Charlottesville

dissonance

No.
It is so badly wrong that it does start to appear to be an attempt to confuse matters.

A fringe group of flag waving rednecks (nazis) got their man into the Whitehouse.

Could you explain that sentence for me?

Most Trump voters are not Nazis, but most Nazis are Trump voters.

Clear enough?

Replace ‘race’ with ‘cult’ and that describes Islamism perfectly, which despite continued denials is the REAL fascist threat we face, rather than a fringe bunch of rednecks waving flags.

Despite the right being responsible for 75 percent of terrorism deaths in the US since 07?

fin25 – Member

Most Trump voters are not Nazis, but most Nazis are Trump voters.

Clear enough?

That’s a nice throw away statement but it does nothing to explain how “they got their man into the whitehouse”.

Are we saying that despite being a tiny group of people who aren’t representative of most republicans, they were happy that they got someone in the whitehouse who they feel represents them?

Or are we saying that due to a concerted campaign effort by Neo Nazis and white supremacists they were able to convert a substantial amount of undecided voters to vote Trump and/or were able to dissuade young black males in swing states not to vote for Hilary? IE they proactively did something to effect that result or they represent a large enough numbers of voters to have effected the outcome.

I can take both meanings from it, but there’s quite a difference in the statements.

what’s throwaway about my statement, jimjam?

Oh no Ive always said that it was Putin that got their man in the whitehouse

fin25 – Member

what’s throwaway about my statement, jimjam?

There’s no substance to it. Unless you can tell me percentages then I feel like it’s just another way to say Trump is a nazi.

kimbers – Member

Oh no Ive always said that it was Putin that got their man in the whitehouse

There’s more truth in that statement imo.

jimjam – Member
So just to clarify, Republicans are Nazis?

nope, but I’d think it’s fair to say the republicans have a nazi problem.

seosamh77

nope, but I’d think it’s fair to say the republicans have a nazi problem.

Most Trump supporters are not nazis. 70% of them are not nazis.

jimjam – Member
seosamh77
nope, but I’d think it’s fair to say the republicans have a nazi problem.

Most Trump supporters are not nazis. 70% of them are not nazis.So you saying 30% of them are nazi’s?

I have no idea, it just seemed like a good number.

kimbers – Member
Oh no Ive always said that it was Putin that got their man in the whitehouse

There’s more truth in that statement imo.

There’s no substance to it. Unless you can tell me percentages then I feel like it’s just another way to say Trump is a nazi Russian Patsy

See what I did there?

jimjam – Member
I have no idea, it just seemed like a good number.

so, you have no idea what you are talking about?

I’m interested though ninfan. Do you agree with the President’s statement

yes

I think I’ve been very clear that the issue is freedom of speech, freedom of belief, and freedom of protest, ought to be absolute (within the caveat of the laws preventing direct incitement to violence, criminal damage and protecting the rights of others, and applied fairly and without favour). Nazis have just as much right to protest as Jews, communists, gays or muslims, none of them have the right to threaten or arrack others,

Despite the right being responsible for 75 percent of terrorism deaths in the US since 07?

What’s so special about 2007? Sounds a lot like the type of cherry picking climate change deniers do, why not expand it to another randomly picked date like, well, oh, how about august 2001?

fin25

There’s no substance to it. Unless you can tell me percentages then I feel like it’s just another way to say Trump is a nazi Russian Patsy

See what I did there?

No, there was an actual vote to decide who got into the whitehouse. Meaning if you know the number of nazis, you can quantify the extent to which they influenced the election.

There’s another thread to discuss Trump’s ties with Russia.

seosamh77

so, you have no idea what you are talking about?

I was being sarcastic. Shoot me.

I’m not saying that Nazis strongly influenced the election, but Trump is definitely their guy, there’s plenty of evidence of that, from direct quotes to statements on their own filthy websites. Also note Trump’s difficulties saying that Nazis are bad, which went down a storm with, you guessed it, Nazis.

ninfan – Member
I’m interested though ninfan. Do you agree with the President’s statement
yes

I think I’ve been very clear that the issue is freedom of speech, freedom of belief, and freedom of protest, ought to be absolute

It’s not really absolute though, hence why there’s incitement to hatred laws for example, there’s plenty of restriction on what people can say or protest about.

Absolute freedom of speech is a myth.

I can’t find any consistent information. It looks like there’s about 3000 – 10,000 KKK members in the US. There doesn’t seem to be any info as to how many members the American Nazi Party has.

jimjam – Member

I was being sarcastic. Shoot me.

Yer alright, I’m fine with establishing your bullshit! 😆

I’m not saying that The IRA strongly influenced the election, but Corbyn is definitely their guy, there’s plenty of evidence of that, from direct quotes to statements on their own filthy websites. Also note Corbyns difficulties saying that The IRA are bad, which went down a storm with, you guessed it, The IRA

Odd what happens when you point to someone’s supporters as proof of their beliefs and affiliations, isn’t it?

Can’t disagree with that at all ninfan.
Because we’re not all Corbyn fans you know…

It’s not really absolute though, hence why there’s incitement to hatred laws for example, there’s plenty of restriction on what people can say or protest about.

Absolute freedom of speech is a myth.

Yes, if only I had provided some form of ‘caveat’ within brackets saying that….

What’s so special about 2007? Sounds a lot like the type of cherry picking climate change deniers do, why not expand it to another randomly picked date like, well, oh, how about august 2001?

because one event distorts the entire trend.
How many White Christian Americans have killed other Americans this year?
How many are killed by guns each year?
How many terrorism deaths?

As for your IRA broken record give it a rest. It was put to bed very early on with simple reasoning and logic. Corbyn wouldn’t single out the IRA.

