Rugby world cup

hey Bryce you **** this isnt legal on so many levels, going in the side and trying to rip heads off could be considered dangerous.

I thought he was supposed to have been biased to Australia. Jeez what was he watching when that was going on?
Apart from that Burger had a good game.

bump

just realised the tag “arse oout in burtons window if this makes 3000” wonder who put that in?

👿

Thankfully the pommy rugby teams departing our shores.What did they give to the game.Miserable soulless rugby, no smiles, boorish behaviour and attitude.Goodbye and dont hurry back.Thankfully there should be some entertaining rugby ahead with four teams full of entertainment and skill to cap off a very successful and enjoyable rugby festival.One of the great joys has been seeing all the different nationalities travelling the country and enjoying there time here.

I thought he was supposed to have been biased to Australia

Not sure he was biased although the try he took back for the forward pass was wrong IMO. He just reduced the breakdown to a farce which meant SA could never get any momentum

check this one out for quality off your feet action
http://i54.tinypic.com/118f4ea.jpg

two aussie tackles seal off the ball and two Saffa’s go in like synchronised divers!!!

I have to say I don’t agree AA – he was more lenient than some at the breakdown but it was the same for both sides. Multiple offences from both sides in the clip above.

forward pass was forward as well on my telly

Thankfully the pommy rugby teams departing our shores.What did they give to the game.Miserable soulless rugby, no smiles, boorish behaviour and attitude.Goodbye and dont hurry back.Thankfully there should be some entertaining rugby ahead with four teams full of entertainment and skill to cap off a very successful and enjoyable rugby festival.One of the great joys has been seeing all the different nationalities travelling the country and enjoying there time here.

I’m also glad that it’ll soon be over, nothing but a negative input and if anything just damaging to the whole atmosphere. And I think just very unwelcome to the less than positive contribution.

First time i’ve seen that jamie roberts rampage. Didn’t he run over Hape in the 2nd warm up match?

Multiple offences from both sides in the clip above

But rules is rules and the problem was he let so much go it was just dangerous, had Bakkies Botha been playing he’d have broken Pockock for sure because he wasnt blowing for pens early enough. Aus tackles just lay all over the ball and Pocock got hands on, he let let it keep going so the Saffas were diving head first into Pocock or trying to pull his head off.

Did you watch the IRB explanation of a forward pass I posted earlier?

If the ref blew for every infringement the game would never get going. its a question of how lenient they want to be

A forward pass is a forward pass – if it travels towards the goal line at all. Nothing to do with where the men are or how they are running – its the flight of the ball that matters. teh rules are quite clear

It was forward IMO

anagallis_arvensis – Member

Multiple offences from both sides in the clip above

But rules is rules…..

I’ve been complaining about the standard of reffing for a long time now. Most rules, ahem, laws to use the ridiculously pompous term, aren’t applied in most games. Scrums fed crookedly, crooked line-out throws, forward passes, and so on.

The breakdown is the area that was supposed to be stringently reffed this year, but we still have piles of bodies on the ground, players coming in from all directions, etc, etc. (Obviously Ireland are the worst offenders, DD! 😆 )

I’m assuming that the refs in NZ have been instructed to make sure that the game is accessible to non-rugby watchers and to cut down on the more technical decisions, but I can’t believe the amounts of knock-ons that are being waved on, the offside that is allowed.

As you say, the breakdwon situation is becoming dangerous. If the rules were applied properly though, they would benefit teams with proper open side flankers. Such as the 4 that have got through to the quarters.

Anyway, not sure where I’m going with this, so I’ll stop!

if it travels towards the goal line at all. Nothing to do with where the men are or how they are running

not true according to the IRB
see here this is originally from the IRB website
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=box08lq9ylg

Yes it is – check the rule book

DEFINITION: THROW FORWARD

A throw forward occurs when a player throws or passes the ball forward. ‘Forward’ means towards the opposing team’s dead ball line.

http://www.irblaws.com/EN/laws/3/12/111/during-the-match/knock-on-or-throw-forward/definition-throw-forward/#clause_111

Lots of people including those who put the clip together get confused about this – but the rule is clear. there was some discussion of the momentum pass and so on but the rule remains the same

so have you watched the video? care to explain how seemingly 90% of the passes in a game are not ruled forward then?

Lots of people including those who put the clip together get confused about this

that’ll be the IRB, you know the people who make the rules and control the refs?

Read the rules from the IRB.

Some forward passes don’t get called because of the optical illusion you refer to but the rules as defined by the IRB is clear and as I quoted

A throw forward occurs when a player throws or passes the ball forward. ‘Forward’ means towards the opposing team’s dead ball line.

I think you are missing the point, if you throw it forward its a forward pass clearly, but you can throw it backwards ie towards your own dead ball line and the over all direction of the pass can be forward from the point of release.

while your here, do you still think all of Scotlands 9 options are superior to Mike Phllips 😆

AA – have athink about it

The only thing that matters is the direction of the ball. You either throw it towards the opponents dead ball line or you don’t

but you can throw it backwards ie towards your own dead ball line and the over all direction of the pass can be forward from the point of release.

