German Market . . . .

Muslim isn’t a race, that’s not just my opinion, it’s what the law says

You can wish to redefine it to fit in with your high minded, self important, oh so conscious ideals all you like, but the law says it isn’t

Diddums
That’ll be the Crime and Disorder Act (1998) (as amended), won’t it?
Diddums? 😆
You know a person is out of rational argument when they try and insult.
Not clever and not cool.

Diddums is a standard ninfan retort. If you insist on “debating” a political point with ninfan then expect puerile point scoring, childish taunting, petty insults, and very little else.

Good luck.

You people make me sick.

More French and Belgian citizens are responsible for European terrorism than any other group, you don’t see anyone suggesting we ban them.

Well I have certainly suggested, in fact demanded, we have full control over our borders are are not obliged by law to treat all EU citizens as having identical rights to UK citizens. The connection here is not about country of origin. There is another link, namely a radical interpretation of Islam.

Merkel invited Syrian Refugees, she got a minority of those but a whole lot of people from other nations having no significant threats to civilians. What Germany got was economic migrants and some individuals intent of committing acts of terrorism who where able to enter Germany illegally with minimal checks. This attack was simply the latest and it won’t be the last.

There is no argument for ninfan to win, the result is clear to anyone willing to see. It is with absolute certainty this was an attack carried out in the name of radical Islam. The US and French have been warning about attacks of Christmas markets as that’s what IS is very publically calling for. There where numerous car rammings last year in France at markets and another in Austria at the time of the F1 Grand Prix.

What really really depresses me is the German Authorities have now placed concrete blocks over the site entrance. WTF !! No ***** use now are they ?

The US and French have been warning about attacks of Christmas markets

Always hilarious when the US warns of the dangers of terrorism…

Jihadists have been known to leave or carry their id so when they are martyred everyone knows exactly who was responsible.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-38392128

Looks like you’re most likely right.

Jambalaya , the sad thing is that you , Ninfan and Farage used the death of innocent people to reinforce your right wing ideas .

We all know this was an attack related to radical islam .

But building walls doesnt work , so what else ?

Maybe the day we stop bombing the sht out of those countries , we wont have so many problems .

We have control of our borders and the radical islamists aren’t EU citizens. So other than that, yes, very good points well made.

I suppose the Germans should have sent the refugees back to Aleppo pending consideration of their visa applications, totting up of points etc. FFS man – it’s an emergency!!

individuals intent of committing acts of terrorism who where able to enter Germany illegally with minimal checks.

And you are not going to stop that by closing borders and losing people, that has been demonstrated time after time, that benefit us.
You are scared of Muslims and think closing the door is the answer. If a terrorist wants to travel to the UK with stringent border controls, they will do it. The IRA did, Libyans did, Iranians did. It’s the terrorists that you need to fear and even then grow some balls and don’t let the terrorists win.

From the Telegrapgh. Really not looking good for German Government or security services.

German police hunt Tunisian man after finding identity document

Suspect was investigated over earlier plot, had links to extremist preacher

Berlin terror attack leaves Angela Merkel isolated

Everything we know about suspect Anis Amri

How the German police and security service blundered over the Berlin terror outrage?

A Tunisian man known wanted in connection with the deadly truck attack on a crowd at a Berlin Christmas market had been previously investigated over an earlier terror plot, a senior German official has said.

Ralf Jäger, the interior minister of North Rhine-Westphalia state, said an investigation had been launched against as Anis Amri, who was due to be deported, earlier this year on suspicion of “preparing a serious crime endangering national safety”.

He moved around Germany and lived in several places, Mr Jäger said. Since February this year he lived mostly in Berlin, but he had been back in North Rhine-Westphalia recently.

The man is aged 21 or 23 and known by three different names, according to reports in the daily Allgemeine Zeitung and the Bild newspaper.

Both said asylum office papers believed to belong to the man were found in the cab of the truck.

The documents, which announced a stay of deportation, were found under the driver’s seat of the 40-tonne lorry that barrelled through the Christmas market in the heart of the German capital.

