Snowboarderists, What binding angles do you use?

Play around. I found the most important factor was how comfortable it was to move the knee though a complete range of motion and stay in balance i.e. knees open enough, but not too much. Feet wide enough apart but not too much.

I tried a more forward facing position like the hardboot carvers but struggled, and it started to feel like mono-skiing and I don’t wear a turquoise one-piece skisuit.

I’m currently at +15-5 with a fairly wide foot stance biased toward the back of the board. It works best in soft snow and is still passable carving on-piste but good enough to really go for it. I need a bigger board really ~162.

If I had a day alone I would learn to ride switch, but I’m always out with mates who are not interested in “homework”

If you have your hips parallel with the board then equal +ive and -ive is “correct” bio-mechanically. Think about how you would stand if you were squatting (weightlifting) – you want your feet pointed so your knees can track over them.

If you have your hips rotated forward then you need to rotate the feet forwards as well and in extreme examples (like in klumpys pictures) where you are basically just blasting down the mountain virtually in a straight line you will want to have the hips and both feet pointing forwards.

I normally end up changing the angles a few times each day depending on my mood, the terrain & the conditions. Generally I find equal duck-footedness is more comfortable and gives more control at lower speeds, plus it makes switch much easier.

+12 -9 with a fairly wide stance.

It’s all down to biomechanics though innit? I will tweak my setup though by +/- 3 degrees as the season progresses and muscles adapt (or injury requires it)

Think the general rules (as mentioned above) is that the total angle shouldn’t exceed 30 degrees and when you bend you knees (keeping a straight back ie. without ‘breaking’ at the waist), your kneecaps should ‘track’ roughly inline over your ‘second’ toe.

This should help reduce the risk of knee injuries and facilitate edge-to-edge transfer and allow torsional twisting of the board.

The exception is hardboot carving when +ve angles are used for both bindings

maybe when kids are old enough to board I’ll join their lessons and learn to ride properly

Read/watch this:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1405315741

It is a really good book and DVD that talks you through the basics of turning, shifting your weight etc.

I’m self-taught and I found it quite useful because it made me think a lot more about what I had already blindly stumbled my way towards. A mate of mine, who has also ridden for years without lessons, had an epiphany and realised why his technique left his legs burning.

Probably no substitute for real lessons, but it has the advantage that you can do it at home before a holiday.

Disappointed that klumpy didn’t bite my trolling 😉

This is actually quite interesting stuff. I’d reckon I’m beginner/intermediate and riding a 166cm Forum Symbol with around +18 and I think about -9. Most of my riding is on piste, but I was at the point last year where I was starting to duck into some of the trees.

Other than comfort, is there any performance / control benefit to making my stance more balanced? I’m heading out on hols in three weeks, but going to Braehead for one last play tomorrow night so I might take my bindings tool along with me and have a play!

Disappointed that klumpy didn’t bite my trolling

Oh, yes right. Well, a wide duck footed stance is kind of “Tubby sweaty old lady struggling with shopping bags trying to get some air up her unmentionables” while a proper carving stance is a lot more “Swordman poised to strike”.

And riding switch is for when you bottled a turn due to very small testicles.

And we don’t want to be seen obviously going through exercises with you as that would implicitly associate us with your dreadful sallopettes. 😆

+1 for Neil McNab’s ‘Go Snowboard’ book!

The DVD’s is worth the cover price alone as it features the lovely Jenny Jones! 😀

your dreadful sallopettes

They are “finest green” and pants, not pettes! You’re lucky I’ve not had time to source some postbox red ones. Maybe I’ll find some while mooching around the shops in Innsbruck.

Other than comfort, is there any performance / control benefit to making my stance more balanced?

Do you mean balanced as in the same angles +/- on each binding or balanced as in having a centred stance?

One of the main reasons for having a higher angle on your leading foot is so that it ‘opens’ your body up for visibility in the primary direction of travel.

They are “finest green” and pants, not pettes! You’re lucky I’ve not had time to source some postbox red ones. Maybe I’ll find some while mooching around the shops in Innsbruck.

red snowboard trousers create negative steez and should never ever be worn, regardless of binding angle. Even Gigi Ruf looks bad in red trousers.

