Plane crash in the alps

Huge coincidence that the rapid descent started whilst the pilot was locked out. The plane was on cruise, so something catastrophic and unrecoverable happened in that short space of time.

Do they have an image recording ‘black box’ within the cockpit as well as the voice recording one?

No, but they could, the same as they could have a pressure sensor in the pilots seats (same as in cars) to indicate which seats were occupied.

This is another incident showing how planes should/could be transmitting certain information live.

This is another incident showing how planes should/could be transmitting certain information live.

I know quantas have quite a lot of data live streamed back from their newer planes, so much so that the pilots will often get a message letting them know of any error from the ground crew/engineers during a flight.

I’m pretty sure that when the engine failure on the A380 (Qantas Flight 32) happened a few years back the ground crew attepmted to let the pilots know what wasn’t working, but so much was failed it actually hampered them

EDIT: here is the “operations center” https://youtu.be/f7FkTKQ-QRY?t=635

This is another incident showing how planes should/could be transmitting certain information live.

Does seem a bit archaic that investigations are still so heavily reliant on finding a couple of black boxes amongst the wreckage.

Though conversely I can see why pilots might not be entirely comfortable with the thought that everything they say in the cockpit should be broadcast live to their boss.

So if the leaks are true, suicide.

Again, this is not coming from me, it’s coming from an A320 pilot.

The flight deck door can be opened from the outside by a code but the door will only open if the code has been authorised from inside the flight deck by pilot(s). This is to prevent the cabin crew from gaining access under duress. Cameras are installed that allow the pilots to see what’s going on in the galley.

If one pilot is inside the flight deck and another outside and the one outside can’t gain access then it’s either because the pilot inside is actively denying them access or has become incapacitated in some way.

So if the leaks are true, suicide.

or just illness?

It’ll be desperately sad if measures taken to prevent terrorists accessing the flight deck caused this crash.

Illness seems less likely as the plane would have continued at the same altitude on autopilot. As Joe G points out, a steward in the cabin would prevent such a situation if one pilot needs a pee.

I think I’ll stop speculating and wait.

Illness seems less likely as the plane would have continued at the same altitude on autopilot. As Joe G points out, a steward in the cabin would prevent such a situation if one pilot needs a pee.

Some airlines have just that policy.

You won’t have to wait long, wwaswas, the leak will have to be confirmed or denied rapidly. Within a couple of hours.

This is another incident showing how planes should/could be transmitting certain information live.

and if the live feed stops/breaks/interrupted by weather?

TBH you could go endlessly one with ever greater and greater redundancy safety systems…at what point do you stop?

@geetee1972 Probably not a good idea to post access info for secure areas on a public forum, regardless of the source (who clearly isn’t an A320 pilot anyway).

Apparently there was an ‘expert’ on the radio saying there was some sort of lock override available from outside the cabin. Which makes a mockery of locking it in the first place, if true.

@geetee1972 Probably not a good idea to post access info for secure areas on a public forum, regardless of the source (who clearly isn’t an A320 pilot anyway).

This was on The Today Programme this morning

@geetee1972 Probably not a good idea to post access info for secure areas on a public forum, regardless of the source (who clearly isn’t an A320 pilot anyway).

I’d better not post the manufacturer’s master override code then….

and if the live feed stops/breaks/interrupted by weather?

who cares…. it would still be recorded on the FDRs. Any dlive ata is better than no data. It’s frankly ridiculous that passengers can get wifi yet a live data link isn’t in place.

I’d better not post the manufacturer’s master override code then.

1234?

This was on The Today Programme this morning

Not in that level of detail, it wasn’t.

Looking at the sequence of events now it very strongly points to suicide.

The first pilot leaves the cockpit, moments later the plane enters a controlled descent. The descent profile is such that the pilot at the controls would have had to be in control to deploy the spoilers etc to ensure the rate of descent was controlled. First pilot then tries to re-enter the cockpit but is locked out. Banging and noises can be heard which indicates no loss of cabin pressure so points that the crew would not have been incapacitated.

@geetee1972 Probably not a good idea to post access info for secure areas on a public forum, regardless of the source (who clearly isn’t an A320 pilot anyway).

Source:

BBC report on how the doors work on a plane

Clearly nothing confidential in my post.

As for my wife ‘clearly not being an A320 pilot’, er, yes. She really is. Well I think she is. I mean, she gets up every morning to go to work and wears a pilot’s uniform but I guess she could be living a lie.

No, hang on, I just remembered. I proposed to her on the flight deck. The capatain left for a moment (we were on the ground) and I’m sure he would have said something if she wasn’t really a pilot.