Impossible – the ball goes in the direction thrown

A throw forward occurs when a player throws or passes the ball forward. ‘Forward’ means towards the opposing team’s dead ball line

That’s not clear at all! You can THROW the ball backwards, but it can TRAVEL forwards because you’re running forwards.

Which is what the vid says.

Anyway this is a stupid argument and can we PLEASE not destroy this RWC thread with such nerdiness? Please? 🙂

Not impossible. Throw a ball on a backward diagonal out of the window of a car doing 30mph or so, see where it ends up relative to the point of release.
Same principle.
You can throw a ball backwards, relative to the moving thrower, that travels forward relative to the ground.

molgrips – if you throw the ball backwards it travels backwards, if it travels forward you threw it forward. Stuey its relative to the dead ball line that counts. thats what the law says

Very clear and the law is clear.

Philips – on my list of people you would never get tired of slapping

if you throw the ball backwards it travels backwards, if it travels forward you threw it forward

🙄

You know who this is?

Which direction would the ball go if the thrower is on a conveyor belt?

I know what the law says, I’ve read it too.
It says that if the ball is thrown forward then it is a forward pass. It doesn’t say anything about the ball travelling forward.
The video demonstrates that it is possible to throw a ball backwards, that actually travels forwards. That is why there is room for interpretation in the law, and the allowing of the “momentum pass” by the referees.

A throw forward occurs when a player throws or passes the ball forward. ‘Forward’ means towards the opposing team’s dead ball line.

thats the wording in the IRB rulebook. Not relative to the player – relative to the dead ball line

It ois simply impossible to throw the ball backwards and it travel forwards 🙄 mo0menteum pass is not allowed for.

TJ slapping Mike Phillips 😆

If you throw it backwards over your head, you are THROWING it away from the opponent’s line, aren’t you? But the ball can travel forwards.

Moving frame of reference – that sentence does not address the problem of moving reference frames.

It doesn’t say “the ball must not travel towards the dead ball line” does it? It says it must not be thrown towards it. It’s possible to both throw the ball away from the dead ball line and have it travel towards it.

It ois simply impossible to throw the ball backwards and it travel forwards

Yes it is. Clearly possible.

Very simple physics, now let’s move on.

TJ in physics arguing black is white shocker….

The physics is clear and so is the law. Its in relation to the dead ball line not the player according to the law, that vid is from the ARU as a discussion piece. the “momentum” pass is allowed in league but not in union.

the law is clear. Even if the movement of the players arms is backwards in relation to the player if the ball goes forward due to his movement forward it is a forward pass.

In which case, there have been one hell of a lot of forward passes that have gone unnoticed, including several over-the-head ones. Perhaps the clear law is clearly wrong and clearly needs updating to account for basic physics?

Of course, were the players on a conveyor belt……

Passing
A player may pass (throw the ball) to a team mate who is in a better position to continue the attack, but the pass must not travel towards the opposing team’s goal line. It must travel either directly across the field, or back in the direction of the passer’s own goal line.

http://www.irb.com/mm/document/training/0/beginners20guide20en_7391.pdf

The physics is clear

To us, yes. Apparently not to you 🙂 If it were you’d realise that the rulebook and that training document (ie not a rulebook) contradict each other.

The IRB have published that forward pass video on their own youtube channel, so I think it’s clear where the game’s rulemakers stand on this issue.

guys – the rule and the physics are clear. I understand what you are saying about the momentum pass – in relation to the player its backward. However it is clearly not allowed for in the rules which define the movement of the ball in relation to the dead ball line.

The two links I post do not contradict each other, there never has been a directive from the IRB allowing the momentum pass nor has there been any rule change.

yes stuey =- that the momentum pass is not allowed. its very clear. I cannot believe you are arguing for this

Point to an IRB rule, directive or anything else that says it is allowed. the vid does not. Its a discussion piece

However it is clearly not allowed for in the rules which define the movement of the ball in relation to the dead ball line.

But they don’t. They define the direction of the throw in relation to the dead ball line.

I’ll say it very slowly. everything is measured in relation to the dead ball line. the direction of the throw and the movement of the ball relative to the dead ball line are the same. even if the throw is backward in relation to the player it can be forward in relation to the dead ball line and that is the only thing that counts. In relation to the dead ball line

I ask again

What IRB rule, interpretation, directive or any other document allows the momentum pass? when were the refs told to allow these passes as not being forward?

You patronising sod.

The rule does not reference the direction of travel of the ball, only the direction of the throw. You are inferring that this is the same as the travel of the ball. There is room for interpretation of the law. This is why it is debated on forums and in pubs the world over. This is why people have gone to the trouble to produce videos about it.