Only the awesomest people can pull off red trousers. Like me.

I’m maybe not as awesome as I one was, so I’ve pulled back to khaki (whisper it) *salopettes*.

Only the awesomest people can pull off red trousers. Like me.

http://lookatmyfuckingredtrousers.blogspot.co.uk/

LOL at red trousered blog!

Do you mean balanced as in the same angles +/- on each binding or balanced as in having a centred stance?

Sorry Digby, should have been clearer. I think I’m pretty centrally planted on the board, but yes I was wondering if there was any handling or performance gains to be had with more evenly balanced angles between each foot. I’m always looking for any little advantage that would make my toe edge turns less terrifying! 😯

I think I’ve always had a fairly high angle on my front leg because my old board was quite narrow and my boots were huuuuge! I’ve now got a longer, slightly wider board and dinky little Burton Moto’s so am interested in what the costs / benefits of different angles might be if you see what I mean. The explanation that you give for a greater angle on the leading foot makes perfect clear sense to me, but I’d never really thought about it that way before, cheers!

+15 -15 and as wide as possible/confortable (you can find a ‘tipping point’ where you feel too wide and then bring it back in a notch). On any Board I ride (currently a twin-tip rocker).

The Go Snowboard book/DVD is defo worth getting

Yeah, I’m +15/-15 – tried loads of messing about and it’s what I feel comfy with.

I don’t think there’s a right answer, though – everyone’s legs are different…

Or you can take a different view.

If the snow conditions are good groom or pow then I setup duck +15 -9.

If I want to carve fast piste/offpiste and/or want to be able to do quick turns (ie mogul or steep technical runs) or get to extra grip and control when it is icy, then I use a very forward stance +45 +30.

I find neither one is better – just different for different types of riding.

Don’t dismiss a forward stance because it old fashioned – the amount of pressure you can apply with this stance is phenomenal in comparison to duck.

I was wondering if there was any handling or performance gains to be had with more evenly balanced angles between each foot

Once you’ve worked out what your ‘biomechanical’ angle is, (i.e the ‘natural angle \/ that forms when you assume an ‘action’ or ‘ready’ cowboy stance) then how you transfer this to the board can involve a bit of trial and error.

As mentioned earlier, having the greater angle on the leading foot is to do with your field of view.

Unfortunately for many progressing riders, if this angle is too agrressive then it can result in the hips & upper body twisting into to fall line which then means they ‘break’ at the waist and lean over towards the slope on a heel-to-toe side turn.

A more neutral stance, keeping the upper body ‘stacked’ & alligned with the board and looking over your shoulder in the direction you want to go may help improve your toe-side turns.

Worth considering having a lesson or getting someone to film you and then tweak your stance accordingly.

GrahamS – Member

maybe when kids are old enough to board I’ll join their lessons and learn to ride properly

Read/watch this:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1405315741

It is a really good book and DVD that talks you through the basics of turning, shifting your weight etc.

I’m self-taught and I found it quite useful because it made me think a lot more about what I had already blindly stumbled my way towards. A mate of mine, who has also ridden for years without lessons, had an epiphany and realised why his technique left his legs burning.

Probably no substitute for real lessons, but it has the advantage that you can do it at home before a holiday.

Or better still, sign up for a week of getting beasted by the man himself… McNab

I’ve done 3 or 4 weeks with him and Keith (the guy who appears in the DVD) and step one is to get your stance right. Nice and wide to give you balance and biomechanically correct so you can move the pressure round the board and turn it easily and accurately.
His approach is that you stand naturally with your feet apart. There should be 20-30 degree angle between front and back foot. You then turn your head to look over your front shoulder. That’ll bring your feet round very slightly. Those should be your angles – natural from a biomechanical view but slightly biased towards going forward.
Personally, mine are about +18 -9.

I think I’m pretty centrally planted on the board

Most boards should have “reference” stance marked on them, usually with a little symbol between the four holes.

That should be your “centrally planted” starting point for stance width and position. That’s what the board was designed for. Then you tweak it from there (maybe move one hole back for off-piste, maybe one wider for a big freestyle stance etc)

I’m always looking for any little advantage that would make my toe edge turns less terrifying!

