EU Referendum – are you in or out?

The end of FOM was always going to be a nightmare for industry, EU NHS staff are already leaving n droves, still huge shortages across the construction sector, farms dependent on migrant labour.

It’s ok, there’s a plan. It’s called child labour. Quite how they’re going to get 15 and 16 year-olds to do skilled jobs like nursing and construction is anyone’s guess, but I’m sure it’ll all be sorted with some positive thinking and good old wartime make do and mend spirit!

Yeah daz I saw that. Hilarious. Seems the Brexit rescue plan is what I used to do at the greengrocer’s for a tenner a day 35 years ago.

I presume we’ll be putting that child labour to appropriate use by re-opening the pits, and firing up the Spinning Jennies as we return to the glory days of Empire?

What happens then? Who knows? Its impossible to predict anything at the moment. But I very much doubt it’ll be good.

State of Emergency? Military Dictatorship?

if what gets delivered isnt what was ordered; it gets cancelled … and a new order is put in

I’m sorry, what?[/quote]
I’m glad I’m not the only one confused by that. Does it mean if your latte is wrong you order a different one, or does it mean if the settlement offered by the EU isn’t what you want you can somehow demand something different?

I presume we’ll be putting that child labour to appropriate use by re-opening the pits, and firing up the Spinning Jennies as we return to the glory days of Empire?

Each infantry platoon will be gaining a drummer-boy.

The Spanish are quaking already.

sbob – Member
mooman – Member
Some peoples glass is always half empty; why not focus on what good may happen – instead of what bad could?

Are you new here?

yeah sbob has no ideas either 😉

Molgrips I could not find a source tonsee Fallon’s quote in context. By the way IMO we need full exit checks like other countries do as otherwise you have no idea who is still here/overstayed their visa etc.

From Fishing for Leave

A graphic illustration of the criminal waste EU legislation causes.

Tons of prime sea bass discarded dead because they are the “wrong” species.

Quotas and species bans force fishermen to discard, in many cases upto 50% of the fish we catch equating to around a million tons annually.

Quotas are a disaster economically, socially and operationally. They will never work in Britain’s rich mixed demersal fisheries.

They lead to increased mortality as vessels have to catch more fish to find what they are allowed to keep whilst the system is financially crippling the industry.

If the EU was to make off with 59% of our livestock and made us shoot half our cows and sheep to leave them dead at the side of the road there would be national uproar.”

The discard ban will result in ‘choke species’, when a vessel or area runs out of the lowest species all fishing must stop as they will inevitably catch it whilst continuing to fish for others. This will decimate the British fleet Brexit or not.

We must scrap the cause, quotas, not ban the symptoms, discards.
The only way to manage mixed fisheries is with days-at-sea system, where vessels are given a set number of hours out on sea and can keep everything they catch.

This would mean vessels would catch less but land more meaning less environmental impact and greater industry profitability.

A minority of politicians and vested quota interests claim effort control will lead to vessels targeting the highest value species, but Fishing for Leave have devised a system to avoid such actions.

We propose a system of flexible catch compositions with a time penalty system to encourage vessels to avoid particular species.

Vessels will have to aim for a certain percentage of their catch to to be of a certain valuable species, however they needn’t discard if this percentage is exceeded.

They can sacrifice time at sea in compensation – time they will no longer need as they have a viable catch aboard.

In the case of the scandalous dumping of the sea bass or Cod in these pictures. Our system would have allowed the skipper to keep all this fish.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/787557/eu-common-fisheries-policy-125000-dumping-sea-bass-fixed-quota-allocation-fishing

linking from the express must be true!

its a good job our brexie MEPs have been so dedicated to championing reform

ver the three years that Nigel Farage was a member of the European Parliament Fisheries Committee, he attended one out of 42 meetings.

http://www.greenpeace.org.uk/media/press-releases/farage%E2%80%99s-voting-record-fishing-%E2%80%98makes-mockery%E2%80%99-new-election-poster-20150408

if only rather than flouncing off Britain had chosen to stay and improve the regulations….

