[Closed] Tory Scum

Yep.
Just nasty - true colours shown.

Can't believe they will actually legislate to allow same sex marriage either - a decent policy that will actually increase the sum total of human happiness - it's just not in their nature.

I think you need to establish a link between the allegations in that story and at least one Tory politician, before declaring that this is definitive proof that Tories are scum.

...or, of 3,000 redundancies, some are inevitably going to be at critical times in their service, but the civil servant in charge of the redundancy schedules at the MOD probably didnt take it to the evil tory defence minister saying "how about some transitional arrangements to make it as equitable as possible"?...

not even an evil tory defence minister is going to stand there and go "pick 3,000 servicemen who are going to be days away from a windfall, because that's going to look great on my CV"

Proof!!!!!!!!!!!!

No proof required to say 4+4=8, its a fact.

Same as Tories are Scum, its a fact, no proof required.

Typical Tory - blame the public servant. 🙂

not even an evil tory defence minister is going to stand there and go "pick 3,000 servicemen who are going to be days away from a windfall, because that's going to look great on my CV"

But it's the logical, financially prudent, Tory way.
I'd argue that to the Tory mindset, to have done otherwise would risk showing weakness.

Tories are certainly scum but I'm not convinced this is the best evidence.

Cutting taxes for the rich while creating hell for thousands of disabled people. That's what makes them scum (amongst other things).

Same as Tories are Scum, its a fact, no proof required.

Well I would tend to agree with that. But the OP linked to a news story which apparently provides proof of this irrefutable self evident fact. I can't see how it does.

blame the public servant.

well he was probably unionised anyway 🙂

Most amusing..(not the blokes who've lost out - that's harsh)..more the rabid reaction - "Tories are scum", like Labour or any of them are any better!

blame the public servant.

mrlebowski - Member

Most amusing..(not the blokes who've lost out - that's harsh)..more the rabid reaction - "Tories are scum", like Labour or any of them are any better!

Well, all humanity shares the same basic design flaws of fallability & greed.
But I would argue that a slavish devotion to ideology, at the expense of any shred of human kindness or empathy is a quality exemplified in this country by the Tory Party.

like Labour or any of them are any better!

Well to fair the OP didn't say that Labour were any better. His point appears to be his revelation and sudden awareness that the Tories are scum. Perhaps he's a disappointed former Tory voter ?

But I would argue that a slavish devotion to ideology, at the expense of any shred of human kindness or empathy is a quality exemplified in this country by the Tory Party.

+1

It's just pure selfishness masquerading as a political philosophy.

Another act of shame from this myopic government.

In recent years I’ve formed a very jaundiced view of most politicians who prove themselves to be venal, self serving egotists on a regular basis and across the political spectrum. Look at Theresa May's endorsement of Tom Winsor as preferred candidate for HMIC following his reports on police reform. Examine Winsor's ‘independence’ on the matter.

None of them inspire me.

I think you need to establish a link between the allegations in that story and at least one Tory politician, before declaring that this is definitive proof that Tories are scum

Except that I don't need to do anything of the sort; this is latest wave of redundancies brought about as a direct result of the 2010 Strategic Defence & Security Review co-signed by Cameron & Clegg.

Yes blanket redundancy will affect folk in critical times of their service, but it doesn't need to; recruitment freeze and natural wastage would contribute greatly to the savings.

Plus I don't think it's that great to consider someone's pension as a windfall. These people have served their country over a great number of years, and some have no doubt got through the latter part of their service with the comforting thought that, although their pay and conditions are poor whilst serving, at least they will have their pensions to look forward to.

Well I would tend to agree with that. But the OP linked to a news story which apparently provides proof of this irrefutable self evident fact. I can't see how it does.

Ernie, you will have to jog my memory of where I've done this. I've linked to a news story that has reaffirmed my opinion, which i have then voiced, but I don't recall presenting my thread under the headline "irrefutable self evident fact" that Tories arw scum. I'm expressing opinion.

Except that I don't need to do anything of the sort; this is latest wave of redundancies brought about as a direct result of the 2010 Strategic Defence & Security Review co-signed by Cameron & Clegg.

Hmmm, as someone who's just left HM Forces full time (still do reserve work), I do feel the last few governments have trousered the military.

However the redundancy selection boards have been conducted by serving personnel, not Politcians.

Some of the stories I've heard are disgusting, when given the proximity to their Immediate Pension Point.

I really pray there is some extension in service for them, or they get lucky on the outside; something that is a challenge in this economic climate. I really feel for them and wish them all the very best of luck.

Except that I don't need to do anything of the sort; this is latest wave of redundancies brought about as a direct result of the 2010 Strategic Defence & Security Review co-signed by Cameron & Clegg.

