Rishi! Sunak!

I wonder what next week will bring?

A defection from Suella Braverman? She seems determined to sabotage Rishi Sunak.

I’ve always thought that crossing the floor should trigger a by-election. Her electors voted for her with “Conservative” next to her name.

You almost feel sorry for Sunak, getting spiked like that at PMQs

but Elphicke is just a horrible person

80 seat majority now down to 38?!

80 seat majority now down to 38?!

I wonder if that’s some sort of record?

ransosFree Member
I’ve always thought that crossing the floor should trigger a by-election. Her electors voted for her with “Conservative” next to her name.

That would play into the hands of the ‘Party’ as they could threaten MP’s with removal of the Whip (and then they’d lose their job).

I’ve always thought that crossing the floor should trigger a by-election. Her electors voted for her with “Conservative” next to her name.

Except that’s not, in theory, how the system is supposed to work. Iirc, you technically vote for an individual to be your MP, and whoever gets the most MPs to support them becomes PM? Though I’m happy to be proven wrong.

I agree with Ernie in that she won’t encourage people to support Labour. She will, however, put people off voting Tory, and maybe hasten the election, so I think Labour have done the pragmatic thing, held their noses and accepted her defection.

I know pragmatism is frowned upon by the poltically aware on here.

I know pragmatism is frowned upon by the poltically aware on here.

Indeed. Remarkable how some would prefer an ideologically pure opposition than a centre left government in power.

centre left government in power.

Are you taking the piss? Centre left governments don’t invite rightwing bigots into their party.

How about a bit of self-respect?

Exactly this. While it’s one thing offering previously Tory voters a warm welcome, Elphicke represents everything that is wrong with the modern Tory party. She’s not a moderate in any sense, and she has absolutely nothing to offer the party except a cheap headline.

Labour had more to gain from saying ‘thanks but no thanks’ to this one.

so I think Labour have done the pragmatic thing, held their noses and accepted her defection.

The vast amount of folks who aren’t really interested in politics won’t read past the headline of “Another Tory defects to Labour” and it’s just another nail in the coffin for Sunak’s administration , and it reminds folks (again, and so soon after the last one) that the Tories are such losers even their own MPs are defecting.

I doubt Starmer beyond the photo op thinks she’ll be making any sort of contribution to the opposition, and I doubt Elphicke thinks she’ll be an MP for more than  few months more despite crossing the floor. She always was just a chancer hoping for sympathy votes as a Tory placeholder in lieu of her husband after all.

Remarkable how some would prefer an ideologically pure oposition than a centre left government in power.

Of course, if you make a Faustian pact to do anything so grubby as to want to get into power to actually change things; as opposed to protesting which is both much more ideologically satisfying and comes with added bonus of never having to actually do anything – then you should be punished.

Labour getting into power is not dependent on recruiting the likes of Elphicke. There’s no need to be quite that grubby.

It’s all a bit bizarre. I would have thought the natural home for this particular MP would be Reform rather than Labour. Maybe she just can’t stand 30p Lee.

Labour getting into power is not dependent on recruiting the likes of Elphicke.

Of course not, no one thinks that it is, least of all Elphicke or Starmer. It’s just about telling the media that the Tories are still shit, and that’s how they’ll report it. “Blow to Sunak as another MP defects” “Sunak rues election day as another MP crosses the floor” That sort of gig. What the headline won’t be is “Hard Right Tory MP seems an odd fit for the Labour party and everyone’s a bit confused by it all” That’ll be the 9th paragraph in the story that no-one will read.

I mean a different Tory defected the other day as well, and unless I google it, I can’t remember his name, and I’m 100% more clued up on politics than most of the public. Of all the things to get cross at this version of Labour, this seems the most ephemeral, and least important.

It’s all a bit bizarre. I would have thought the natural home for this particular MP would be Reform rather than Labour.

Exactly .

So according to this thread it turns out that for some people, who have been raging against the Rwanda/culture war/etc, being a right-wing racist and a bigot isn’t a problem after all, just as long as you join the Labour Party.

With so much hypocrisy surrounding politics is it much wonder that voters become cynical and switch off?

at this point Labour are trying to force a GE any way they can

and realistically the ONLY way thats going to happen is to make Sunak so peeved that he just calls a GE so he can sod off to California ASAP!

elphicke is a horrible person, no doubt, but now she’ll have to vote with labour on various policies oncluding immigration or face being booted out!

Lets be honest – it’s another blow to Sunak after a week of blows.