Dunno what level yer at, but work on finishing your turns properly. Let yourself look up the slope to commit your body, rock onto the edge, crouch and ride it round – no kicking! So many people are looking down slope over their lead shoulder while kicking the tail round.

Don’t dismiss a forward stance because it old fashioned – the amount of pressure you can apply with this stance is phenomenal in comparison to duck.

I think alot of this depends on the style and age of your board – most modern boards of the twin-tip, or directional twin-tip design are designed to be ridden with 4 distinct pressure points.

Older style racing or GS boards are very much carve-monsters and may well benefit from a ‘forward stance’

I ride goofy, fairly wide and at +21 and -9.

Just serviced a mates board and he rides +15, -6.

Take a board tool up the hill with you and have a play, go with what’s comfortable for you and not what everyone else says you should have.

Oh and have fun!!

So many people are looking down slope over their lead shoulder while kicking the tail round.

Yeah I do that and it cocks up the carve at the end of the turn and ruins the pop/flip into the next turn. I think picked-up looking down the fall line at all times from skiing.

Digby, I do agree with what you are saying regarding modern board design but I just think the amount you can angle a board is much higher with a forward stance. i.e. there is no possible way you can euro carve with duck. (front edge maybe – back edge no way!)

End of the day, trying out 100 different stance angles is FREE! FREE! FREE! (unlike trying stem lengths and wide bars) so just carry a short Phillips and go for it.

it cocks up the carve at the end of the turn and ruins the pop/flip into the next turn

I think two of the most common ‘habits’ than inhibit a riders progression are: 1) leaning into the slope and bending at the waist on a toe-side and 2) looking down the slope on a heel-side, rather than across towards the desired direction of travel resulting in a stalled/skidded turn rather than a carved turn.

As many have said: sort out your stance; look where you want to go (whilst also keeping an eye open for other slope users); use flexion & extension to weight and un-weight the board and drive it round using each of the ‘four corners’. This prevents counter-rotation and stops you kicking the tail round that so often results in poor technique and can leave riders struggling when riding off-piste and in powder.

+21 / -18, centred, and as wide as the bindings will go on an 155 Evil Twin – I ride switch as much as I ride regular.

However on my 179 (!) splitboard, I ride +21 / -9, wide, and set back as far as the bindings will go. I don’t tend to bother riding switch on that, it’s a full on powder speed machine.

It comes down to personal preference to be honest, as long as you are comfortable. Oh, stick a load of forward lean on the highbacks – it may make your thighs ache, but it’ll force you to bend your knees more and that will make you ride a lot better!

Yep, when I close my eyes and think about it, I reckon I do all of the above Digby! 🙄

I’m gonna try and look where I want to go, a bit like on the bike I suppose, from now on! Ironic as I’m always telling off my learner ski mates for looking at their tips all the time!

Thanks for the hints dude, I’m away to dig out that book/dvd combo and have another look at it before the holidays!

B. 😀

Thanks for the hints dude

You’re very welcome. Good luck with the progression and have a great holiday! 8)

However on my 179 (!) splitboard

Wow … that must have a helluva turning circle! And that’s a big jump up from a 155 Evil Twin.

Do you mind me asking what make / model that is?

I’m a 18/20 at the front end and around -5 at the back.

+18 on the front and -15 on the back for me. I used to run -9 on the back but an instructor suggested I turn the back a bit more negative and take my stance wider to help with carved toeside turns.

Never have a problem with them anymore and can lean the board right over. I find heel edge turns a bit more difficult to hook up but not a massive problem.

My current board is a Never Summer Raptor 163. A directional freeride board that rarely gets ridden switch for long amounts of time. With those angles I find it very easy to ride, stable as hell when going quick (50mph plus).

I use +15 front and -6 back……

For 4 years I struggled on my current board to feel really confident at high speed and fast turns….. Last year I was persuaded to move my bindings apart by an inch or so…… It literally revolutionised the feel and stability .

Until I hit an edge at 42 mph on GPS I was going great ! Broken ribs stopped play ! Lol