ve had this happen with new handbuilt wheels – admittedly, the ‘shakedown’ ride was 2 weeks of riding like an eejit in Les Gets. And I forgot my spoke key. Ended up with some properly loose spokes but they stayed straight! Take them back, I very much doubt they will quibble.

On the darkside, my mate’s new roadbike had a spoke-loosening issue. Turns out that the non-drive side of the rear wheel was laced radially. The wheel guy at the LBS (who built my wheels mentioned above) re-laced it with a cross pattern, and hey presto – fixed.

have emailed them so will wait to see what they say about this on monday

Return them as it’s a bad build, they really shouldn’t do that if properly stress relived.

What tyres?

There’s a bit of talk [and it happened to mine] where Stans rims built with their recommend spoke tension and combined with some very tight tubeless ready tyres, Bonty, Schwalbe and some others have suffered some loss of tension on the non drive side when the tyre is mounted.

seems to be that both the rims and tyres are manufactured at the limits of the standard but opposite ends, the rims are as big as they can be and the tyres are as small as they can be

was using 2.4 racings today. and on road was 1.95 schwalbe city jets. both with tubes

I’ve found that spokes come loose on stans rims if you stick to their (low) recommended tension. I find they’re much better if you build them tighter.

And yes, it was a good build. No pinging when first ridden and spoke tension was even (plus/minus 7%) just under tensioned due to Stans spec.

Noticed today that the spokes that came loose are only on the non drive side

That’s not uncommon. The non drive side runs at a lower tension.

hopefully you can get them retensioned ok but a change to something like Contis will help too or some of the older non tubeless ready Schwalbes

I think notubes recommend that you don’t use tubeless compatible tyres anyway

looks like merlin are going to sort this, called them today, they were very helpfull, simply told me the spokes should not come loose, get them packaged up and give us a call and they will be collected and sorted

Sounds like good service from Merlin there, they have always been good when i have used them.

bit of a late update but.. i called merlin on the monday, they had a couirer collect the wheels on tuesday and they came back the following tuesday. wheel now true again. i think they tighterned the spokes up more than usual because when i when on the bike there was alot of pinging.

so far 20 road miles and 5 very light trail miles and still running true, spokes on the non drive side do not seem to have moves at all, they have less tension than the drive side which i read is normal, i can push them apart and make a small gap between the spokes, only time will tell.

i think they tighterned the spokes up more than usual because when i when on the bike there was alot of pinging

😕

Don’t know what the other wheelbuilders think but I wouldn’t be too impressed with ‘lots of pinging’ as that would suggest they hadn’t stress relieved them properly. When I’ve built wheels I’ve stress relieved them several times during the build so on the first ride there’s no pinging.

I’d keep checking tensions for a few rides, better to nip problems in the bud than let them develop and ruin a good wheel.

they pinged the first time i got on the bike and pedelled a few times, they stopped?

Agree with the monk, spokes pinging means they are unwinding under compression which means they weren’t fully stress relieved. If its stopped and wheels are true I wouldn’t sweat it as this is very common but a sign the wheels weren’t built to the highest standard.

Hmmmm, glad someone else is having similar issues…..
I had some ztr flows built up and have had constant issues with them.
took them out for a week in Morzine and they worked loose on the first afternoon of riding and I mean really loose.had them re tensioned for the next day.they came loose again and I had to have them tensioned again. After this they still kept coming loose every day but I could no longer afford to keep getting them fixed so did them myself after that.
They still kept coming loose. Returning home I took them back to the shop and they rebuilt them with new spokes. Sadly by this time though the rim was dinged but anyway, they still rebuilt them. I then went for a ride at coed y brenin on the dragons back and the spokes can totally loose again…
Back to shop again, and they said maybe I was being too hard on the wheel which I thought was bollocks add add razz around the dragon shouldn’t really destroy a wheel like that.they mentioned about the lower tension build on stans rims but said they’d not had any others returned before. That was a few Weeks ago add I’ve not really had much chance to ride out lately but God knows I don’t trust the build. I end up checking spoke tension after most downhills..
Really pissed pdf with it all add this was my first ‘quality’ wheel build and its been problems since the start. 80 quid rim knackered…. 🙁

I had some Crests on wheels from Superstar and the rear non drive side went really loose after a few pingy miles with some spokes going totally loose. The front and drive side were OK though. I wasn’t using tubeless ready tyres, just a normal Nevegal with a tube. I’ve had a few wheels from merlin over the years though, but none on Stans rims, and they’ve been good wheels.

low spoke tension is just asking for problems.
a quality wheel is not the rim,nor the hub,neither is it the spokes.
It’s the build.
There’s nothing magic about that,anyone can do it.it just takes time.
If you’re selling wheels then you can’t afford to spend too much time on a wheel because it makes it unprofitable.I’m not saying they’re all bad.neither am I saying they are bad.
Just that if you spend 3-4 hours per wheel yourself,with decent(doesn’t mean expensive) components,then you’ll have some wheels that ‘stand’.
And if there is a problem,then you’ll know what it is and how to fix it.

Yeah, its tempting to go all preachy and say ‘build them yourself’ but the fact is, like emanuel says, you’re the only person who can afford to spend three hours per wheel getting it perfect. God knows I’m a pretty amateur mechanic but by dint of building my wheels v-e-r-y slowly, they’ve all turned out pretty damn good.

For whatever it’s worth, my Wheelpro/Hope Hoops Flows have been impervious to all harm… Some proper big dings gently flattened back, wheel still completely true.

Have to say this talk of tight tyres causing wheels to loosen doesn’t sound very convincing, not as likely as coincidence anyway.

great spoke calc on wheelpro.
he doesn’t seem to build anymore though.

+1 again for the monk. I built my first wheel nearly 15yrs ago following the instructions on http://WWW.sheldonbrown.com and have built or rim-swapped loads of wheels since for myself and riding buddies. I swapped munqe chicks 717s for 325s for an alps tripped and swapped them back when I got home. Not difficult, not black magic, but very rewarding. Never had a wheel fail and have become popular with mates who’s shop built wheels have.

Just that if you spend 3-4 hours per wheel yourself,with decent(doesn’t mean expensive) components,then you’ll have some wheels that ‘stand’.
And if there is a problem,then you’ll know what it is and how to fix it.

Do you need a proper truing stand and all that jazz?

makes it a little bit easier/quicker.but no.
you can make your own,the musson one seems really good.
but a fork in a vice,or your bike, and some zipties, is all you need.
don’t even need the zipties actually.
just take your time.
cheap shimano hubs+cheap mavic rims+db spokes=great wheels.

I have exactly the same problem with my Hope Hoops on Stans. I have had them for about 3 months and noticed the rear spokes were extremely loose the night before i headed for the Marin in Snowdon.

I will be taking them back to my local shop this week where i purchased them (not merlin by the way). I hope this wont be a reoccuring issue as i chose these wheels over the Mavic because of the weight saving and not from recommendation although the guys in the shop all agreed they were as good if not better.

I’ll keep you posted with how i get on.

ianburley, any updates with your wheels?
mine are still coming loose. have been emailing merlin about other things over the last few days, as soon as i mention this i get no more emails from them. time for another call