Is May about to call an election?

That’s what staggers me. If he simply said “I don’t think homosexuality is a sin” it would be the smallest of smallest white lies. Just say that.

Of if he really can’t bring himself to say that just say: “Strict interpretation of the scriptures says Homosexuality (along with eating shellfish) is a sin, I think that’s a bit harsh and don’t really buy into it.”.

It really doesn’t seem a tricky issue to kill stone dead.

Ahh, he has:

Tory MP Nigel Evans, who is gay, asked Mr Farron whether he thought being gay was a sin. He replied: ‘I do not.’

Damn you TJ, you’ve got me agreeing with ninfan on a politics thread!

However:

It’s not a common viewpoint because it’s fundamentally untrue. He is clearly quite sane and intelligent and sometimes comes out with astute observations like he has here (get him on a non-politics thread, particularly one about access and he posts some really useful stuff). However find me a post of his on the Trump thread where he’s not trolling defending sanity. He gets “ad hommed” on there because people are tired of his posting style and it’s “oh look, ninfan’s trolling again”.

Tory MP Nigel Evans, who is gay, asked Mr Farron whether he thought being gay was a sin. He replied: ‘I do not.’

What a nasty fundamentalist.

😐

Last point on Farron – he has consistently voted against or abstained on many issues affecting womens and gay rights where his fundamental religious views are at odds with his own party.

Were they mainly what is commonly referred to in parliament as ‘matters of conscience’ rather than under the party whip?

He voted for compulsory counselling for women facing abortions.

Would that be a bad thing? I know a couple of ladies who have discussed having an abortion and both found the whole thing a pretty traumatic experience.

He votd for a compulsory ” cooling off” period for women seeking abortions

Again, is this a bad idea?

He voted for allowing registrars to be able to refuse to officiate at gay weddings.

He voted to allow someone to exercise their own personal belief? The Bastard! Next thing he’ll be round making us all eat heterosexual wedding cake.

He voted for there to be no sanction for registars who refuse to officiate at gay weddings

Should doctors be struck off for refusing to sign off abortions too?

Long record of abstensions as well where his fundamentalist views clash with his parties policy – a cynical ploy so he wouldn’t have to be seen for the bigot he is

Hmm, I can think of someone else with a long record of ‘fundamentalist’ views that clash with his parties policy… should Jezza be barred from leadership of the LP?

Tory MP Nigel Evans, who is gay, asked Mr Farron whether he thought being gay was a sin. He replied: ‘I do not.’

Nigel Evans’ supplementary question should have been “What if I’m wearing my sister in law’s knickers with a Cucumber in my ****?”

😀

Anything that means women have to wait longer for an abortion is a bad thing IMO especially as there are time limits. No cooling off period and abortion on demand up to a safe date IMO. No counseling unless requested. If you refuse to officiate at a gay (civil) marriage you lose your job.

Tory MP Nigel Evans, who is gay, asked Mr Farron whether he thought being gay was a sin. He replied: ‘I do not.’

(Caveat – these are not my views but this is what I’ve learnt from evangelicals at uni many moons ago)

The majority of evangelical Christians do not consider being gay (or as they prefer to call it, same-sex attracted) sinful in itself, rather they see it as a reflection of human brokenness; but the practicing of homosexuality is generally understood to be sinful – along with all sexual activity outside of heterosexual marriage.

So the only option is to remain celibate or hope somehow that the orientation changes over time.

Anything that means women have to wait longer for an abortion is a bad thing IMO

I’ve got a friend with a son with Downs. He’s a cracking lad and he and they have a great life.

They’re quite open that they’d decided to have a abortion but the nature of the test they had made them wait a bit (they thought a miscarriage might just happen.)

In that time they changed their minds and have never looked back.

I have a friend who was under a great deal of pressure from a boyfriend to have an abortion. I suspect with counselling she’d have made a different decision. She certainly regrets the abortion now.

As long as there isn’t a pressing cut off point approaching I think an appropriate delay [1] to think it over and counselling are a good thing.

Whether they should be required by law is a different question….

[1] I’ve no idea what that delay might be.

Would that be a bad thing? I know a couple of ladies who have discussed having an abortion and both found the whole thing a pretty traumatic experience.

Yes, because you’re making the assumption that someone is pshycologically damaged – and/or potentially making them feel threatened by having shrinks examine them.

Medicine has a long and sordid history of being used as a tool to control women.

You idiot.

I have a friend who was under a great deal of pressure from a boyfriend to have an abortion. I suspect with counselling she’d have made a different decision. She certainly regrets the abortion now.

Again, you don’t think compulsory counselling is a form of pressure?

counselling is a good idea. compulsory counselling is simply wrong. Insisting on a cooling off period is wrong.

