That 50 Quid DX bike light dissed disected oh sod it. ( its not good news )

After 3 weeks of use, and a couple of charges, my bastid has had no issues whatever. I'm very pleased with it, seems to be well worth the money they're asking for it. Hope your replacement unit works OK spangels, I reckon you won't be disappointed when you get the bastid going. Good to see DX seem to have treated you fairly and been prompt with a replacement I was a bit wary as to how good their customer service would be.

I agree with Solo's comments re. dirt cheap chinese imports being impossible to compete with, from what I've seen (on STW and his website -never seen a real life one!) Trout's lights are fantastic. When I can afford it I will get one, (I like the look of the 3 LED "mk2" 😉 )and a battery pack off Smudge. But theres the thing, at the moment I couldn't afford it. When my aging -and cr@p- cateye halogens with their giant lead battery finally died I had to get new lights and the bastid was in my budget.

Its much the same as I would dearly love to own a handcrafted Ti hardtail, I can't afford it so I ride a steel frame that was made in Taiwan.

I don't own a P7 torch so couldn't compare the bastid to it, when I had a ride with someone who had a P7 in a fenix mount on his bars he had problems with it slipping. The bastid is solid on its O ring mount (both sizes of O ring with mine were black BTW) I've done some very steep and rocky stuff with mine on and it doesnt rattle or slip at all-even stayed put during a few minor, and one major, crash- bloody thing is so bright it eggs you on too fast in the woods at night!.

Can't really see the point in replacing a properly mounted P7 torch with a bastid, maybe better run times, but then I would carry a spare cell or get a battery pack off smudge and wire that to the torch if that's an issue. A good torch is obviously more useful than a dedicated bike light. If you've already got a decent torch and you say you've got 2(?) L2D's Singletracksurfer then I would go for the bastid. It's mightily impressive.

It hopefully should be here this week sometime.

On a slightly related note, I just replaced my now dead Cateye 4 LED rear light with a Blackburn Mars 4. Very bright!!

Regards

Hi,

Arrived today and seems to be working okay after its first charge.

Has a slight issue with it cutting out on mainbeam after about ten seconds though. It works again if you uplug the battery pack and plug it back in again. Weird. This does not happen ever time though.

Will give it a proper try out tomorrow night and try some direct comparisons with my 20w Lumi halogen.

Regards.

Hi,

Did a wee test tonight with the Bastid and my Lumi 20w Halogen.

It was like night and day!! Well dusk/dawn (with the Lumi) and day (with the Bastid).

The Bastid's beam is by far much better than the Lumi (which I always thought was alright). Certainly for commuting on dark country lanes (where I do most of my night riding) it is more than enough Lumens. I felt perfectly comfortable descending at 30mph with it on the road. I would say the light was as good as the dip beams on my car (was impressed by Trout's 6 LED beam shots but having now used the Bastid I reckon it would be serious overkill for commuting, not to mention blinding for other road users ;-)).

The toggle switch for the High/Low/flashing works well. It will be interesting to see if I get flashed by drivers on the high setting. If so the quick click to the low mode might come in handy. Unfortunately you have to cycle through flashing and off to get back to high beam.

The battery pack fits nicely under my handlebar stem and overall look of the light is neat. I have taken the original mount off and replaced it with my Lumi one for ease of taking it on and off the bike.

So overall I am pleased with the Bastid as a replacement for my Lumis. It is brighter, will give longer run times and is lighter. Will now have to wait and see how it lasts over time.

Regards

thanks Billy.

I need a light asap and was hoping to get a Troutie light, but it doesn't look like I'm getting paid any time soon, so I may have to get a Bastid in the meantime.

Can you buy an extra battery pack for these?

Also, how is the light mounted to the bars?

bump

Top Dog,

If you look at Trout's photos on the first page you will see the light has a mount fixed to it which sits on top of the bars. It is attached by hooking a rubber o ring (it comes with two for normal and oversize bars) which you hook over the attachments on the mount.

Personally I replaced this fitting with a Lumicycle cam style one.

I think the Smudge fellow could sort you out with a suitable battery. Not seen any packs for sale separately.

