RIP 26"

The only thing that will stop 26 inch wheeled bikes getting better is if every manufacturer chooses to stop developing them. We’re not at any sort of natural plateau that requires a change.

minor increments. few tweaks, much of a muchness

remember the bold new graphics to cover up the year on year similarities?

The only thing that will stop 26 inch wheeled bikes getting better is if every manufacturer chooses to stop developing them.

That would be the behavior of a cartel, wouldn’t it?

I have two bikes that are nine years old in design (Patriot FR 2006 and Cannondale Prophet) and I am still getting KOMs up and down and still having fun. Still think that bike design is getting the optimum strength, weight, stiffness to get the best speed, manoeuvrability, and fun.

Since there are a lot of different standards I think the point is that the industry/we are not sure exactly what standard is the best to what application. If we look at skiing there is a vast range of different skis from touring cross country to twin tip freeride skis/snowboards. No reason why it could not be the same for biking.

bigrich – Member

remember the bold new graphics to cover up the year on year similarities?

Not relevant really- only shows that they don’t replace models every year, not that there’s nothing left to change (after all they’ve been doing it since day 1). There’s been no fall in rate of change/improvement that I can see- bikes today are better than they’ve ever been, and most of the best 26er bikes in the world are current/recent designs.

And frankly most 29er and 650bs are no more radical, mostly all we hear about is manufacturers trying to replicate what’s been done before, or reduce the impact of the bigger wheels. The most exciting developments in 650b are when they get something that 26ers have had for years. Big news this week? 650b Nevegals! Hold the phone!

It’s going to be very interesting…
Chipps

I hope so, because mostly, so far, it’s been incredibly dull and all about the bike industry selling more stuff. I can imagine for jaded mountain journos it’s fascinating because they get to write about some sort of seismic shift rather than relatively incremental advances in, say, chainring tooth profile.

It might get ‘interesting’, if, for example, an underground network of die-hard 26ers started blowing up Specialized warehouses or organising buck nekkid protest rides through the streets of London, but that seems unlikely.

Personally I’m looking forward to the new wheel size standard that sits somewhere between 26 and 650B that will combine the strengths of both formats, 26.25 is the future, mark my words…

If we look at skiing there is a vast range of different skis from touring cross country to twin tip freeride skis/snowboards. No reason why it could not be the same for biking.

I don’t think this is a relevant comparison. Sure there are different skis/snowboards, but if you buy into a specific snowboard shape, for example, it does not render your boots and bindings obsolete. I’ve not followed the ski market for a few years but I don’t believe standards have changed to the extent that my ski binding from last year won’t work with a new ski from this year. That’s the crunch when the bike industry starts messing with standards as fundamental as wheel size and is why this debate has created such a stir.

PS I have a 26er and a 29er. They ride VERY differently*

*one is a rigid singlespeed and one is a full susser 🙂

My 20″ bmx is waaaay faster round a pumptrack than my 26″ mtb…
In your face physics!

I think 27.5 will catch on for the following reasons:

– Most bike buyers buy complete bikes and as such, buying a 27.5 rather than 26″ is not an issue
– Most bike buyers don’t have a stack of tyres/wheels/etc to worry about becoming obsolete
– Most people will buy what the LBS or mags recommend/stock
– STW is not the norm for the bike market

Performance or advantages/disadvantages are irrelevant – if the manufacturers are buying into 27.5 in such a large way as it sounds like then that’s what will become the norm, just as 26″ did all those years ago.

For me, of course, I never buy complete bikes so I can’t really see me going to 27.5 until it becomes an issue to buy either 29er or 26″ decent quality parts. Or I guess if I really wanted a particular new frame and it’s only available in 27.5

My 20″ bmx is waaaay faster round a pumptrack than my 26″ mtb…
In your face physics!

proof then that wheel sizes have benefits to specific applications…out ya face physics.. 😉

would yo say that a BMX was the ideal choice for a 40 mile ride through the Yorkshire Dales..yes you could do it it but would it be the best tool for the job at hand if one had other choices of tool at hand

I dont go jogging in my Hiking Boots…

As has been noted previously by a few, ride your bike, have fun; spend your hard earned money on what you want to and try not to get too worked up about what or what might not be available in the years ahead, for they might not happen and tis surely better to live today?

Worth repeating.

I’m not a serial bike buyer or part swapper so i’m not concerned about any of this design evolution/marketing bs at present. My 3 bikes are 26″ and cover every aspect of my riding pretty well. Unless something serious happens to them or me, i’ll be riding them for some time to come. Spares won’t be a problem. Even if manus stop making them, there’ll be loads of good second hand kit for years to come.

When time comes to replace a complete bike, i’ll buy whatever bike suits my needs. If it happens to have different sized wheels, so be it. As long as it’s fun to ride, i’ll not give a shit.