Death by a 1000 cuts. Would still rather they wrote a letter than defected though.

The Beeb have an article up about the defection, here’s a few takeaways from it.

They (defectors) are a morale-lifting fillip for the party of the new arrival, and debilitating for the party the MP has left, particularly when it’s from the governing to the main opposition party.

Why? They personify very starkly what an opposition party is seeking to do on a far wider scale – tempt people who recently backed the Conservatives to switch to backing Labour

And the party political words of the defecting MP have an additional capacity to wound given their previous political home.

“The centre ground has been abandoned and key pledges of the 2019 manifesto have been ditched. Meanwhile the Labour Party has changed out of all recognition.”

For those in the press gallery during Prime Minister’s Questions, it was quite a moment as Keir Starmer did a spot of gloating about his latest new MP.

There was a bemusement and confusion from many on the Conservative benches.

This, the newspaper headlines and on the TV news services is all this is about. She wont be allowed anywhere near immigration policy and her name will be forgotten in weeks but this trickle of defections will fester in the Tory party.

And as a reminder Labour currently have a huge lead over the Tories, so abandoning  principles might not be quite that vital and necessary.

I wasn’t of any Labour principles under starmer and his fawning acolytes to abandon any further than they already have, he’s a vapid dick

I love this quote :

As Steve Baker, the government’s Northern Ireland Minister and erstwhile champion of the Tory Eurosceptics, noted on Twitter: “I have been searching in vain for a Conservative MP who thinks themself to the right of Natalie Elphicke”

I guess the question is with the general election no more than about 6 months away what was the motivation behind her decision?

She was going to be out of frontline politics quite soon anyway and I doubt that she was wrestling with her conscience after five years of being a Tory MP.

So maybe just deep hatred for Rishi Sunak and the Tory Party? Unlikely I would have thought.

Most likely like Dan Poulter an eye on her post-parliamentary career, and maybe lucrative contracts from a well disposed Labour government that owes her a favour or two.

Whatever the motive there will definitely have been one.

They could have some fun with Elphicke by introducing a series of highly ‘woke’ motions and amendments and three line whipping her into voting for them. See if they can get her to defect twice in a week.

Not being well received by some members of Labour

EXC: Backlash over Natalie Elphicke defection

Seven female Labour MPs tell us they are unhappy at her admission, one left in tears by the news.

w/@AgnesChambre https://t.co/vOsKIfs2yU

— Esther Webber (@estwebber) May 8, 2024

After her husband got sent down for rape she publicly distanced her self from him, but she secretly vistited him in prison (according to a friend of a friend who worked there)

Are you taking the piss? Centre left governments don’t invite rightwing bigots into their party.

They’ll accept them if it makes tne government look even weaker than it is and increase the chance of an earlier election.

Obviously,  Reform looks her natural home, but if you’d sooner reject her move to Labour, potentially delaying tne inevitable election and leaving the Tories in power even longer, you do you.

https://www.politico.eu/article/tory-natalie-elphicke-defection-sparks-backlash-labour-women/

Seven female Labour MPs, granted anonymity to speak frankly about sentiment inside the party, told POLITICO they were uncomfortable with her switch.

So now things have become so dire within the Labour Party that Labour politicians have to be granted anonymity before they can speak frankly.

But a shadow minister said there was “a lot of unease” because “Natalie has said some abhorrent things and I’m not sure her values are those we should be aspiring to have in the party.”

But surely Natalie changed her values today?

Welcome, Sheev Palpatine, the new Labour MP for Naboo. https://t.co/jxA5z4tDh7 pic.twitter.com/6X6lTQaEPC

— Julianna ? (@BatarianGal) May 8, 2024

Obviously,  Reform looks her natural home

Does this really even need saying? You are the leader of the opposition you have a chance to either 1. increase your MP head count at the expense of the Tories, or 2. Hand a media victory and the next few days of headlines as Reform gets its first MP?

As David Sedaris pointed out only a few days ago; If the waiter offers you a choice of chicken or a shit sandwich rolled in broken glass, the correct answer is not; “How’s the Chicken cooked?”

Some weird stuff on this thread. The MPs who are members of the European Research Group are totally vilified on STW as the very worse of the Tory scum. As the most rightwing of this rightwing of the Tory government they are almost nazis. God help anyone who suggests otherwise.

And yet today I discover that if a member of the ERG wants to join the Labour Party hey that’s cool, why not?