Regards

The bastid is like mounted with O-ring type thing I believe – simple, easy, neat, effective (and cheap).

not sure about extra battery pack from DX – search/e-mail the site or ask smudge.

I'm working on it at the minute 8)
just waiting for some info from mr trout

BB.

Good post, you make some fair points, imo.

Unfortunately a lot of items for sale in the U.K. are made in China/Tiawan or India. Resulting in the situation that you couldn't buy British, even if you wanted to.

So its good that we still have the opportunity to do so when it comes to treating ourselves to some high end bike lights, such as the Trout light and Smudges Batts.

Anyway, if you do get round to owning a Trout-Smudge set-up, I hope you'll be pleased.

🙂

Solo

Out of interest, have Smudge & Trout pushed themselves enough on this thread?

I think they should put some prices up for comparable gear, I know I would of thought long & hard before purchasing the bastid light IF i had seen this thread before I bought it, seeing how this thread has developed, I probably would have never of bought one (its my light Trout reviewed) if it had of been current at the time.
So, pay a tenner to get a Trout service before you use it, or pay a bit more & get quality, come on boys push your innovations harder & make a few quid.
Cheers, & good luck chaps.

I just wanna give this thread a bump as its becoming more relevant with each fading day of summer and say hell yeah, I totally agree with 2unfit2ride – if trout and smudge can put together a 3 mode (low/mid/high) bike light with similar runtime and similar cost I'd certainly buy one and would trust its quality a great deal more than the DX one.

I would also like to know about projected prices for a trout/smudge light for this winter

I would be very interested in getting one too. I like the look of the new Lumicycle system led 4 but is very expensive,hoping it will come down in price. 🙄

Talk about frustration .
I have an inbox full of enquiries for lights and prices .
some hear the estimated price and never reply and about 30% get back still interested .

I have no housings left and the guy who CNC machined them last time seems too busy to do some more for me despite the fact they were £32 each and the last run was 43 units

also I am still waiting for the new XPG leds to be released as I dont want to use the older stuff .

Here is the breakdown so you can see what goes into a light.
The big boys will get it all a lot cheaper and will be getting their lights made in asia though Hope do their own stuff as we all know.

As I have to buy most of the bits in $ last season it had a huge impact on costs .

this is what is inside a Troutlight MK1 and what it costs me to build at todays exchange rates and prices

6 XPE leds @ £3.55 —————-£21.30
optics @ .80 ———————-£ 4.80
led driver – Maxflex ————–£22.00
waterproof switch —————-£ 5.00
housing —————————£32.00
anodising ————————-£5
other bits like 4 M3 bolts
wire
thermal adhesive
silicon
strain relief for cable
cable ( found 100 mtrs in a skip )
lexan face plate
estimate for these —————-£10/12

total cost ———£ 103.00
the total cost last season was about £115

I sold the kits to DIY for £135 plus postage
and for those who did not want to diy £165 .00 plus postage

What you got for the money was a Light with on paper lumens of 1200 with a beam that was taylored to suit either helmet or bars and for those who bought one a light that was as good or better than any of the big players lights

OK no fancy box , an email with instructions on . no fancy mounting brackets though it could be bought ready drilled and tapped to take a Lumicycle bar mount and the user had to find a velcro strap to helmet mount it or in my case 2 zipties

Now for the New stuff

I cant give prices yet as we dont know the cost of the new XPG leds but all the others things stay the same .

If I can get some more housings done then there will be 2 lights maybe 3
but first up will be the 6 led Troutlight redesigned to be even better.

the on paper lumen count will go up to 2070 lumens at full power
again with a beam pattern as good as the pics you have all seen.

then a 4 led version I am hoping to do . smaller lighter and with a slighlty better lumen count of 1380 Lumens.

again both with a tuneable beam to suit the user.

So you can see what it costs me to do a light and the huge profits I make .
I do it because I enjoy it

Yes costs could be brought down a little .
a cheap driver with no hi low or thermal protection could be used but then the lights would start to come back broken due to users letting them overheat , not something I want to be repairing lights for free.

