context of the people I speak to and a lot of them thinking like that

So you’ve taken a small sample and extrapolated to a larger population which is the textbook definition of generalisation.

Had you qualified what a lot meant (many of the people I know, which amounts to 2/5s of naff all) it might be different

But then it would literally be the same thing I said, which is that many studies have studied large numbers of rich people and found that a lot of them share common behaviours.

Corbyn is unpopular.

All leaders are unpopular to many groups of people.

There surely can’t be all that many remainer Conservatives left, can there?

Apparently there are. For remainder cons party>remaining for leaver Labs the opposite is true. That’s part of the problem.

@mrmonkfinger > you missed one trick there:

because democracy is about making decisions through public vote?

It isn’t, it’s about choosing people through public vote who are then empowered to make those decisions.

The Tories have a plan to steel some voters from Labour. It’s a big fat obvious obnoxious one. I’ve not seen even a hint that Labour want to take votes from the Tories.

How could Labour take votes from the Tories?

How could Labour take votes from the Tories?

Moving away a Marxist shadow chancellor, and a shadow home secretary who thinks Mao wasn’t all that bad. That would be a start, I’d say.

Oh, and the whole inviting nasty people to parliament. Better stop that as well, I reckon.

Yep Labours problem is they just think all they have to be is the best Labour Party ever and then everyone will see sense.

If Labour had fewer policies it would be so much easier for them. Its about optics and the Tories understand this. The Labour campaign has been a bit of a mess. Every new election promise makes the others less believable.

The Tories have to convince everyone that they are not going to sell the NHS
Labour have to convince everyone that they are not going to “bankrupt the country like last time” (NB I know it wasn’t Labours fault but lots of people still think it was! Boris saying it today- unchallenged of course)

Still fingers crossed

If Labour had fewer policies it would be so much easier for them. Its about optics and the Tories understand this. The Labour campaign has been a bit of a mess. Every new election promise makes the others less believable.

The Tories have to convince everyone that they are not going to sell the NHS
Labour have to convince everyone that they are not going to “bankrupt the country like last time” (NB I know it wasn’t Labours fault but lots of people still think it was! Boris saying it today- unchallenged of course)

All of this ignores the elephant of Brexit though. The Cons could (and pretty much have) no manifesto and still get an insane amount of votes purely because they claim to “Get Brexit Done”. At one point Brexit Party was polling at 25%.

Labour having the perfect manifesto but being remain would not get those voters back.

Or **** it just have get Brexit done vs Free Broadband

And how are Labour not meeting every one of those criteria already?

See CHF’s post above – viz

Moving away a Marxist shadow chancellor, and a shadow home secretary who thinks Mao wasn’t all that bad. That would be a start, I’d say.

Oh, and the whole inviting nasty people to parliament. Better stop that as well, I reckon.

I am that Conservative remainer, despairing of the direction the Tory party has gone and would readily vote Labour otherwise this time around.

Surely you can’t vote Conservative?

Indeed I won’t. I may not vote at all, for the first time in 40+ years. If I vote it will be LD. I was lining up early on to vote LD but their policy of revoke A50 whatever made me feel they’d overplayed their hand. And as usual, they may be centrist in some things but they’re extreme in some of their Liberal ideas.
But don’t be so surprised if someone is going to vote Tory. Millions are – and they’re not all fools or Little Englander isolationists. There are many who will hold their nose and vote Tory because they think the current incarnation of Labour is even further beyond the pale.

but they’re extreme in some of their Liberal ideas.

Out of interest what policies put you off?

Out of interest what policies put you off?

Cancel A50 – not the right way to stop Brexit IMO
Look at JS as a potential PM – vastly unrealistic expectation
Those were the principal ones. But perhaps if they were ramping up in the polls I’d still consider them – but they’ve blown it.

Cyclist assaults politician…

Either way, doesn’t really matter, it is the holding tight of the belief that All Germans Are Nazi Bastards and Britain Shouldn’t Have Anything To Do With Them, which is, well, asinine and unproductive at best, and a number of other words at worst.

Sure. I mean, I appreciate that people like him are a lost cause. Someone who’s thought that way for decades isn’t going to be changing their opinion any time soon regardless of how many facts you present.

My point was rather, I’ve seen a commentary that runs along the lines of “well I voted remain but we have to leave the EU because democracy” and it needs challenging because it’s incorrect and misleading.

Cancel A50 – not the right way to stop Brexit IMO

Perhaps, perhaps not. But which is more important, that it is / isn’t stopped, or the method in which it’s achieved?

Personally I think it should be the right way to stop it. It’s literally the entire point of Parliament to make those sorts of decisions. Whether it is the right way, well, sadly after four years of being systematically lied to I think we’ve long passed the point of not being able to do it without another referendum.

Look at JS as a potential PM – vastly unrealistic expectation

I can’t really argue with that. She seems to be a remarkably poor choice of leader for the LDs.

Cancel A50 – not the right way to stop Brexit IMO

The only way to stop Brexit. The law says Britain leaves if it doesn’t.

Posted my vote today – noticed just after I put it in the box that the only collection was 9am! Hope it gets there …

People died for your right not to post your postal vote in time for it to count Molls

I just hope the Tory doesn’t win with a majority of one!

Great description of the two party leaders by a voter in a northern target seat on Five Live just now

“Boris Johnson is as mad as a box of frogs and Corbyn’s not right in the swede”

Indeed.

All of this ignores the elephant of Brexit though. The Cons could (and pretty much have) no manifesto and still get an insane amount of votes purely because they claim to “Get Brexit Done”. At one point Brexit Party was polling at 25%.

Labour having the perfect manifesto but being remain would not get those voters back.

Exactly. Labour have been in a no win situation since the referendum. The majority of tory voters are pro Brexit so easy to keep them, plus getting some other voters who think Brexit is so important for some reason.
Labour could have come out as remain and lost even more pro Brexit people.

As someone said earlier – it seems labour pro brexit people are so keen on brexit they will vote tory to get it whereas pro remain tory voters still vote tory.

The realisation is that the pro brexit labour voters were probably never voting labour for the right reasons as true labour supporters could in no way vote tory, ever.

Once Brexit is “done” we will see a change.

Cancel A50 – not the right way to stop Brexit IMO

The only way to stop Brexit. The law says Britain leaves if it doesn’t.

Apologies. My understanding was that the LDs, if they had got into power, would have cancelled A50, with no further reference to the electorate. I accept that to stop Brexit we have to revoke A50. I think the only acceptable way of sanctioning that is via a second referendum.