RIP 26"

I asked cy about 29ers (like the solaris) he pointed me towards the soul or my current BFe.
It worries me that people think 26er tech will become deprecated as TBh I love MTB and it is a big part of my life. I dread not being able to enjoy it as much as I currently do, just because of the whim of a marketing dickhead.

Smaller UK Bike Brands will continue to make 26″ frames if there’s demand which I’m sure there will be judging by our historical stubbornness in not confirming 😀

Wheels can be built as long as rims and spokes are available, and almost all other parts will continue to be cross compatible. The only problem might be forks if Fox, Rockshox, BOS, Marzzochi etc drop 26″ but again I think that’s unlikely if there’s a demand for them; they may just become more expensive if produced and sold in smaller numbers.

dood you have nothing to be worried about at all, seriously, chill out

I’m only 5’7″ and ride a Medium El Mariachi – there are two sizes smaller than that, and that’s with 29er wheels. I don’t think you’ve anything to fear if 650B suddenly becomes world-conquering.

excessive worrying, is it a small person thing?

On my ride last night with a group of riders mainly riding 26er’s, I ride 29er’s by the way, the thought came to me as I was negotiating a very tricky rocky steep climb that I was actually struggling turning my gate front wheel onto my chosen path. I missed it so had to ride over the rocks instead so! if I had that slightly smaller front wheel, 27.5″, would it have made negotiating easier? A 26″ front wheel would have been better at that precise moment in guess!
I might buy a 650b front wheel and give it a go for those technical rides and then lift the stem 35mm!
What do you think?

I’ve only just got used to big wheels (26″) after coming from BMX I certainly ain’t ever gona go any bigger!!!

It’s not 27.5

650b is closer to 26 than 29
Can’t be arsed to look up the iso numbers again
But 650b is a whole 18mm bigger than 26

The whole point of capitalism and marketing is they’re supposed to mean that companies survive by meeting the needs of their customers…
So it’ll be a pretty poor show if those of us who’re perfectly happy with 26 inch wheels have to buy whole new bikes on the whim of the manufacturers…

It really is a non-issue. The size difference is akin to when I moved from Speed King 2.1 (which measure less and are low profile) to XR4 2.2 and then Rubber Queen 2.2 (both measure just over and are tall profile). 650b forks are perfect for running 26″ wheels with big tyres without them clogging in mud.

All the tooling for 26″ wheels and tyres already exists and you can bet that very little will be scrapped, in preparation for either owning the 26″ niche, supporting 26″‘s continued popularity or being ahead of the pack when 26″ becomes the new big thing! 😉 And frames suit very low production volumes so however small the niche someone will be filling it.

The forest where Eldorado was set has a course about 3km long.single track and all up and down with tight turns.Most people come from the U.K for the downhill stuff.Here we do mostly gravel track cross country and uphill stuff with a bar somewhere on the route.

I am perfectly happy with my 26er, it’s only 2 yrs old and I intend to carry on being happy with it and get my money’s worth out of it for a few years yet.

I remember when skinny 700c Mavic MA40’s were rerolled and rewelded for 26″ MTB’s so we could run a rounder tye profile and lighter wheels (and break our thumbs fitting tyres). Someone will always be able to do that for us with a longer circumference rim if we choose to stick in the past.

I got fed up with tech and standards running away from me and my paperboy wage when I first started this MTB thing. For that reason I have always been a late adopter and watched things from the sidelines usually only going for a ‘new’ standard in it’s 3rd years incarnation or more. From recollection in 1994 I decided my new bike had to have an aheadset and SPD’s. Then in 1996 I got a suspension fork; 1997 V brakes and 8 speed; 2003 I went full-suss and 9 speed; 2005 disc brakes; 2009 HTII.

I am now too set in my ways to worry and have left the race. Sticking with my 9 speed, 25.4 dia, 660mm wide, Beetamax, 26″, 32mm, 6-bolt, IS mount and non-dropper standards for the forseeable future. It is/was all good top end kit and I’ll still enjoy myself. Maybe if I begin to fall off the back then I’ll have to join in a new standard or two but I may just blame it on my age and get try to get fitter.