I could go to China and have a shedload made but have no money to risk on that route, then I just become a reseller in it just for the money .

There you go folks my cards are on the table with no bullshit in there

I could easily buy a reel of P7 leds and knock up a light for the £50 but no way include the battery/charger it would be nearer to £100 or more .

but that is not what I want to do an average light
I want to do a great light.

And on Batteries / chargers
that is Smudges domain and he helps me out loads so get your replacement packs from him . they are top quality cells

trout, nice summary. Your open approach is very refreshing. It also shows the ridiculous profits made by the likes of Lupine.
I still plan to get one of the new lights from you later in the year.

trout
just posted on here to express public support
will be emailing you today to outline exactly what I need
cheers 🙂

Trout, having seen the pictures and vids of your previous work, isn't 2000 Lumens just pointlessly bright?

If I was after a compromise between brightness and runtime what's the right thing in your stable? Something that I could get around 3 hours out of a single pack and "bright enough" (whatever that is? 600 L?) for night racing / riding.

A switch would be nice to drop the output as a "get you home" mode as well.

Cheers.

Crell
well it depends on how the 2000 lumens are used and I think they are used pretty well .
I could say why have a car capable of 140 mph when 70 is the max limit.

the car has a throttle

so does the Troutlight .
you can have 2.5 hours of runtime from a 2600 mah pack at full power
but if you use the modes well then it will run all night at useable light levels

one other thing is the extra lumens from the new leds are not just at the expense of using more battery power
they are using the power better IE more light and less heat so it is a win win situation .

Trout.

Thanks for the info, much appreciated 😀

Crickey !, after reading your cost break-down I think thats a very slim margin for you on your lights. Must hardly cover your initial R&D.

Anyway, ran my light today while on a ride, it kept switching down to the L2 setting due to temping-out. I've now set the cut-in to 80 degrees. Running during a sunny day will mean higher ambient, but I like to test my efforts at the higher end of what I expect the operational conditions to be. Belt-n-braces, and all that.

Crell.
Thats the beauty of a light such as the Trout light, you can configure it to a level of light-output that you think is sufficient, assuming that the Max is too much. You can lessen the max-output setting to suit your taste, and stretch out your run time, Bonus !.

Cheers 😉

Solo.

I apologise Mr Trout if I have caused you any grief from the time wasters, it was obviously not my intention.

For what its worth, I wouldn't bother buying a light that was overkill for my needs 99% of the time, you need to come up with a reliable alternative to the bastid at around the £100 mark if you wish to compete with the masses.

So, how much would it cost to 'mod' an existing light such as the DX to make it better & more reliable, given your CNC cost alone are close to the price of said fatherless light??

Most seem to think the flashing mode is not worth the effort, so a simple & reliable 2/3 stage switch/board is in order. A decent charger for the battery wouldn't go a miss, add that on, maybe team up with smudge?

AFAIK, only a very small number of people want, & are willing to pay for, the best. So you make your choice as to which way you want to run on the basis of small & niche (like Jones bikes), or more turnover with lesser margin (like most manufacturers).

What you really need to work out is if this is to be a hobby for pin money, or a business, only you know that answer, & TBH it's none of my business anyway.
I have only posted this as my opinion, you have every right to tell me to FO, but it was meant as a pointer, not an order or request, best of luck in all that you do. 🙂

Is the 3 XPE/XPG light with built in battery a no go then Trout??

I would like to see some research/surveys into what people want

i recon half the light of some of your lights could be sufficient.

2.5hrs and 2000 lumens is fairly useless for me, sure i know you can dim them and get better battery life

duration, beam pattern, easy of dimming (for road sections), excellent qr clamp & weight is way more important to me

secondary would be water proofness, changeable battery, wireless perhaps.. and some **** accurate battery life times (this is not a dig at yours)

where are the electronics for hope lights made? not by hope.

I want the best Brightest light for the money as you can always turn it down. This will then match the bike I have that I can't ride.

Keep up this great work Trout, we need more guys like you.