No future as an MP and the right job came up.

I can’t help but think he should have stuck it out. MP is a 5 year commitment, don’t think it’s right to jack it in when circumstances change.

^^^ Corbyn thread 😉

Always hilarious when the US warns of the dangers of terrorism…

Bob try that hilarity in New York. Your chart excluded 9/11 and Homeland Security would say the subsequently low level is a result of the job they do including border control. Half the gun deaths are suicides and most of the rest is gang violence.

Homeland Security would say the subsequently low level is a result of the job they do including border control.

When we all know it’s really because the terrorists commit suicide or are murdered by gangs before they get to carry out their attacks.

outofbreath

I can’t help but wonder if the perp might have left someone else’s identity card behind to throw the feds off the scent….

Well if he did he also left their DNA.

There were signs of a struggle in the truck’s cab and traces of the suspect’s DNA were found, regional state broadcaster RBB reported]

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/berlin-truck-attack/berlin-truck-attack-germany-tense-amid-manhunt-terror-suspect-n698596

When you say gang violence….
Is there not a good chance that your ‘data’ for those ‘stats’ was compiled by people who might not understand how to differentiate between gang members and people in reduced circumstances?
Or perhaps even a vested interest in failing to make the distinction?
Is there a possibility that you’ve reached your conclusion through ideas you picked up from 90s Hollywood narrative?

Well if he did he also left their DNA

That’s interesting do they take a DNA sample of all refugees on arrival?
They’ve had enough time to test for it and compare to a database

That’s interesting do they take a DNA sample of all refugees on arrival?

No idea. I’d imagine the suspect was DNA’d during his previous arrests.

In July this year he got into a knife fight over drugs and was charged with GBH. But he went underground before getting to court.

EDIT If they don’t DNA all asylum seekers then they should IMO.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/berlin-massacre-terror-suspect-anis-amri-has-been-arrested-three-times-this-year-a3426016.html

That’s interesting do they take a DNA sample of all refugees on arrival?

Not as far as I know. I doubt that would be legal under Human Rights Legislation anyway. I do believe they are finger printed (as you are when entering the US)

EDIT If they don’t DNA all asylum seekers then they should IMO.

And the rest of the population, I’ll throw in ID cards into the mix too. It’s a well known fact that countries that collect DNA from all citizens and use ID cards have zero crime rates.
I’ll go first as I’ve nothing to hide.

It’s a well known fact that countries that collect DNA from all citizens and use ID cards have zero crime rates.

Maybe they have lower crime rates than they would otherwise have and ID makes police work easier.

Maybe they have lower crime rates than they would otherwise have and ID makes police work easier.

Or maybe there’s no difference. I actually agree with ID cards as it can help in so many ways and we do have, in all but name, ID cards here anyway. 🙄
I’d be happy for you to pull up stats that support your statement.

Classic and tragic aslyum seekers issue. The Tunisians did not want him back and denied he was Tunisian. Germans tried to deport him and could not despite his history including GBH with a knife.

It’s not hard to imagine Tunisia assuming all asylum seekers who have been in Syria are likely to have been there fighting in the civil war (I recall there are 10,000 Tunisians fighting with IS). We have already seen Morocco reject close to 5000 deportations from Germany.

Does anyone know how much the war against ID card fraud will cost?

No but we can just ask the French. No more than the war against passport fraud, we could just use passports.

Classic and tragic aslyum seekers issue. The Tunisians did not want him back and denied he was Tunisian. Germans tried to deport him and could not despite his history including GBH with a knife.

How is it classic?

My ID card is two years out of date but still valid (and will be for another three years). I find it useful but as an anti-crime measure it’s useless. Contrary to popular British opinion I’m not obliged to have one and carrying it isn’t obligatory either.

My ID card is two years out of date but still valid (and will be for another three years). I find it useful but as an anti-crime measure it’s useless. Contrary to popular British opinion I’m not obliged to have one and carrying it isn’t obligatory either.