Tomorrows World did get a few things wrong you know!

So when I run 2.5’s instead of 2.1’s I’m already 650bing? (until they go bald anyway)

2.5s? Pah – I’ve got a 26×3 tyre here which has a larger rolling diameter than any available 650b tyre. In fact it’s pretty close to a narrow 29er. Mind you I did use my words carefully – I didn’t suggest it was actually mounted to a wheel (it’s heavy and slow and I’m not a fan).

It’s not 27.5

650b is closer to 26 than 29

The ISO sizes are 559, 584, 622. It would be far more accurate to describe 650b as 27, but then on the same basis a 29er is only actually a 28.5er (that’s the nominal tyre diameter of each wheel size when fitted with a 2.0″ tyre). OTOH if you’re starting from a 29er, then 650b is 1.5″ smaller than that, so 27.5 would be accurate – it’s just that what we call 26 is actually 26.5 (those are all the nominal tyre diameter of each wheel size when fitted with a 2.25″ tyre, which is after all more like what most people ride nowadays).

excessive worrying, is it a small person thing

Its hard to know which caused what in this case. Does the worrying make you short, or the shortness make you worry?

Whichever came first, tho on further research I find people of all statures can worry. (Sorry about that, was a silly comment).

Seriously I don’t think people who love their 26ers have any cause for alarm, millions have been made and millions of people love them. I also don’t think being below average height, as I am myself, is any bar to riding bigger wheeled bikes.

It really is a non-issue. The size difference is akin to when I moved from Speed King 2.1 (which measure less and are low profile) to XR4 2.2

Excellent – I shall be riding 650b at an event next month then…. 😆

http://www.wightmountain.com/wordpress/?feature=tation-ullamcorper-suscipit-lobortis-nisl-ut-aliquip

“a 650b bike doesn’t feel like you’ve stolen your dads bike when you were 8 like a 29er!!”

time to do something else:

Bez – Member
You ride a bike, right? You’d like more pleasant and less dangerous places to live? You’d like to reduce the burden on the NHS? You’d like to help local economies and small traders? You’d like to be able to take your kids out on a ride from your door to the park or the shops?

Then please sign this and tell everyone you can about it:

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/49196

This report is the best opportunity we’ve had – or will have – for some time to transform cycling in the UK.

Even if you’re sceptical about petitions, why not sign it? Can’t hurt. If it becomes huge it’ll send a signal. And it won’t become huge without your name on it.

Hmm looking at macavitys link it makes you wonder. They say 650b allows you to yse normal forks (except rockshox) . I wonder if this is a bit of work by the bike companies to reduce their compatibility issues. Ie getting on the big wheel bandwagon, but choosing 650b over 29ers as not much needs to change?

fox 26 forks don’t clear 650b tyres anymore they changed the shape of the fork bridge to make it “stiffer” and it now has much less clearace.
coincidence? i think not, just more proof that its all about making existing parts redundant so they can sell you the new parts.

I think 27.5 is too close to 26 to justify a whole new standard of bike. The industry will love it as they have something to do, but the average joe will find its such a small change its barely noticeable.

However I think the best thing to come from this might be an opening of minds, folk conceiving their own bikes rather than buying off the peg. The new wheel size illustrates that there are many valid recipes of bike, and you simply choose the right style for your terrain, your size, your style. Gone are the days of “I can’t ride I a 29er as I ride Surrey hills, and they don’t do singletrack” and all the other BS.

I often use surfing as a comparison:
Fin set up: zero fins to five fins
Fin flex patterns
Fin placement
Concaves
Templates
Rail shape
Step decks
Materials and flex patterns in the board
Tail shape
Length
Width
Thickness
Discipline and style
There are a million variations of surfboard… And they are all good at something. And the surfing community won’t tell you off for having a five fin bonzer egg, won’t tell you it’s no good or can’t go round corners.

Mountain bikers… Free your mind and your wheels will follow.

toys19 – Member

Hmm looking at macavitys link it makes you wonder. They say 650b allows you to yse normal forks (except rockshox) . I wonder if this is a bit of work by the bike companies to reduce their compatibility issues.