She won’t be an MP come the election, and her seat now has a very high chance of going to Labour. Her letter is full of praise for Labour accepting Brexit (you know, that thing you wanted despite not being right wing). Getting people who, bizarrely, wanted Brexit to now vote Labour has clearly been key to Labour’s election plan. Painful though that is if you want evidence based politics and as speedy a rebuilding of connections with the rest of Europe as possible.

I think Reform have an MP Nick. Although forgetting about him is probably wise.

Getting people who, bizarrely, wanted Brexit to now vote Labour has clearly been key to Labour’s election plan.

Really ? You think Brexit will be a key issue  next general election which is why Starmer has welcomed her with open arms?

And in answer to your question Nick I would go to a different restaurant. I don’t eat chicken nor shit rolled in broken glass.

The idea that Starmer had no choice but to welcome a rightwing/ERG Tory into the Labour Party, and that we have no choice but to accept it, is absurd.

I have repeatedly pointed out in the past on here that unlike most other European countries the far-right has not had any significant electoral success in the UK, the invariable response has been “but that is because the Tory Party today is the far-right”.

So my question now is does Natalie Elphicke represent the far-right in UK politics?

I think that I’m with Ernie on this one.  Party that welcomes Elphicke is not a political party I’m at home in.  This of course means voting Green in a winnable seat for Labour.  Awesome 😔

And yet today I discover that if a member of the ERG wants to join the Labour Party hey that’s cool, why not?

Blue team bad red team good.

The idea that Starmer had no choice but to welcome a rightwing/ERG Tory into the Labour Party, and that we have no choice but to accept it, is absurd.

Hey we don’t want to change any narrative – we just want to be the replacement Conservatives.

And in answer to your question Nick I would go to a different restaurant. I don’t eat chicken nor shit rolled in broken glass.

You assume Nicks metaphor allowed the option of another restaurant. I admire the commitment you snd others have to your values, but most of us would prefer an attainable if unpleasant change rather tnan a perfection that will never happen immediately.

If youd sooner be hungry than hold your nose and eat chicken, that’s your choice

And in answer to your question Nick I would go to a different restaurant.

Ah well, avoiding the question is as clear as the obvious answer. It’s not that he didn’t have a choice, he chose the path that gave him the best weapon with which to beat Sunak over the head. Which is; your MPs are abandoning your ship. That’s the sum total of the start middle and finish of today’s proceedings.

I think that I’m with Ernie on this one.  Party that welcomes Elphicke is not a political party I’m at home in.  This of course means voting Green in a winnable seat for Labour.  Awesome 😔

That’s because we have only one way of doing lazy arse politics these days. Shift rightwards – adopt flawed economic policies.

The arguments for moving left are more robust and pragmatic – but ya know, path of least resistance etc.

You think Brexit will be a key issue next general election which is why Starmer has welcomed her with open arms?

No. It won’t, because Labour have neutralized the issue. They’ve bent over backwards to do so. Even an ex-ERG member can now say to voters that Labour won’t undo Brexit and they can vote for Labour based on other issues the government are failing on… eg. housing and people smuggling.

She’s going to do bugger all in the Labour Party now, it’s just a big event to damage her old party on the way out. As soon as we get an election she’ll be replaced. Although you might not like who by… if you like throwing the flag shagger epitaph at Labour politicians when they try and reassure the voters who considered them anti-British…  no Labour candidate has taken a firmer “reclaim the flag” approach to their campaign build up for the next election.

More than the ERG Brexit stuff, I’m more concerned about the defence of her rapey ex-husband. I’d be interested to know what Jess Phillips – a lifelong campaigner against violence against women – has to say about that?

I can’t help thinking that issuing a press release saying ‘she wanted to defect to us but we told her to **** off’ would have been a far better option.

Of course this may inspire others to leave.  Would she have jumped if the bloke last week hadn’t?  This could be the start of a collapse.

Anything that causes sunak some grief I’m happy about.

That would play into the hands of the ‘Party’ as they could threaten MP’s with removal of the Whip (and then they’d lose their job).

But that’s pretty much what happens now in reality. MPs don’t tend to defect right after they’ve been elected, and then they do, they’re rarely re-elected for their new team. All you’re really talking about is whether they leave office immediately or only at the next election

Except that’s not, in theory, how the system is supposed to work. Iirc, you technically vote for an individual to be your MP, and whoever gets the most MPs to support them becomes PM? Though I’m happy to be proven wrong.

Yes, but that individual is aligned with a political party on the ballot paper.

“these are our principles and, well, if you don’t like them, we have others”