These positions that Farron has adopted on abortion is straight from the textbook of anti abortion activists. Its intent is to try to prevent women from having abortions by putting further barriers in their way.

His voting positions on this are at odds with his parties long standing positions so show that indeed he will put his personal fundamentalist religious beliefs above party policy

I’m far more impressed by the fact that Farron is a Christian but hasn’t let his personal views influence the policies of his party. That’s a huge plus in my eyes and a credit to both Farron and the Lib Dems.

This sums it up for me. He voted for same sex marriage too.

Because Christians often do force their views on other people

I find atheiests and non-believers far far worse in this regard. STW threads are a perfect example, the agressive language used here against people who do have faith is very depressing.

How old is the lad with downs? They might change their minds again.

There are women who regret having an abortion and women who regret not having an abortion and all the anecdotes you can cite. The only ones I know who regret regret because they were under pressure and submitted to it. The woman should decide for herself with no pressure whether it be open or covert – which increasing the bureaucratic hassle constitutes.

counselling is a good idea. compulsory counselling is simply wrong

Because of course the people most in need of counselling, and most prone to PTSD, are usually able to judge for themselves how traumatised they will be, and whether they might need emotional help and support afterwards.

the counselling he voted for was for before not after

Jamba – as I have listed above Farron has shown the exact opposite – that he allows his personal views to override party policy ie he has voted against his parties policy because of his religious views

He is trying to pretend the opposite but his voting record is public

How old is the lad with downs? They might change their minds again.

They might, but I’d like to think a modern day Aktion T4 programme in the name of giving women choice would be a step too far for most.

that he allows his personal views to override party policy ie he has voted against his parties policy because of his religious views

As I asked before, does allowing personal views to override party policy preclude someone from being party leader?

How about this then signed by Farron?

Rt Hon Lord Smith of Finsbury
Chairman, Advertising Standards Agency
21st March 2012

We are writing on behalf of the all-party Christians in Parliament group in Westminster and your ruling that the Healing On The Streets ministry in Bath are no longer able to claim, in their advertising, that God can heal people from medical conditions.

We write to express our concern at this decision and to enquire about the basis on which it has been made. It appears to cut across two thousand years of Christian tradition and the very clear teaching in the Bible. Many of us have seen and experienced physical healing ourselves in our own families and churches and wonder why you have decided that this is not possible.

On what scientific research or empirical evidence have you based this decision?

You might be interested to know that I (Gary Streeter) received divine healing myself at a church meeting in 1983 on my right hand, which was in pain for many years. After prayer at that meeting, my hand was immediately free from pain and has been ever since. What does the ASA say about that? I would be the first to accept that prayed for people do not always get healed, but sometimes they do. That is all this sincere group of Christians in Bath are claiming.

It is interesting to note that since the traumatic collapse of the footballer Fabrice Muamba the whole nation appears to be praying for a physical healing for him. I enclose some media extracts. Are they wrong also and will you seek to intervene?

We invite your detailed response to this letter and unless you can persuade us that you have reached your ruling on the basis of indisputable scientific evidence, we intend to raise this matter in Parliament.

Yours sincerely,

Gary Streeter MP (Con)
Chair, Christians in Parliament

Gavin Shuker MP (Labour)
Vice Chair, Christians in Parliament

Tim Farron (Lib-Dem)
Vice Chair, Christians in Parliament

NO I don’t think it does Ninfan – I was just merely correcting those who claim Farron does not let his religious views colour his political position and showing that indeed the opposite is true – given a choice between his religious convictions and his parties policy he votes with his religious convictions

How about this then signed by Farron?

Yeah, that’s mental (and really funny).

But that’s nothing to do with the (now debunked) claim that Farron thinks being gay is a little bit naughty.

And he’s not the only party leader with weird views on medicine:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-signed-parliamentary-motion-in-support-of-homeopathy-in-2010-10393413.html

Its not debunked at all. He has refused point blank to debunk it relying on weasel words that have convinced some

That letter is mental, but you know what it’s not going to stop me voting Lib Dem, and nor will it stop me from thinking that the Lib Dems having some influence on government policy was (and would be) a good thing.

psst: http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/tim-farron

Its not debunked at all.

Tory MP Nigel Evans, who is gay, asked Mr Farron whether he thought being gay was a sin. He replied: ‘I do not.’

Tory MP Nigel Evans, who is gay, asked Mr Farron whether he thought being gay was a sin. He replied: ‘I do not.’

Yeah, but that involved a nasty Tory and a nasty fundamentalist so let’s just ignore it. Besides, it’s only Christians who are nasty bad people.