This one depends a bit on what you consider as “fits”. You can put a good size 650b wheel/tyre in a lyrik and it’ll be fine if you’re in california but there’s bugger all mud clearance, frinstance. Quite a lot of articles on this are a bit dust-oriented.

looking at the designs of some 650b frames i’ve seen the mud clearance thing is a common problem, most seem to be 26″ frames with the chain/seatstay braces moved about 5mm.

NW, you have pissed on my chips now, I was getting all cheery.
I expect and hope the optimists are right, I’m sure in 10 years time there will still be wicked rad superlight mega tough 26ers. But if there is not I just don’t want to miss out on progess or be excluded from the party.

Interesting comparison with surfing.

There are an abundance of different surfboard designs around now but it’;s only relatively recently that people have been open minded about trying them. 15 years ago you would have been stared at for having a five fin bonzer egg, or anything other than a white 3 fin shortboard like the pros use

What does hold true is that many different designs of surfboards will work for a given person but some will work better for that person than others at particular places and some will just give that person a different feeling and surfing experience if they are often surfing the same place.

Changing things up can be fun and it’s having fun that counts right?

Ride what you like, whatever makes you happy and thats all that matters unless someone is paying you for it. I think 26 stuff will be available way longer than it’s important for anyone old enough to be reading this!

looking at the designs of some 650b frames i’ve seen the mud clearance thing is a common problem, most seem to be 26″ frames with the chain/seatstay braces moved about 5mm.

I was feeling quite keen on getting a rigid singlespeed 29er for next winter until I looked at three 29ers on my last group ride (Swift, Solaris, FF29) and noticed they were running much lower volume tyres than my 26er but still had far less mud clearance.

I’ve already had some interaction between the rear tyre and the front mech cable boss on my Patriot. I don’t think 650b wheels would help that much…

So 650b frames and forks* are going to be great for 26″ wheels – just with UKtastic mud/tyre clearances?

Sold!

*Apart from UK designed 650 frames of course – they’ll probably take 29″ tyres no problem.

b45her – Member
looking at the designs of some 650b frames i’ve seen the mud clearance thing is a common problem, most seem to be 26″ frames with the chain/seatstay braces moved about 5mm.

Roll up, roll up, frame manufacturers, get your press fit BB shells here. Claim they’re stiffer, save money on frame manufacture without those pesky threaded shells, and make room for wider placed chainstays to fit those bigger wheels into your existing 26″ frame designs with minimal effort, just lengthen the rear end a bit. As a bonus the BBs wear out faster and they’re harder for home mechanics to maintain which helps our suppliers and dealers “grow” too.

Evolution, marketing, conspiracy, or cartel? They’ve got themselves pretty well organised it seems along their own interests, they must have learnt a few things from the UCI in how to ignore the best interests of mountain bikers.

Unfortunately the only way 26″ won’t die a slow lingering death is if 650b sales flop really badly for 2-3 years. Let’s start an international boycott now!

For the record, I like my 26ers and 29er, and 700c for that matter, but I don’t want 650b at the cost of 26″.

Roll up, roll up, frame manufacturers, get your press fit BB shells here. Claim they’re stiffer, save money on frame manufacture without those pesky threaded shells, and make room for wider placed chainstays to fit those bigger wheels into your existing 26″ frame designs with minimal effort, just lengthen the rear end a bit. As a bonus the BBs wear out faster and they’re harder for home mechanics to maintain which helps our suppliers and dealers “grow” too.

Sort of, but not really.

BB/PF30 – same 68/73 width as any BSA BB, but a bit rubbish, agreed.
Anyone designing a 650B by adding stay length and moving bridges only on a 26″ frame should be fired ) If you ever see one that backs up that suspicion I’d be amazed.

All I’m saying on this one is that to me, moving to a 650B HT from a 26″ is like going from 100 straight to 120mm tapered forks. No biggie, may be subtly ‘better’, maybe a waste of £ and though I may like to choose, I wouldn’t overly bothered which I rode. Your call.