This is really good thread and hoping these new XPG's come out soon as I'm very tempted with 2000 lumens if only to arrive on the night ride and fry the Lupine boys.
S

My opinion is that this thread must have been good for Trout and Smudge.
Although I have got a DX bastid, it was in my budget as I've said before, (still no problems with it BTW).
Trouts honest and unbiased review and both their answers to queries on the Bastid are a credit to them. I am under no illusion that my light is anywhere near the quality of Trouts lights and Smudges battery packs. Then there is the assurance of that quality, although spangles DX lights where replaced as they where DOA I'm sure they wouldnt treat my used and mud-spattered one as sympathetically if it packs up on me-not to mention the hassle of returning it to them anyway.
I don't think Trout and Smudge will "lose" any customers to the DX really anyway. I am a goldsmith by trade and couldn't hope to try to compete price-wise with Argos jewellery for example, but the people who come to me (usually) know that. They are a different client base who know that quality and guarantee are worth an extra cost.

+1 with blastit and billyboulders. I really, really want one of Trouties planet scourer lights, and I'll find a way to pay for one, but, in the meantime my fatherless light is giving me adequate service for not a lot of money. I can justify paying Trout what he asks for his light, I can see exactly where every penny goes, whereas there is no way I could justify paying what Hope, Exposure, and especially Lupine ask for their lights. I genuinely think Trout does better R&D than most of the big boys, redesigning the front of the light to put more light just in front of the front wheel being a case in point. It's all down to value for money: the DX lights are good VFM, Trouts lights, good VFM. Lupine? What do YOU think?

Solo

Good stuff And thanks for your support

2unfit
No apologies needed and a sensible post it is just done for fun and to keep my brain working as fitting floors is not too brain taxing.
and if it makes a little cash on the side then it is a bonus .
be nice to make a living out of it but the bastid puts that idea out the window

Kinda666
The batteries included is on a back burner and lent to a guy racing in America

Dobo
Yes sure would be a good idea and there is good feedback on to what suits some folks on here .
and most of the things you say apply to my stuff

Topdog

probably China

Blastit
Billy
Count

Thanks all good points and it is good to see some folks who want the best but not at any cost
I am not going to even try and do cheap and cheerfull except to offload my old stock , ( which is still better than most mainstream leds )

and do kits and some built up kick ass lights and bespoke insane ones too
I get quite a few requests for strange one off lights which is a whole load more fun than churning out the same thing all the time.

I think I need one of these Badly Drawn Fish light/battery combos.

Smudge..Trout…Geddit?

Have emailed.

Oops 😳

"Anyway, ran my light today while on a ride, it kept switching down to the L2 setting due to temping-out. I've now set the cut-in to 80 degrees. Running during a sunny day will mean higher ambient, but I like to test my efforts at the higher end of what I expect the operational conditions to be. Belt-n-braces, and all that."

I must point out that I am referring to one of my own lights and a light from Trout. Just in case anyone was thinking that.

Solo

Aarrgh !. That should read:

"I must point out that I am referring to one of my own lights and NOT a light from Trout. Just in case anyone was thinking that"

I'm going to go have a rest 😳

Solo.

Thanks for this thread – just ordered the Bike light – already have a P7 – but two are better than one. I'm almost excited about the dark nights now !

Hello all, sorry if it's bad protocol to resurrect this old thread but I thought it was the best place to post a "long term" report.

My bastid is over 6 months old now and has had alot of use and many charge cycles and has still given me no trouble whatsoever. I have seen the reports re. dodgy chargers (dangerously dodgy in some cases) I always charge it at work-they've got fire extinguishers handy!-and always keep an eye on it but to date the charger has never got any warmer than the one on my daughters Nintendo DS (for example). The light unit itself still works as brightly as day one and the battery pack holds its charge as well as ever. The only mods I've done were to unscrew the bezel and put a spot of grease on the threads to water proof things a bit more, I did the same with the mounting screw underneath. I've also put the battery pack inside a placcy bag as I can see how water may seep into the heat wrap on it. Both the light and battery have been absolutely soaked on some rides and have suffered no ill effects.

If you can run to it definitely get a Trout/Smudge combo……but (based solely on my own experience) I can't rate the bastid highly enough for those on a budget. It should have won STW's product of the year IMO!