Except that was back in 2006 and she was flying the 737 at the time. You know what, those two whole months last December and January she wasn’t here because she was on a conversion course for the A320…..maybe she was having an affair. Or maybe she was abducted by aliens! She might even be working for MI5 (no hang on that was what I wanted to do. I’m getting really confused now).

Oh I give up. If anyone can tell me what my wife does for a living I’d be really grateful.

damn you and your access to first hand knowledge geetee1972 😉

Oh I give up. If anyone can tell me what my wife does for a living I’d be really grateful.

You’re clearly not really married.

Yeah sorry for also being so sarcastic – <offers to shake flapperon’s hand>

Sorry geetee, assumed it was a copy and paste from one of the flight sim pilots on Pprune.

Ooo, it’s all kicking off now…

If it’s true about the lock out, that is bloody awful. It’s bad enough anyway but Christ alight and this would not be the first time by a long chalk. That’s all.

If anyone can tell me what my wife does for a living I’d be really grateful.

GeeTee: Bravo

Just as an aside, and not to make light of this terrible situation, but I really did propose on the flight deck. It was the last time I was every in the command seat.

Honestly I just wanted to share that because I’m really proud of what my wife has achieved and ever time she goes up I barely even think about the risks because they are so utterly negligable. But when something like this happens, for one moment you just end up thinking, what if.

Love you honey!

Probably not a good idea to post access info for secure areas on a public forum

There’s far more detail being discussed on Reddit (And I’m sure a hundred other places), including images from the A320 manuals (don’t know if thats a manual just for the door lock system or the whole plane). Saying “you need to type in a code” doesn’t really pose much of a security risk unless the person reading it knows what the code is.

AIUI (all second hand info from internet experts, so y’know, pinch/bucket of salt)
-The door can be set to open, normal,or lock.
-Unlock means no code has to be entered to open the door
-Normal means a keycode has to be entered and then the door unlocks.
-Locked means that if the correct code is entered the lock beeps/flashes/gives some other alert that someone is trying to get in. The person inside the cockpit then has a set amount of time to reject the attempt. If the attempt is not rejected (e.g. because the person in the cockpit is unconscious) then the door opens. If the attempt is rejected then the door cannot be opened (or attempted to be opened) from the outside for a few minutes. This is there so that if a hijacker has a member of the crew hostage they can’t gain access to the flight deck by forcing someone to enter the code.

IANAP, IANA pilot’s husband, the above could all be lies, don’t trust a word of it, etc etc

It was the last time I was every in the command seat

Euphemism alert… 😀

and ever time she goes up

Such rich pickings… I’ll leave the opposite of that alone… 😛

Knock yourself out Bolbo – I’ll see the funny side 😀

Just spotted the latest details on the news and although the curiosity in me likes getting this information as soon as possible I am wondering if they shouldnt have released it without knowing all the facts as it could point towards a lot of distress going on for the passengers which will not do the feelings of the families much good.

Without all the information retrieved yet no one can draw conclusions, the previous thought that it was another decompression is just a hypothesis, could be wrong, probably is wrong but that was an early hypothesis based on initial info. Now small snippets of important and potentially confusing information are coming in it can cause a lot of jumping to conclusions and a lot of distress for the families.

eg claims of suicide.

It could still be a case of decompression as we don’t have the timeline of events.

illness/pilot slumped on controls unlikely as no course deviation?

Some sort of malfunction?

etc etc. So I am in the “going to wait for more information” camp now.

I know, I’m sorry. It is your Mrs after all but I just couldn’t resist the double entendre.

French Prosecutor: Co-pilot, alone at helm of Germanwings, began descent manually, ‘intentionally’

I am wondering if they shouldnt have released it without knowing all the facts

They didn’t, this has been ‘leaked’. Many of the reports on the BBC start by acknowledging the seriousness of that leak:

Former Director of Cranfield Aviation Safety Centre

Mass murder

The co-pilot of the Germanwings flight that crashed into the French Alps wanted to “destroy the plane”, French investigators have said.
French prosecutors, citing information from the cockpit voice recorder said the co-pilot took sole control of plane and intentionally started its descent.
The pilot had just left the cockpit and was locked out.
Neither of the names of the pilot or co-pilot have been released.
The co-pilot was alive until the final impact, the prosecutors added.
The Airbus 320 from Barcelona to Duesseldorf hit a mountain on Tuesday after a rapid eight-minute descent.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-32063587

So so sad. ALl those people who also had to die. I know suicide is a cry for help but to take so many others with you….

I would, but her pimp would kill me.

Oh boy.

Just back from a ride and checked the news.

Speechless.