The best bit of all the 650B stuff is people adding 650B wheels and low-tread 2″ tyres to a 26″ bike that had 26 x 2.4″ before and calling it an upgrade.. more like a step closer to a 60’s touring bike, if that’s what you’re after )

When are Surly going to make ‘650B +’ anyway? That, I want.

Just seen the new Banshee 29er prototype and have to say I’m now interested.. looks awesome!

I live near Malaga where there are roughly 50% riding road bikes and 50% riding mtb’s.Everyone seems to have the latest Fox front forks and many full suspension.Thing is that here people are not all 6ft plus so 95% ride 26ers.In my LBS today he has 21 mtb’s with 26″ wheels and only 3 29ers.As for 650B’s they have never even heard of them.The market for cycles is much bigger here than the U.K so chances are nothing much is likely to change

Very similar situation in France, you hardly see any 29s (apart from some crap ones in Decathlon). I rode a randonee last summer with about 1500 bikes, the only 29s I saw was a group of 6 Belgians and all the locals were taking the piss out of them.

Same in Germany.

I hear people saying that 29er is perfect for the kind of riding Germans do (although I suspect they overlook the proper mountainy bit of the country, and think it’s all fireroad/schneise trails), but in reality, I have never seen a single 29er on the trails ever.

I only actually know of 1 29er, and that is a colleague who test rode a few and decided that it was the best ride for the fast trail stuff.

650b is barely even on the German radar afaict (although the online stores do stock 650b bits, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if that is clever cashing in on the gullible UK market).

None of the top German brands do 650b yet afaict. Several/most are now just putting a 29er in their fast XC/race HT line up.

I though Ghost were German?

Same in Germany.

I hear people saying that 29er is perfect for the kind of riding Germans do (although I suspect they overlook the proper mountainy bit of the country, and think it’s all fireroad/schneise trails), but in reality, I have never seen a single 29er on the trails ever.

I only actually know of 1 29er, and that is a colleague who test rode a few and decided that it was the best ride for the fast trail stuff.

650b is barely even on the German radar afaict (although the online stores do stock 650b bits, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if that is clever cashing in on the gullible UK market).

None of the top German brands do 650b yet afaict. Several/most are now just putting a 29er in their fast XC/race HT line up.

Just to concur – never seen one here at all – and that is on the dusty parkways of Cologne , where fashion and being seen on the trendy is important!
Shops are noticably devoid of them. A bike shop in Berlin only had a handful – and that was because they were a Specialized dealership

The surfboard analogy is bollix though, most boards are custom made and in a size to suit you, spares or accessories are not plagued with compatibility issues, there is no standard size that we have all bought into that will force us to buy new kit when the standard changes. The oppirtunity to choose or spec what you want is abundant.

In fact imagine how brilliant mountain biking would be if I could buy a custom made dh bike that was made to my dimensions, with wheels, tyres and forks to fit at say 24.75inch? It is hardly likely to precipitate due to this new standard, and chipps assertion that 26ers will dissapear..

I don’t think anyone is being closed minded about this charliethebikemonger, the industry is being closed minded by removing a wheel size choice. I’m all for 29ers, 36ers whatever, as long as I can choose 26.

jameso – Member

BB/PF30 – same 68/73 width as any BSA BB, but a bit rubbish, agreed.
Anyone designing a 650B by adding stay length and moving bridges only on a 26″ frame should be fired ) If you ever see one that backs up that suspicion I’d be amazed.

All I’m saying on this one is that to me, moving to a 650B HT from a 26″ is like going from 100 straight to 120mm tapered forks.

Doesn’t just about every convertible frame work on that basis? Well, not moving bridges, but adding chainstay length with dropouts. 26er frames with bodges.

For the second- you’re right, but it’s not when you make the change that it’s important, it’s when you don’t want to make the change but you can’t find any 100mm straight forks any more and your frame won’t take a 120mm tapered one 😉

I tried a 29er and two days later had one on order. I’m not saying it is better than a 26er it’s just that the 29er suited me better. It felt more comfortable and was certainly quicker over a variety of local trails compared to my 26er.

FWIW, I was at Afan and Cwmcarn this weekend and despite the trails being packed only saw 10 or so 29ers and one of those was mine 🙂