Worth complaining or should I not expect anything more from the NHS?

well I might suggest that some thing looks like INJURIES but aren’t. The OP is talking about something he thinks in and INJURY and describing to his docs as an INJURY, and it looks and feels like an INJURY. But he didn’t have an ACCIDENT.

My symtoms suggest my body was reacting to an injury too, but time proved that it wasn’t

Macruiskeen – going on the tiny wee bit of information that you gave us in your earlier post it does not sound like your body was reacting to an injury at all. Things do swell up randomly and when they do, it’s a pretty damn good indication that it’s not an injury. Was yours a bacterial infection by any chance?

Bregante on the other hand says that he felt a twinge or something similar – that could well be a tear or some such thing. The swelling could be bursitis from structures rubbing in places where they wouldnt normally be rubbing. Decent physio would be able to rule all that out pretty quickly and they may well have done that – and that’s why they’ve referred them to some other discipline.

SBZ,

Because it’s not “easy” that’s why.

Admittedly some people will be better than others at diagnosis, but are you suggesting that there are doctors out there who never get it wrong?

The implication of what you said is that the OP has got cause for complaint, because whoever treated him in the first place might not have been a knee specialist. But that’s not how healthcare works is it? Part of the “treatment” might well be the process of finding the right specialist.

And anyway, as every injury is going to be slightly different, no one can ever know for sure whether diagnosis and treatment were optimally effective in a particular case.

RPRT – do you have any training relevant to assessing knee injuries?

Nope.

But I read a lot.

OK seeing as you read a lot, tell me what is involved in a knee assessment then. Then tell me what’s difficult about it.

No, I’m not jumping through hoops for you.

If you think the assessment of knee injuries is “easy” then that’s fine, but from my personal experience of knee injury and those of friends of mine who have had ongoing problems despite involvement with a wide range of experts, I can’t accept that it is “easy”

BTW, the “I read a lot” was just a throwaway line. I could have said “But my heart is pure”.

Who said that treating knee injuries was easy?

If I might interrupt the squabbling…

SBZ, i’m guessing you’re a physio, can I ask your opinion? – In my simplistic view I’ve been thinking knee specialist = diagnosis and possible treatment, physio = rehab. I was going to put off going to see a private physio until after getting the results of my MRI. Is it worth seeing a physio earlier if they have diagnostic skills? Is this something all physios can do or should i be looking for a particular type or qualification? I’m not sure I would have trusted the physios i had in the past to do this but I’m possibly being unfair. Genuine question, would be grateful for your thoughts.

Physios do diagnosis of musculoskeletal injuries then decide on the best course of action to treat them. They are also trained to look for signs of other pathologies and refer onto other suitable professionals.

Look for a good musculoskeletal physio and they will have the skills to diagnose and treat any injury that doesnt require surgery and tell you if they think it does or might require surgery.

I can’t be bothered to argue with you, but plenty of experts get their diagnoses wrong. Ergo, it’s not easy.

If you cant be bothered to argue then why do you keep posting?

I would regale the time I was sent home from A&E after being told I had indigestion, only to find out it was a collapsed lung, two weeks in hospital later & when I got out it really didn’t matter any more.

Happy trails.

@SBZ,
Thanks.

SBZ

I don’t believe anyone who says knee injuries are easy to diagnose because I see any number of cases where the clinical findings by sub-specialist Knee Surgeons, the MRI report and the final arthroscopy info provide different answers. And I have seen Orthopaedic Registrars and Physios get it wrong too. If you believe you can do it infallibly you are either self-deluding or only dealing with minor self-limiting problems. If you really do believe that – and really are a clinician – I think you have identified a need for audit and learning.

Back to the OP…

Have you seen your GP about any of this? They are (I believe) your Primary Care and should always be your first port of call (unless it’s an emergency). Your GP should be aware of all your consultations, treatment, medication etc and if you feel unsatisfied, they are the first person you go to see to raise any concerns.

I’m having similar difficulties with waiting times – my problem is (apparently) very difficult to diagnose, and the department(s) taking my case is/are simply understaffed. But I raised this concern with my GP and she’s been very helpful in listening to me and suggesting other things that could be done. She will now keep an eye on my case management and (hopefully) will fight my corner against any more waiting around.

Have you seen your GP about any of this? They are (I believe) your Primary Care and should always be your first port of call (unless it’s an emergency). Your GP should be aware of all your consultations, treatment, medication etc and if you feel unsatisfied, they are the first person you go to see to raise any concerns.

I saw her after the first clinic appointment (when I was told to do the physio) because I wasn’t happy with the advice at all. She got in touch with the physio, who referred me back to the knee clinic and stopped the physio. But no, not seen her since. Her other half is actually a knee specialist at another hospital (different trust, I believe) and she speaks highly of my consultant (Dr 3 in my first post).

I just love the fact that I have private health care yet I get taxed on that as well, that is all 🙄

get your check book out and pay for it.. loads of free time on MRI’s my neighbours a technician and he says hes nowt to do at the 4 hospitals he covers as they dont get used enough.

SBZ, I’m with StoatsBrother on this one I’m afraid and have spent a fair few years looking at knee injuries at the front door as it were…. Knees are very complicated bits of kit (almost as complicated as shoulders)!

