Well scotland didnt get independance, thread

Where’s the party now?

Cracking news and a Smokey supper will not be classed as foreign food.

What does happen next? Callmedave is going to make a statement which is purported to be an outline for further devolution not just north of the border, but also for other regions including within England. What though for Scotland and independence? Salmond’s speech seemed to suggest this wasn’t the end, just maybe for this generation, but how many of the yes voters will have their needs met by further devolution, and is 45% where they’ll top out at as a result, and it’ll track back from there?

The Scotch people have voted, now let that be the end of it.

hmm no this is just the start of it, and quite right too. Moving on quickly, pretending it didn’t happen would be extraordinarily stupid, even for Westminster.
I’m hoping the momentum and conversation continues and we see proper constitutional change for the whole of the uk. Everyone is sick of that exclusive club in London, not just Scotland.

Moving on quickly, pretending it didn’t happen would be extraordinarily stupid, even for Westminster.

Agreed, and it won’t happen. Cameron will dine out on this for a decade. It’s media gold for next year’s election.

Everyone is sick of that exclusive club in London, not just Scotland.

As someone who works in Westminster, I can assure you that my area – food exports – has made huge efforts to be nothing but helpful to the Scottish Government for years.

Don’t think things have just ended!

Its interesting, isn’t it?

1)Yes were clearly ahead
2)Panic
3)The 3 main parties promise a form of Devo Max (an option excluded by Cameron in 2011) and not on the ballot paper
4)The Yes bubble collapses

So, clearly, if Devo Max isn’t delivered, and people stay engaged and remain undistracted, then Scotland gets change. It was promised….?

Simples?

Everyone is sick of that exclusive club in London, not just Scotland.

^this

Should be interesting watching the folks who have declared they will move abroad if we dont get independance look to find utopia.

Three folk have popped up on my facebook feed this morning saying they are moving away now.

Wonder where they will find this utopia.

Lots of people looked at the ballot paper and changed their mind.

Everyone is sick of that exclusive club in London

It’s not exclusive at all. Any British national can get elected to it.

That right Ernie?

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jul/02/labour-party-selection-process-falkirk

A small selection for you of how the main parties choose candidates.

Red firebrand from the streets, full of a need to correct injustices? No chance.

That right Ernie?

Yes that’s right. It isn’t obligatory to vote for the Labour candidate.

Although overall it’s 55% vs 45%, so far, only 4 out of 31 reported councils have voted yes. That’s a pretty resounding slam of the door.

Trailrat, Utopia can be found in London, obviously !

I think now will be the time to judge Westminster on it’s actions, if the promises aren’t delivered I don’t think it’ll be too long before there’s another referendum.
Hopefully the main outcome will be change for the better for all parts of the UK.

Yeah what’s a generation in the grand scheme of things?

LOLing at the “this is just the start” comments. How naive. If anyone thinks that the govt will allow another referendum in our lifetimes they are going to be very disappointed.
How much did this whole thing cost the UK taxpayer?

Right then now we need to send in the troops, Dundee will be first to raise to the ground as they had the highest ‘yes’ vote then we can address that little pocket around Glasgow. Oh and mount Salmond to the front of the first tank… 😉

Seriously though it was pretty close and it worrying to think that the population of Scotland is so split. Hopefully we can do better and make them glad they voted no.

Lots of people looked at the ballot paper and changed their mind voted how they’d intended all along.

❓

Whatever the story behind the numbers though, this –

Hopefully we can do better and make them glad they voted no.

cant believe there are so few people in scotland …. thats including all those 16 -17 voters too. More people watch strictly on a saturady evening!

Seriously though it was pretty close and it worrying to think that the population of Scotland is so split. Hopefully we can do better and make them glad they voted no.

It was closer than I thought it would be, but with such Nationalistic fervour being engendered, the ‘yes’ voters were mostly the emotive ones. If we, (the English) were 10% of the pop and Edinburgh made all the decisions, we’d almost certainly feel the same. It’s head over hearts and sometimes you have to swallow your pride to take the right route for all….which fortunately they did.

Let’s hope no one messes with the formula

The architect of a controversial funding formula for Scotland has described his own policy as a “terrible mistake” after David Cameron pledged to keep it despite a revolt from Tory MPs.

The leaders of all three main political parties have pledged to continue using the formula, which sees Scotland receive £1,623 per head more than the rest of the UK, if Scotland votes to stay in the Union.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11100400/My-funding-formula-for-Scotland-is-a-terrible-mistake-Lord-Barnett-admits.html

If the unholy alliance of Dave, Gordon, Ed and Nick deliver on their hastily-sketched-on-the-back-of-a-fag-packet promises, then this could be the best possible outcome for everyone.