Ah I see, your disgust is based on the fact that are any redundancies at all, not the manner in which they have been decided. You didn't make that clear in your OP.

So then.......the Tories are scum because they have been instrumental in redundancies in the armed forces ? Well that's probably not the most powerful criticism of the Tories I've ever heard, I must admit. And since Clegg co-signed the 2010 Strategic Defence & Security Review can we conclude that the Liberal Democrats are scum too ?

I don't recall presenting my thread under the headline "irrefutable self evident fact"

No that was me who said that - I never claimed that you said it. You don't need proof for irrefutable self evident facts.

Majority of the politicians are [s]Tory[/s] Scums

There there ... 🙄

Oh I'm sure it's not just the majority of politicians who are scum, that sounds far too narrow. Perhaps we need to assume that everyone is scum, and just concentrate on who isn't.

Clegg co-signed the 2010 Strategic Defence & Security Review can we conclude that the Liberal Democrats are scum too ?

Yes if it makes you happy, though to be clear, I'm not offering irrefutable proof of this either.

Some of you should Google "Labour Defence cuts..."

It'll help you to have a more balanced view of a. How political news is reported & b. you'll realise both sides are at it.

Seriously, some times the rabid kee-jerk reactions on here (from all sides of the political spectrum on STW) leaves me at a loss for words. Have a read a round subject, form a balanced view. I'm not saying mines right, but when it's so blatantly obvious that all 3 main parties have serious question marks against them it pays to have an open mind..

Yes if it makes you happy, though to be clear, I'm not offering irrefutable proof of this either.

Why would it make me "happy" ?

You provide a link to a Telegraph story to back up your claim that the Tories are scum, and then when it is pointed out to you that story does not establish any link with the Tory Party, you claim the Tories are scum because they decided on redundancies in the armed forces. So why the significance of that story ? Why didn't you post your allegation of Tory scum when the decision to make redundancies was first announced ?

You're obviously a tad confused, as you are with who said "irrefutable self evident fact".

I was merely trying to get to the bottom of what your point actually was. I'm actually quite happy 🙂

Tory scum.

Are they like the labour scum who signed our country over to the EU and very nearly bankrupt us in the process causing the financial mess we're in now?

Not propping the FAILED euro up would be a far better way of saving our country money than cutting services but the EU aren't going to like that so it isn't going to happen.

Finally! Some considered analysis.

the govt said to the army.. look you have 105000 people of which only 45000 actually carry arms at any point, you have a top heavy management profile make xyz financial savings.. you do it you army chaps know best ( not least the 3500 'soldiers' in personnel)..

i might have looked at those in personnel, the top heavy number of officers ( one for every three privates) or the 370 dentists in uniform

and frankly.. who gets a pension of almost 3 times the standard state pension at 40. sure you should be able to retire at 40 but why does that make you unable to get work elsewhere.. ?

Remember...we're all [s]In it together[/s] gonna get screwed...together....
They should go on a protest march... 😉 allthough call me dave would probably think it was trooping the colour...
But watching the police try and kettle some Marines on a march would be interesting

Tory scum.

Erm, default setting.

Are they like the labour scum who signed our country over to the EU and very nearly bankrupt us in the process causing the financial mess we're in now?

Not propping the FAILED euro up would be a far better way of saving our country money than cutting services but the EU aren't going to like that so it isn't going to happen.

The power of the Internet. No longer history is written by the victors, merely written by anybody.

Gorehound - Member

Are they like the labour scum who signed our country over to the EU and very nearly bankrupt us in the process causing the financial mess we're in now?

No, that would be Tory scum John Major who signed our country over to the EU at Maastricht. And no, it wasn't that which very nearly bankrupted us and caused the financial mess we're in now, that was caused by greedy and incompetent bankers on the other side of the Atlantic - look west not east, for the guilty parties.

Hmm just a point here folks, it's not the tories who've sacked the servicemen, it's their immediate superiors who chose that route and will have been perfectly aware of it.

What you need to realise is that government->spending cuts ordered->Heads of military choose who and when to fire to get best effect. DC didn't phone up and say "make damn sure you fire them before they get their pension, Phil"

Idiots 🙄

Good use of CAPITALS though 🙂 I was going to score at 3/10 for content but I'll raise it to a 4.

[i]But watching the police try and kettle some Marines on a march would be interesting

no problems 😕

Isn't there something like one civil servant in the MOD for every soldier or something, or is that a myth?

The missus has been told her contract probebly won't be extended which is fair enough, although i will be interested to see the final selection criteria which so far does not make sense. The funny thing is she gets a huge bonus one year from her contract end if she stays on to do her final year.

Oh and HM Forces of course can't go on strike or march, i beleive.

The Tories are making the most of the fact that the police and armed forces can't strike
My next door neighbour is a fireman, with a good pension, he can strike, and guess what
They are leaving them alone, for now anyway

But it's the logical, financially prudent, Tory way.