I know some guys are heavily into the physics and angles and all that science and magic, but i just love riding bikes. It makes things much simpler. And i like simple.

would yo say that a BMX was the ideal choice for a 40 mile ride through the Yorkshire Dales..yes you could do it it but would it be the best tool for the job at hand if one had other choices of tool at hand

Best tool for the job would have an engine surely? 😉

Best tool for the job would have an engine surely?

probably :D.. seen some lads doing just that on sunday looked great fun 🙂

but thats where the choice comes in.. 😉

I dunno, a British journalist heads off all wide-eyed and excited to a glorified trade show where a bunch of Yank salesmen (who missed the 29er gold rush) are busy flogging “The Next Big Thing” to one another and he just falls in line…

the thing is it’s not much of a change but it’s just enough to crank up the hype over shiney new stuff again.

X-Fusion have been quietly flogging much of their range of forks labeled as dual 26/650b compatible for a couple of years now, but apparently it needed the great RS and Fox to get a firm grip of the collective cycle industry Lob-on for a marginally bigger wheel before they could all have their happy ending.

what would make sense from a marketing point, of view if you really were “testing the waters” or trying to “ease market transition” is for some enterprising little outfit to try selling a single frame with slightly longer stays/wider clearance and blurb stating it is both 26″ and 27.5″ compatible, there’s a fair few such frames already in existence by accident so we’re not talking about a massive technical challenges here… Perhaps an unexploited gap in the market for someone? On-one?

The truth seems to be (from what I’ve read here and elsewhere) that 650b actually makes close to bugger all difference over 26″ wheels on the trail, nobody it seems, has bothered to try and measure the differences in rolling resistance (apparently the “KPI” that’s causing us consumers to cry out for 650b wheeled bikes) other than claims over percentage weight differences between 26/27.5/29″ I’ve got no real belief that you gain anything significant over the two already established and supported wheel standards…

So it’ll weigh 5% more maybe, and roll what 0.3% better? but 650b is considered progress rather than an attempt at marketed obsolescence? It’ll take a decade or two to kill off 26″ all together of course.

The thing is I’m not hugely resistant to change, I’ve got a dropper post, various disc brakes and suspension components, you could flog me a 29er for XC or general trail riding I reckon. But when all the marketing pushed “Journalism” and hype is claiming “650b is the future, 26″ is dead!” it just serves to make me that bit more resistant. It just feels like a bunch of high-fiving industry dicks have decided to impose yet another new “standard” because they missed a trick with 29″ wheels…

They’re in too much of a rush with this, which leads me to think there’s an element of panic at diminishing market shares (in the middle of a global recession Shocka!) at work here. I really don’t think 650b will be able to repeat Specialized’s 29er trick for any of them…
Specialized picked their moment pretty well, buying into what was a growing niche at the time, taking a bit of a corporate lead and, popularizing it within about 24 months (at least in the states)…

650b feels still like a lazy trick for those companies without the vision to have committed to a 29″ product line early enough, this big push is just an indicator of how few new idea’s they collectively have…

BadlyWiredDog – Member
26.25 is the future, mark my words…

*pumps tyres to 40psi*

My god, he’s right…..

Spech didn’t blaze the trail with 29ers. Turner and others had good 29er bikes (like the sultan) out a good couple of years before spesh did. Spesh just rode their coat tails, mass produced them and marketed them to death.

More YAWN

I have three different types of ski binding. One normal for alpine. An old cross country pair and an even older cross country pair both with different bindings to the current cross country ones.

I think the skiing analogy is really relevant as all standards are not optimal to all uses. The problem is that there just is not that much in it so it is hard to decide what to use for what and bikes are not as specialised as skis. (yet!)

650b feels still like a lazy trick for those companies without the vision to have committed to a 29″ product line early enough

This is where the marketing BS comes in, since this is not how I see it at all. What I see is limited appeal for 29ers in the – for want of a better term – enduro/DH end of the market. Although very few of us “need” a bike this capable – and could be very well served with a short travel 29er XC for our riding – we aspire to be like the riders we see on YouTube.

This is where Santa Cruz are pulling off a good trick with their marketing for the new 27.5″ Bronson. My head tells me I will NEVER ride as fast or as competently as Peaty and his cronies, but my heart wants to. If that’s the bike that I need to ride like that, let me at it. Ironically, it was not that long ago that, for the same reasons, my heart went all-a-flutter for the SC Blur TR: a 26er no less.

Anyway, back to my point, I think that 650b is fuelling the big-wheeled hunger at the more extreme end of the market rather than being the new bandwagon for those that missed the 29er one. I still find the whole thing frustrating but there’s no way I’m spending any more money on a new bike any time soon, so I’m going to watch this from the sidelines.

.with in seconds of getting on his 26″ i was just blimey.. this feels just wrong..

As I would expect, if I get on any of my mates bikes, they feel ‘wrong’ as they are set up how they like them, not how I do. A completely moot point.

TuckerUK
Yup, 26″ will go the way of 8-speed, V-brakes, and square taper.

Still here, available new, and used by millions
This is worth repeating.