Does it make life easier when dealing with the telephone company, for example? I get sick of giving personal details every time I want a new contract for something, or everytime I call them up.

Background checks for asylum seekers or indeed border checks between EU countries ?

Tunisia’s Mosaique FM radio reports that the man being sought had previous convictions in Italy and his home country.

Mosaique FM quoted Anis Amri’s father saying that his son left Tunisia about seven years ago and spent four years in a prison in Italy after being accused over a fire at a school.

He then moved to Germany more than a year ago. The father did not provide details and said he had no contact with his son, although his brothers did.

Mosaique FM quoted Tunisian security officials as saying that Amri was also convicted in absentia for aggravated theft with violence and sentenced to five years in prison.

@Edukator If you don’t have it with you, you are obliged to report to the Police station with it within 5 days. I like the Carte Vitale idea, no card you pay.

How is it classic?

Because it’s happened thousands and thousands of times before. Deporting failed asylum seekers is in practice very difficult.

background checks, and better still, border checks between Yorkshire and London too.
I’m all for it.
Proper border too. Every passenger to walk through a full body scanner either at KX St. Pancras or Euston, or @ South Mimms border control if travelling by car.
Maybe 7/7 might not have happened.

🙄

Nothing makes dealing with phone companies easier, anywhere, Captain. For most formalities I just hand over the card with the words “l’adresse est toujours bonne” and they note what they need.

I’ve had two “contrôles d’identité” as a pedestrian in thirty years, a few in a car and none on a bike, so you know how to travel if you are a criminal.

No ID checks even for the festive season firework display but there were barricades, a bag ban, police checks (but no ID asked for) and more importantly municipal trucks blocking the road in.

Because it’s happened thousands and thousands of times before. Deporting failed asylum seekers is in practice very difficult.

Citation obviously needed from the neutral press, non of these right wing blogs, if you don’t mind.
😆

No Jamba. You don’t even need an ID card. Either they take you in or let you go.

Well never mind the Government website, if Mrs B carries her ID and passport everywhere and says it’s necessary who am I to argue ? (I understand the concept of higher authority, national govt vs ecj/wife) Also what does this really mean in practice ? “plus longue”

Par ailleurs, si vous êtes soumis à un contrôle d’identité par la police ou la gendarmerie, la procédure sera plus longue si vous ne pouvez pas présenter de pièce d’identité.

@Captain ’twas on the BBC I think – do you really expect me to google it 😉 ? The Germans have been paying Afghans to go back, few hundred euros a head plus a free flight. Some Syrians have been leaving Sweden voluntarily as its not as comfortable as they’d hoped.

No ID checks even for the festive season firework display but there were barricades, a bag ban, police checks (but no ID asked for) and more importantly municipal trucks blocking the road in.

Ditto here in Levallois. I’d like to hear the German authorities explanation for no security.

Levallois

y a pire. 😉 You didn’t bump into the Balkany couple did you?

NSW down here just passed a stupid must carry ID on the bike law, eventually had to get rid of it as pointless and unenforceable.

ID Cards may be part of a much bigger method of crime prevention but how would it have stopped this attack?

Imagine if the US/UK/NATO declared war on domestic violence.

Merkel said this a week ago

But she has warned, too, of the danger of blowing out of proportion the security threat posed by asylum seekers, or of making sweeping statements – not backed up by facts – about criminal foreigners.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/germany-to-set-up-150m-deportation-fund-for-failed-asylum-seekers-1.2899542

Good point, perhaps your should take a read of the article below. You are more at risk of heart disease than terrorism, driving poses a higher risk, walking around in the US poses a risk. Terrorism is always highlighted and the result blown up.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-15/should-we-be-most-concerned-about-cars-planes-or-terrorists/8122956

Merkel said this a week ago

And she could definitely repeat it today. Even more appropriate now.

There are 60 Christmas markets in Berlin. The notion that you can somehow protect all these public spaces from a nutcase in a runaway articulated lorry is, quite frankly, absurd.