SHOCK!!!

STW members argue pointlessly about Tory / Labour / Lib Dem Scum and whose fault it is.

SHOCK!!!

Political question not in "one unanimously right answer" conundrum!

We currently have an evil government, but imagine how much worse they'd be without the Lib Dems.

Thank god for the Lib-Dems*

*can't believe I've actually typed this

SHOCK!!!

STW member posts pointlessly post on pointless thread..... to point out the pointlessness of it.

As far as I can see, the veracity with which you can take the article in the newspaper is pretty much laid out in the fact that they seem to be unable to distinguish between someone being sacked and someone being made redundant 🙄

So as usual the inevitable political "debate" ensues, along with various point scoring over who can be the most argumentative and pedantic. Meanwhile, the one person that actually seems to have any insight to this gets conveniently ignored:

Hmmm, as someone who's just left HM Forces full time (still do reserve work), I do feel the last few governments have trousered the military.

However the redundancy selection boards have been conducted by serving personnel, not Politcians.

tonyd - Member

So as usual the inevitable political "debate" ensues, along with various point scoring over who can be the most argumentative and pedantic.

Actually I have been stunned by the noticeable lack of the above. All the more surprising as the opening shot was "Tory scum".

Seriously, some times the rabid kee-jerk reactions on here (from all sides of the political spectrum on STW) leaves me at a loss for words. Have a read a round subject, form a balanced view. I'm not saying mines right, but when it's so blatantly obvious that all 3 main parties have serious question marks against them it pays to have an open mind..

+10000000000000000000 X A BILLION.

As I see it, there is only one way to solve this inane debate.
A mass fight.

All the Tories v All the Lefties v the yellow ones.

No holds barred, bare fist fight to the death.

Survival of the fittest.

Tories will win though, the lefties will be too out of shape after years of sofa skipping turkey twizzler munching, whereas 'the scum' have been eating all of the protein.

Simples

Agreed Ernie, however we're only on page 2. Could this be the onset of political debate fatigue?!

Tonyd, thanks!

If I was to get political,however, I'd mention that NuLabour set the Forces up for the fall, for the ConDems to deliver the killer blow!

All as bad as each other BUT: the Forces' own selected who was to go and when, so no politics there! As always, I'm sure it's way more complex than it looks, with certain trades needing to be balanced, insufficient volunteers from vulnerable trades etc. And the swinging axe that was "you WILL make the necessary savings!"

Bad times for many, not just the mil I'm
sad to say.

Well the Tories on here don't appear to be up for the challenge when "Tory scum" is screamed at them tonyd. Even I had to make a halfarse attempt to question the validity of the charge based on that link.

I'm a proud Tory. Huzzah!
I've given in to being labled 'scum' now, there's no point in me trying to defend against something so fashionable. Besides, a lifetime as a United supporter, i've been labled worse.

I've probably a sizeable chip on my shoulder too, I just wish I was as well balanced as the lefties, with a chip on both.

Just remember folks, Jesus was a Tory - ergo - so's his Dad.

I'm a proud Tory.

Such depravity 😐

Can't you reduce the shame by claiming you're a LibDem ? ........ it's the same thing, it just sounds nicer.

Con'Dem, its's the future, init

I'm a proud Tory.

but made worse by..

Huzzah!

Who the **** says

Huzzah!

But I would argue that a slavish devotion to ideology, at the expense of any shred of human kindness or empathy is a quality exemplified in this country by the Tory Party.

this is it i'm afraid. The tories venerate the base desires, other parties at least attempt to mitigate them.

I vote Conservative at the moment but what other option is there......

BeakerBand Ed.... surely not??

[img] [/img]

Nah, the Dem's are gone now, just be back to the Cons. Unless the Tories form a coalition with Nu Lab: ConNuLab. Then all the proper lefties can get on with sorting out the Socialist Worker Party into a decent opposition and all the Tories and Right-wing-lite Nu Labs can have a love in!

I voted Lib Dem, there I've said it. It's the first step...

But I would argue that a slavish devotion to ideology, at the expense of any shred of human kindness or empathy is a quality exemplified in this country by the Tory Party.

another +1 here

Who the **** says

Huzzah!

erm, Tories?

Long Reign Lord Cameron! HUZZAH!

I vote Conservative at the moment but what other option is there......

Good point Frankers ......an aesthetically displeasing Ed Miliband who reminds you of a children's TV favourite ? Or the devilishly handsome David Cameron ? It's a tricky one. And people don't give those sort of considerations enough thought.

ernie_lynch - Member

I vote Conservative at the moment but what other option is there......

Good point Frankers ......an aesthetically displeasing Ed Miliband who reminds you of a children's TV favourite ? Or the devilishly handsome David Cameron ? It's a tricky one. And people don't give those sort of considerations enough thought.