I just love the fact that I have private health care yet I get taxed on that as well, that is all

But sadly not enough. It’s long overdue that people who use their money to poach medical staff who have been educated and professionally trained by the government, so that they can jump queues, causing other people to wait longer, at least started paying proper money to the government for the privilege. Although ideally, a stop should be put to the unacceptable racket. Healthcare = to each according to their need, not their money. That is all.

Obvious knee injuries are easy to diagnose, most aren’t easy though.

So says my sports doc physio friend sitting here having a beer. I’d trust his judgement given his background and experience. And he also successfully fixed my long term knee problem that had been ‘missed’ by a variety of docs and specialists both private and public.

It’s long overdue that people who use their money to poach medical staff who have been educated and professionally trained by the government, so that they can jump queues, causing other people to wait longer, at least started paying proper money to the government for the privilege.

Errrrr I wonder how many foreign trained medics work in the NHS.
I suppose that’s wrong too?

get your check book out and pay for it.. loads of free time on MRI’s my neighbours a technician and he says hes nowt to do at the 4 hospitals he covers as they dont get used enough.

My local hospital had to hire in a mobile MRI to help out because they have that many to do.

j_me – Member
If its any help I was waiting for an MRI scan last year. I phoned them and said if they had any cancellations I could get to the hospital at very short notice. Got one the next day.
POSTED 17 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST

what a top tip! Rang them yesterday, explaining that I live 10 mins from the hospital and can be there any time. Just got a call and it’s getting done at 1.30 today!!!

Cheers j_me and others who suggested this

ACE !!

Good luck bregante and I hope they get to the root of the problem.

SBZ – your really are wasted as you are obviously more talented than any of the 3 docs who have failed to make a definitive diagnosis. Just think of the good you could do with a bit more training and a few more letters after your name. 😉

Just got a call and it’s getting done at 1.30 today!!

😀 Nice one ! Hope it all works out well 😀

Just think of the good you could do with a bit more training and a few more letters after your name

Now there’s a game:

D.Ust ?
M.See ?

😀

Nice one.

It’ll probably still take a while for the results to make it back to the Doc, but I’m interested to know what the result is now. Maybe you can give us an update when you find out something?

It’ll probably still take a while for the results to make it back to the Doc

Yes you might have to wait a while to see your consultant again, but in our “Health Board” the scan results are available on the network pretty quickly (c48 hours). Your GP might be able to access these. So you could get the results by calling your surgery in a couple of days without waiting weeks to see your consultant. Of course your GP might not be able to interpret them!

I had a similar experience with my knee.

A&E nurse (3 days after the initial crash it swelled up and locked and I couldn’t move it). – no ligament damage, RICE, see GP in 2-4 weeks if no imporvements.

GP – RICE + NSAIDs, come back if no improvement

(back home for summer break from Uni, new GP’s, lots off faffing, one useless physio, back to uni in september).

See GP, refered for physio again, saw a really good consultant physio, then fortnighltly appoitment with a good physio for almost 6 months. But all we could do is get it normal, i.e. I could fuction, but couldnt walk further than the bus stop, and excercise beyond swimming with a pull-bouy was impossible.

Refered to a consultant (I actualy tore the sack of fluid round the knee walking to his office!)

More x-rays.

Opperation scheduled to have a look.

Opperation.

Remove a chunk of inflamed tisue.

6 months later I was doing 100 mile sportives

3 years later I can ride pretty much as normal, it’s not perfect but I can modulate the riding enough to keep it in check.

If it happened again, I’d pay the £90 see the consultant straight away, then he can either decide to opperate and you go on the NHS waiting list (or pay £3k and have it done pretty much there and then). Or you just go back into the NHS system with a note from the consultant saying you need XYZ treatment/tests. Thats what my neighbour did and he was back at work (manual work, not office work) in 6 months non the 18months it would have taken me.

You had a thread about this the other week didnt you? Good luck for your diagnosis but i suspect you are looking at 3mths with your legs up with no sport. If its a tear then they havent got much choice but to recommend rest.

I got moved into advanced knee group at hospital today 3ths and 2weeks following a complete rupture of the patella tendon. I wouldnt wish you carrying on exercising etc and then snapping it. Believe me, your current situation would be a pleasure

Errrrr I wonder how many foreign trained medics work in the NHS.
I suppose that’s wrong too?

Well what do you think ? Try and work out for yourself whether poaching trained medical staff from third world countries is acceptable……bearing in mind that it isn’t rocket science, and we should be able to train our own doctors, nurses, radiologists, etc.

So I pay my taxes, never missed a penny and decide to get private health care, how is it fair I get taxed again. If it was offered by your employer ernie I’m sure you’d turn it down hey??

may i suggest you request a copy of your medical notes from the nhs, being able to sit and read them may give you some answers. my wife has just done this and you need to fill out a form get your gp to sign it then it takes about a month after to arrive and they charge you £17.

how is it fair I get taxed again

not sure any tax is Fair in the sense you mean but itis a benefit in kind if your employer pays it? Effectively they pay it in lieu of wages so it is taxed as if it is earnings like say if they gave you a car.
If you pay the premiums yourself from wages it is not taxable

So I pay my taxes, never missed a penny and decide to get private health care, how is it fair I get taxed again. If it was offered by your employer ernie I’m sure you’d turn it down hey??

I pay my taxes too, never bloody get ill, yet some of those really sick people who are too sick to work and pay taxes get loads of treatment, how is that fair?

And they spend all that money on neonatal intensive care for babies who’ve not done a stroke of work in their lives, how is that fair? Sheeesh!