Thats a big if though!

Britain is the most centralised country in the developed world. Westminster has run Britain like a fiefdom, issuing dictats to ‘the regions’ like some imperial power. Its not just the Scots who’ve been on the receiving end of that, and who are heartily sick of it! I notice Daves speech made commitments to devolved power to the cities as well as Norn Ireland and Wales

Heres hoping that this is genuine democratic change, with real teeth, and not a window dressing exercise that just lumbers us all with another level of bureaucrats and politicians to pay for.

I’m not confident

cant believe there are so few people in scotland …. thats including all those 16 -17 voters too. More people watch strictly on a saturady evening!

there’s probably another couple of mil living in England!

I think now will be the time to judge Westminster on it’s actions, if the promises aren’t delivered I don’t think it’ll be too long before there’s another referendum.
Hopefully the main outcome will be change for the better for all parts of the UK.

Yes

Gotta say I have a new-found respect for Gordon Brown. Never liked him before but he put the Union ahead of personal ambitions.

Hopefully we can do better and make them glad they voted no.

I’m not sure what more ‘we’ can do.

The problem is not that the Scottish need their own autonomous government it’s just that the Westminster parliament makes *all* UK voters feel disengaged from the political process and powerless to affect the decisions made.

It’s shouldn’t be about the English trying to appease the Scots, it should be about all politicians (local and national) convincing citizens that voting

a) matters
and
b) makes a difference

The turnout last night shows that when people believe their opinion matters and that casting a vote will affect their lives they will become involved.

The Police Commissioner election fiasco with less than 10% turnout shows what happens when politicians fail to listen to what people want.

Interesting that Orkney and Shetland both voted 65% against. The wise islanders must have seen though Salmond’s slimey trickery…. or maybe Braveheart wasn’t shown in cinemas there.

Perhaps Orkney and Shetland thought if Scotland was independent there would be less defence against a viking invasion.

I think Salmond’s greatest failing in this was not securing the midge vote. He would have had a landslide.

On a slightly more frivolous note;

Could they not do a more football style post match analysis.

“Salmond played a blinder but they don’t have strength in depth on their defence and he was let down”

“Darling lacked the charisma of his opposite number but he plodded on and led his team to victory”

“The late substitution of Gordon Brown for Campbell, Cameron and Milliband was a brilliant tactical decision, he deserved his man of the match award”

I wonder what the vote looks like when broken down into age groups? Anyone know where that could be found?

I reckon the <25s and >60s will have been more pro-independence and the rest more pro-union.

LOLing at the “this is just the start” comments. How naive. If anyone thinks that the govt will allow another referendum in our lifetimes they are going to be very disappointed.

‘Just the start’ doesn’t refer to Scottish Independence, it refers to UK constitutional reform.

Gotta say I have a new-found respect for Gordon Brown. Never liked him before but he put the Union ahead of personal ambitions.

I feel the opposite! I wish the **** had got his priorities sorted years ago, and put his efforts into delivering on the promised changes to the Blairite agenda, instead of just looking like a rabbit in the headlights once he got in the position he’d spent his life scheming to get into. Then going off in a massive sulk when the electorate delivered their verdict on his abject failure.

He’s very good at gobbing off. His record on delivering on his bombastic rhetoric and stated intentions is absolutely woeful! Something worth bearing in mind.

just looking like a rabbit in the headlights once he got in the position he’d spent his life scheming to get into.

I don’t think you appreciate how little power individuals have, and how much they have to fit into the party machine. It’s the same for US presidents – they talk about change, but they end up having far less power than they’d like when they get in.

Bloody great turnout Scotland.

Thats got to be something to celebrate 😀

Molls – Read Damian McBrides memoirs of being with Gordon when he finally got into number 10. They’re damning! Everyone was filled with optimism about a change in direction. Thinking that he must have done all that scheming, and bullying for a reason. Then realising there was no grand plan. No ideology. No agenda. Nothing!

He just wanted to be PM and thought it was just sooooooooo not fair that Tony got to be instead. That was it! The limit of his ambition was that he thought he had the right to be the biggest swinging dick. It was just petty playground stuff. Then look what happened? He staggered from one crisis to the next until he was booted out. Then he sulked!

He’s a pathetic, tragic figure, so I wouldn’t be expecting him to actually deliver much more now. All mouth and no trousers, who’s political legacy is nearly bankrupting the country! Now we’re expecting him to come riding to everyones rescue? Yeah, right….

No chance he could have learned from his experience, perhaps?

I see Dave is going with the same model of the US and A then rather than the USSR.

That’s kinda my point Binners – he always came across like that but he seemed to put his head up above the parapet this time.