Well I base all of my voting decisions on this.... what can I say

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

Come on you Blues !!

Get in there Frankers!

slimjim78 - Member
As I see it, there is only one way to solve this inane debate.
A mass fight.

All the Tories v All the Lefties v the yellow ones.

No holds barred, bare fist fight to the death.

Survival of the fittest.

Tories will win though, the lefties will be too out of shape after years of sofa skipping turkey twizzler munching, whereas 'the scum' have been eating all of the protein.

Simples

Not so simple I'm afraid. You have dismissed the fact that the lefties ranks have been swollen with the recently redundant working classes. Them lot that did all the manual labour. Strong in the arm, thick.....

I've yet to meet a tory who when pressed actually gives a shit about the poor.

I should qualify what giving a shit actually means I suppose. Yes, they care about cheap sources of labour to provide support to big businesses but no they don't care about poverty, its effects on families and totaaly distance themselves from any kind of moral resposnibility to help people without either being condescending or imposing some kind of 'social contract' that turns them into little tories.

nothing worse than a working class tory is there?

I make little distinction between the NuLav elite & the incumbent mob (indeed, the ConDem propensity for handing [i]everything[/i] over to Serco/Crapita/G4S in the name of, cough, "efficiency" simply enlarges on the Blairite vision).

Whatever the political hue, we are being shafted by a monied cabal of sycophants - most of whom would pish themselves with fear if they ever had to actually hold the line, in the various public services that they themselves so denigrate.

Tories will win though

How many are physically like Mr Eric Pickles? Maybe not so clear-cut as you think!

yossarian - Member

I've yet to meet a tory who when pressed actually gives a shit about the poor.

I should qualify what giving a shit actually means I suppose. Yes, they care about cheap sources of labour to provide support to big businesses but no they don't care about poverty, its effects on families and totaaly distance themselves from any kind of moral resposnibility to help people without either being condescending or imposing some kind of 'social contract' that turns them into little tories.

nothing worse than a working class tory is there?

A very good point well made.... but what do you do to support the poor ?? ❓

I make little distinction between the NuLav elite & the incumbent mob (indeed, the ConDem propensity ...blah blah... a monied cabal of sycophants - most of whom would pish themselves with fear ..waffle...that they themselves so denigrate

could you stop using big words please, us poor Tories are struggling to follow.

from whence does your education derive exactly?
I gotta get me some of that

but what do you do to support the poor then??

put people ahead of profits

complicated it isn't

it does however require you to squeeze the bollocks of people who you went to eton with or who sponsor your party or perhaps companies your are 'friends' with. Takes guts and integrity. These traits aren't just missing from the tories by any means, its just what fills the gap is even more repugnant than most others.

Smacks of Bureacracy incompetence to me than actual 'save more money if we did this'.

It'll only get worse as we don't need a MASSIVE army if we aren't in Iraq etc etc etc. Todays/future wars won't require tens of thousands in a country for intervention.

As for Tory? I don't understand. Should you also praise Tony/One-eyed idiot for 'job creation' then when they decided to invade countries?

How many are physically like Mr Eric Pickles? Maybe not so clear-cut as you think!

His insatiable appetite can deal devastating blows.

[img] [/img]

from whence does your education derive exactly?

I was born this way. 😈

yossarian, I trully like your new world view, but I fear human nature will always prevail, no matter the colour of the party

I've yet to meet a tory who when pressed actually gives a shit about the poor.

This is the crux of the issue for me.

Tory politics is the politics of self-interest rather than caring about the common good - 'I'm alright Jack' writ large.

It's particularly sickening for those who have received all the advantages in life to claim to have pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps and talk as if everyone has the same opportunities they did.

but I fear human nature will always prevail

Human nature being what? Being selfish and greedy? Human beings have also co-operated and shared and helped each other for thousands of years.

wowzers.

I truly fear for humankind.

Go on slimjim - explain how I'm wrong.

whats the point, you've all made it abundantly clear how wrong I am.

David Cameron seems like a perfectly decent fella to me, I dont understand all this venom at all. Sounds a bit forced.

Human beings have also co-operated and shared and helped each other for thousands of years.

yet give a man/men power

Being selfish and greedy

pops up, 80% of the time, it happens all the time

yossarian, I trully like your new world view, but I fear human nature will always prevail, no matter the colour of the party

arrogant, maybe, stupid - not all the time. realistic - yes.

heartless, no way man.

If you honestly believe that ANY organisation that weilds any kind of ultimate power, is not affected in some way by aforementioned human nature/corruption, then i'm not the only stupid one.

There are (probably) millions of great people in our country alone (which makes me wonder why we keep voting numties into power), i'd be amazed if any of us are infallible though