Will somebody not think of the sea bass?!!

A minority of politicians and vested quota interests claim effort control will lead to vessels targeting the highest value species, but Fishing for Leave have devised a system to avoid such actions.

We propose a system of flexible catch compositions with a time penalty system to encourage vessels to avoid particular species.

Vessels will have to aim for a certain percentage of their catch to to be of a certain valuable species, however they needn’t discard if this percentage is exceeded.

Lucky we’re doing in with all the red tape, eh?

A graphic illustration of the criminal waste EU legislation causes.

There’s always bad legislation. It can come from anywhere. You have to work with it or get it changed. Pulling the country’s life support is unlikely to be a solution!

From Fishing for Leave

You can’t run a fish protection policy without discard. As soon as you allow high value fish that have been ‘accidentally’ caught to be sold, every fisherman will simply go after high value fish.

If you somehow impose an alternative penalty for catching certain fish that’s worse than forcing them to discard they’ll chuck the fish over the side which is… discard.

The only way to run a fishing industry that protects stocks without discarding anything is to nationalize the industry and set a policy of which fish fishermen can go after. Then you’ll know that any high value fish they ‘accidentally’ catch really were caught accidentally and you can allow those to be sold.

Playlist again.

Can’t believe we haven’t had Bob Marley’s excellent album Brexodous yet.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/apr/05/woman-found-dead-in-bristol-feared-deportation-after-brexit-vote

RIP.

The ‘red lines’ document just passed by the European Parliament (and voted for by the SNP too .. fascinating).

Point 27 leaves some hope.

27. Takes note that many citizens of the United Kingdom have expressed strong opposition to losing the rights they currently enjoy pursuant to Article 20 of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union; proposes that the EU-27 examine how to mitigate this within the limits of Union primary law whilst fully respecting the principles of reciprocity, equity, symmetry and non-discrimination;

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?type=MOTION&reference=P8-RC-2017-0237&format=XML&language=EN

Matt – probably not related, but there are some interesting winds at the moment.

Spanish centre-right MEP Esteban Gonzalez Pons accused the UK government of “preventing Scotland staying part of Europe while at the same time they want… Gibraltar to continue to be a tax haven”.

So Farage says he’s not optimistic about the brexit talks. He should think more positively and stop all this doom and gloom.

You can’t run a fish protection policy without discard. As soon as you allow high value fish that have been ‘accidentally’ caught to be sold, every fisherman will simply go after high value fish.

If you somehow impose an alternative penalty for catching certain fish that’s worse than forcing them to discard they’ll chuck the fish over the side which is… discard.

Exactly.

I have a mate who has a degree in Marine Biology and ended up working on the boats inspecting the catch. Blimmin awful job by all accounts as he was generally despised by the crews who saw him as someone there to stop them making money (from illegal catches) rather than someone who protects their long term livelihood by trying to keep the fish stocks sustainable.

(he gave it all up in the end and became a professional puppeteer!)

So Farage says he’s not optimistic about the brexit talks. He should think more positively and stop all this doom and gloom.

Project Fear, innit.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/apr/05/bmw-strikes-mini-rolls-royce-unite-pension#comment-96152280

Back the the 70’s so soon. When do the power cuts start so i can stock up on Candles?

And for a positive spin, anyone planning on setting up a candle factory. Might be a good time to invest in Camping Gas equipment as well.

outofbreath – Member

You can’t run a fish protection policy without discard. As soon as you allow high value fish that have been ‘accidentally’ caught to be sold, every fisherman will simply go after high value fish.

If you somehow impose an alternative penalty for catching certain fish that’s worse than forcing them to discard they’ll chuck the fish over the side which is… discard.

There’s alternatives but they’re not easy- one approach is to have price controls whereby fish can still be landed, and can be sold at a price that makes it worth not just discarding (ie, make it equal to the opportunity cost of bringing them in) but not worth intentionally catching them. But that’s easy to say, not easy to do, and it’d mess with the pricing market massively.