How is Darling Donald doing, Monday condemm one side, Tuesday after his BFF and AltRight chum Bannon reminded him that those rednecks and Nazi’s are the last of his core support so he had better not upset them too much. By the time I land tomorrow morning we don’t know who’s fault it will be but I’m sure some golf will be getting planned.

Have we done that even P***s M****n thinks he’s in the wrong now?

No, No, NO, Mr President @realDonaldTrump.
There is NO defence for neo-Nazis.
None.
Zero.
Zilch.
So stop pandering to these vile scum.

ninfan – Member
I’m not saying that The IRA strongly influenced the election, but Corbyn is definitely their guy, there’s plenty of evidence of that, from direct quotes to statements on their own filthy websites. Also note Corbyns difficulties saying that The IRA are bad, which went down a storm with, you guessed it, The IRA
Odd what happens when you point to someone’s supporters as proof of their beliefs and affiliations, isn’t it?

I think it’s fairly obvious that corbyn has sympathies towards a united ireland. So while he may not support their methods, he definitely agrees with their aims.

So taking your logic to it’s conclusion.

Which nazi/white supremacist/kkk aims does trump agree with?

Which nazi aims does trump agree with?

i think the only thing that donald j trump believes in is donald j trump….

What’s so special about 2007? Sounds a lot like the type of cherry picking climate change deniers do, why not expand it to another randomly picked date like, well, oh, how about august 2001?

Because to get an accurate picture of trends, you sometimes have to trim an anomalous outlier – as others have mentioned.

The cluster, in terms of attacks carried out or attempted, even including 9/11 would still heavily skew towards the right.

You’re a terrorist apologist as well as a Nazi now, Ninfan.

so taking your logic to it’s conclusion.

Which nazi/white supremacist/kkk aims does trump agree with?

Ooh, ooh, let me guess, Is it the ones who want to gas his Jewish grandchildren?

jam bo – Member
Which nazi aims does trump agree with?
i think the only thing that donald j trump believes in is donald j trump….

I disagree, he’s got a clear agenda of enrichment of him and his buddies.

Btw i don’t actually believe trump has nazi/kkk/white supremacist sympathies.

It’s fairly obviously though that there’s a tacit encouragement of this type of group though. For what reason. Well fairly simple, it’s yet another cloud obscuring what he and the republicans up to in the background.

> Do you agree with the President’s statement
yes

I think I’ve been very clear that the issue is freedom of speech

You haven’t (some may say deliberately so) which is why people were concluding you were a nazi sympathiser.

If your motivation is purely as a libertarian then you could easily have inserted a little qualifier like: “I agree that racism, nazis, KKK and white supremacists are repugnant and against everything America is founded on, but I believe they have the right to free speech and legal gatherings”.

You’re answer will be of course be “Why should I?”, but what you really mean is “I get more bites if I don’t make that clear”.

ninfan – Member
so taking your logic to it’s conclusion.
Which nazi/white supremacist/kkk aims does trump agree with?

Ooh, ooh, let me guess, Is it the ones who want to gas his Jewish grandchildren?

I’m just taking your ridiculous point and putting it back on ye.

No, I don’t believe he has nazi sympathies, see above.

How is Darling Donald doing..

You missed the bit where, after condemning hate and violence where someone was run over and killed he then tweeted a cartoon of a CNN reporter being run over by a Trump train. 🙄

I think I’ve been very clear that the issue

Whilst you are being very clear could you elaborate on the claims you made about credible sources saying the poor nazi was fleeing from those nasty lefties when he drove into the crowd.
Do you still think this is the case and can you list those credible sources?

If your motivation is purely as a libertarian then you could easily have inserted a little qualifier like: “I agree that racism, nazis, KKK and white supremacists are repugnant and against everything America is founded on, but I believe they have the right to free speech and legal gatherings”.

He doesn’t believe in freedom of speech or expression anyway, as we have seen with his views on the Burqa.

Two things.

1) Trump deliberately says directly contradictory things depending on the phase of the moon, sometimes in the same sentence. The logic is that people have selective hearing, they’ll latch on to the bits that reinforce their world view and conveniently forget the things they disagree with. It’s how you win elections.

2) WTF has Corbyn got to do with Charlottesville? Talk about agenda-pushing, that’s weapons-grade whataboutery.

I really like how ninfan disappears for a bit while the random lefty-hating troll generator warms up its next post after the last one failed to stick.

Nah there’s a pattern there. He generally disappears when a good point is made and comes back later when he doesn’t need to answer it.

Nah there’s a pattern there. He generally disappears when a good point is made and comes back later when he doesn’t need to answer it.

It’s almost as if he lacks conviction in his “opinions”…

Ban Toryboi?

Nah, but he’s one of the few posters who I’d consider blocking.

The fact that he even trolls on a subject like this I find leaves a bad taste in my mouth….

Ugggghhh, now I feel unclean.

Fing heathen.

I really like how ninfan disappears for a bit while the random lefty-hating troll generator warms up its next post after the last one failed to stick.

I really like how the random lefties spend forever campaigning against violence and intolerance whilst being intolerant of, and violent towards, anyone who disagrees with them.

If you want to get upset because you think I’m ‘defending’ Nazis, then why the hell shouldn’t I? You’re the ones who are defending and justifying political violence, not me. You’re the ones who get upset when a whole group is castigated for the actions of an individual or tiny minority (Muslim ban anyone?)… except when it’s you doing the castigating

“Punch a nazi in the face” they cry, then recoil in horror when it turns out that Nazis actually punch back.

“But they didn’t just punch back” you cry, “they actually killed people”

Well? What on earth did you expect? They’re Nazis FFS!