TJ of course you are a bigot

Geetee – I loathe and despise religion and the religious, I believe all people who believe in god(s) are feeble minded.

I think the religious, religion and belief in god as an incredibly regressive, negative, dangerous and harmful mental illness. It is a force of incredible harm and holds back the human race.

Its not biogotry.

You do know racists quote science to support their views too.

That letter is mental, but you know what it’s not going to stop me voting Lib Dem,

Wouldn’t stop me either. But if he said it was a sin to w**k vigorously in a cupboard with an orange in mouth my while wearing my sisters bra and watching videos of Jedward, that might put me off him. Has he made an media comment on that?

It is a force of incredible harm and holds back the human race.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother_Teresa

In 1950 Teresa founded the Missionaries of Charity, a Roman Catholic religious congregation which had over 4,500 sisters and was active in 133 countries in 2012. The congregation manages homes for people dying of HIV/AIDS, leprosy and tuberculosis; soup kitchens; dispensaries and mobile clinics; children’s- and family-counselling programmes; orphanages, and schools. Members, who take vows of chastity, poverty, and obedience, also profess a fourth vow: to give “wholehearted free service to the poorest of the poor”.

More good in her toenail than in a thousand Dawkins.

Weasel words CFH

Previously to that one he was asked “do you consider homosexuality a sin” ” We are all sinners” and he made the same “homosexuality is a not a sin” comment in a previous media interview but when pressed “do you consider homosexual sex a sin” he refused to answer.

So what he is doing here is that stating being homosexual is not a sin but having homosexual sex is. thius is in accodance with his views on the bible

He is on record as saying every word in the bible is 100% true or its all false. Now the bible on homosexuality states ” he who lies with a man as with a woman is a sinner” so in Farrons head as he believes every word in the bible is 100% true then he believes homosexual sex is a sin.

What he is doing is attempting to use weasel words on this and he was caught out refusing to say whether he thought homosexual sex is a sin

Geetee – I loathe and despise religion and the religious, I believe all people who believe in god(s) are feeble minded.
I think the religious, religion and belief in god as an incredibly regressive, negative, dangerous and harmful mental illness. It is a force of incredible harm and holds back the human race.

Its not biogotry.

Believing people are feeble minded when you have never met them or listened to them explain their views – that’s prejudice and yes, bigotry. Sorry – you’re bang to rights. If you’re not happy with this label then don’t just complain – have a sit down and a bit of a think. Re-assess your views.

Its not debunked at all. He has refused point blank to debunk it relying on weasel words that have convinced some

Ah, failure to deny an accusation is now a sign of guilt… I fear we’ve been here before.

Whose the bigot again?

Some odd definition of bigotry there mefty – well done for digging up a years old post and for ignoring the fact I apologised for it afterwards

CFH – Mother Theresa – a really bad example. But lets not get sidetracked down this road

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Mother_Teresa

Chaps – I apologised for that post afterwards – ill considered and yes – even tho thats not nice it does not amount to bigotry

On the other hand I think Tim Farron seems a nice bloke, I don’t think he has what it takes to run the country but that is beside the point, he also has the right not to be castigated for his faith especially when it has no effect on his party’s policy. Anyone who knows anything about politics knows that the LibDems are the most ridiculously democratic party where policy is made by the members, so whatever his views he will be bound by that.

Chaps – I apologised for that post afterwards

Sorry then – I did try and find the original post.

Oi – I started a thread for this: http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/tim-farron

ninfan – its not failure to respond to an accusation – its a straight refusal to answer a question

when pressed “do you consider homosexual sex a sin” he refused to answer.

Tricky though, because I imagine gay people do all kinds of things just like heteros do. So maybe Farron thinks oral’s ok, but fisting isn’t. He really would have to go into an embarrassing amount of detail to set out his views. According to Stephen Fry most gay couples don’t do anal so it’s not enough to just say bottie-sex is fine.

Although I do quite like the idea of the Liberal Party releasing a spread sheet of sex acts with sin/not sin against them.

Anyway, I’m off to mail my MP to find out his views on Felching, my vote depends on it!

I’m not sure why Corbyn and Farron threads survive and May threads are deleted/closed. Not that I’d dream of questioning or even discussing the moderation of this forum. 😉

NO apology needed Molgrips – I was out of order and I accepted that.

lol@outofbreath

ninfan – its not failure to respond to an accusation – its a straight refusal to answer a question

Quick, fetch the ducking stool

Anyone who knows anything about politics knows that the LibDems are the most ridiculously democratic party where policy is made by the members, so whatever his views he will be bound by that

A good point, back in the good old days half the party policy was opposed to party policy