Discards are a terrible idea but they’re a less terrible idea than having a profitable business in landing prohibited fish. Fishing For Leave’s suggestion could concievably work but it has the same issue as price setting- getting the balance between making it punitive (so that people still discard) and too weak (so that it’s profitable to catch the prohibited fish then tie up) might just not be possible- and the problem is, the industry would cry havoc if it penalises them and take the piss if it doesn’t.

(he gave it all up in the end and became a professional puppeteer!)

Muppet.

(I’ll get my coat)

Matt – probably not related, but there are some interesting winds at the moment.

Unravelling before their eyes.

“Undemocratic” EU’s Parliament, to, err, democratically vote on Brexit deal.

Any Brexit deal would require Parliament approval. Read more about its red lines @ https://t.co/UXOMIQSfyE pic.twitter.com/vvEv1bs9Ks

— European Parliament (@Europarl_EN) April 5, 2017

😉

(that would be the same deal our PM doesn’t want our Parliament to vote on).

jambalaya – Member
We are a small scale seller of weapons to Saudi. French are 4x us and US bigger again. Let me find some numbers

We’re not small scale just because other countries sell more (we’re second highest in EU)

jambalaya – Member
We are a small scale seller of weapons to Saudi.

I think that May is trying to rectify that asap

Fox sucking up to Duterte is evidence that brexit has put paid to any vestiges of principles we might once have had

Fox sucking up to Duterte is evidence that brexit has put paid to any vestiges of principles we might once have had

Any port in a storm? Guess ‘we’ are desperate for trade deals.

Duerte? But we share his values. Fine chap.

Ive got absolutely no doubt that Liam Fox shares his values

Thank god we are no longer part of the corrupt and undemocratic EU and definitely not cosying up to some of the word’s most corrupt and undemocratic regimes out of desperation.

^^ word.

binners – Member

Because its pretty self-evident to anyone with anything between their ears …

As the months ahead go by this will become more and more apparent to even the most terminally dense

It must really irritate you to know that you are unable to get your own way … even more so because of people you feel you are so intellectually superior to Old Wise One. 😐

mooman – Member
It must really irritate you to know that you are unable to get your own way … even more so because of people you feel you are so intellectually superior to Old Wise One.

Judge a tree by its fruit.

Brexit has unleashed some pretty nasty xenophobia, with actual deaths resulting. And we have the spectacle of Liam Fox cuddling up with his new best buddy, Duterte. Sterling has slumped, so made a giant hole in the budgets of the NHS and MoD, and the government seem to be just ignoring the effects on the economy and hoping it will sort itself out.

Meanwhile on the positive side, perhaps you could enlighten us as to the delightful fruit this tree has brought us?

Or indeed just clarify what you mean by:

if what gets delivered isnt what was ordered; it gets cancelled … and a new order is put in

Which had at least 3 people saying: what??

It must really irritate you to know that you are unable to get your own way … even more so because of people you feel you are so intellectually superior to Old Wise One.

It’s not half done yet dood.

It must really irritate you to know that you are unable to get your own way … even more so because of people you feel you are so intellectually superior to Old Wise One.

I’d say it’s more irritating to see those who voted for Brexit come on here and re-enforce the idea that they have no clue what they actually voted for .

Ah well it’ll all come out in the wash, certainly a good chapter in future school textbooks about the gradual disintegration of the United Kingdom at the hands of unchecked nationalism.

It must really irritate you to know that you are unable to get your own way … even more so because of people you feel you are so intellectually superior to Old Wise One

People voted for a lie that will harm us and wont deliver what they expected to happen. Why would anyone be pleased?

Step back from your skinny-latte`s and crystals balls of doom … if what gets delivered isnt what was ordered; it gets cancelled … and a new order is put in.

What the fuckitybugger??

It’s not bloody Amazon we’re dealing with here….

Who gave the kindergarten a say in this?!

Who gave the kindergartennursery a say in this?!

we’ll have less of that thanks! 😉