I have three different types of ski binding

I have three types of bike: a road bike, a rigid “do-it-all” bike and a full susser. I accept that my full susser wheels will not work with my road bike, just as you need different bindings for skis with different purposes. However your downhill bindings will quite happily transfer onto any new downhill ski, so I don’t think it’s the same comparison with MTB wheel sizes which can render old wheels and/or complete frames obsolete.

[EDIT] – maybe this is the dawn of MTBs spinning off into very specific categories that require very specific wheels. 26 is not dead, but 26 as the default wheel size for all “off road” bikes is.

what would make sense from a marketing point, of view if you really were “testing the waters” or trying to “ease market transition” is for some enterprising little outfit to try selling a single frame with slightly longer stays/wider clearance and blurb stating it is both 26″ and 27.5″ compatible

Banshee? might be someone else, forget now, but at least one mfr makes a frame where you flip round the dropouts or something. Then you get built-in 26in and 650b in one frame, or with 26in, a short or long back end.

does anyone remember when rims used to ‘wear out’ from the brakes?
ive seen a couple split from being too thin because of wear.
fast forward 15 years, all bikes have disc brakes and the rims dont wear out at all.
i wonder how we could get more cyclists to buy new rims every 3 years like they used to. . . . .

Banshee? might be someone else, forget now, but at least one mfr makes a frame where you flip round the dropouts or something. Then you get built-in 26in and 650b in one frame, or with 26in, a short or long back end.

I was thinking of a fixed geometry frame that accommodated both, but you make an even better point, you could easily “Future proof” a current design 26″ with some type of swapouts that simply adjust Chainstay length and BB height by ~19mm in either plain retaining the static geometry and ride height for both wheel sizes…

Inbred 26/650b Brant?

My Star Fangled Nut has just failed – I think Aheadset was just a flash in the pan ….

Seriously… who ****ing cares?

Seriously… who ****ing cares?

Well quite clearly an awful lot of people as demonstrated every time a wheel size thread crops up.

Fox?

I care, cos I have 26″ bikes and I want to keep them and therefore I’ll need tyres, tubes, rims and possibly forks in the future.

molgrips I have loads of the above that I will never use again, so do a million garages in the UK. You’re not going to run out any time soon.

Tubes ? What are they lol

You can use a 29er tube in. 26 wheel If you need to
But of a faf to fit but works ok

I remember hearing about this thing called capitalism. Apparently if there’s a demand for something, and the people who are demanding stuff are prepared to pay for it, then chances are that someone will be prepared to supply it. Lets hope it catches on eh? As it would render conversations like this somewhat redundent 😉

Well the problem with capitalism is that there has to be ENOUGH demand for something to be worthwhile.

If demand falls, it gets harder and more expensive to find stuff. You ought to really understand things you slag off Binners 🙂

it’s ‘redundant’ a bit like your spell checker… 😉

supply and Demand led capitalism you say? How quaint…

There’s already market “demand” for 29ers and 26ers but the levels of demand are pretty static, thus the cycle industry needs to manufacture some extra “demand” or else contract a little…

If we consumers don’t want enough new stuff then they’ll have to tell us what we want apparently…

I’ve generally ignored the wheel size debate, but them again I’m probably the bike industry’s worst nightmare because I ride an old bike. My main bike is a 2005 SX Trail with old 36 Van RC2’s but it dies have modern bits like wide bars, 1×10 and a dropper post. I love it if I’m honest. It does everything that I want it to and is still probably far more capable than I am.

I like the face that the bits off it are more or less interchangeable with by BYe and the other half’s Chameleon. Having more than one bike, it makes life quite easy. Not being able to swap tyres or wheels between then would be irritating.

I also don’t buy complete bikes and tend to swap bits over to my new frame etc so if 26 inch does dies, I’ll just but a second hand frame. The thought of buying a frame, fork and wheels is scary especially given how much these things all cost these days.

Like many on here, the 650b thing does seem to be getting pushed far too hard and quickly so it does feel like the indie is trying to squeeze more money out of us. There are an awful lot of people who run older bikes and with bikes getting better they seem to last a fair time too.

As I mentioned, I care because I think a 29er or even 650b is likely to be too big for me, if I was tall I wouldn’t be concerned.

So have the manufacturers sent out press releases stating their intention to cease production of 26″ bikes?
Or are they relying on their 3rd party marketing drones to fan the flames?

Going back to the article in question this part

Every bike manufacturer currently offering 26in wheeled bikes is actively redesigning their entire range for 27.5in wheels. Companies that mainly do 29in wheels are still looking at 27.5in wheels for their enduro and trail bike models, and even their full World Cup DH bikes. Companies that only do 29in wheels, like Niner, are looking on with interest and puzzlement. The 26in wheel, I’m afraid, is suddenly, inexplicably, going to disappear virtually overnight on production bikes of any quality. This is not conjecture. This is going to happen.

Is key. Working for an evil, money sucking vampire manufacturer, It’s an industry wide shift & no one wants to be caught with their pants down.

No one of any note is investing in new 26″ designs, everything is going 27.5″. Next model year will see a lot of very prominent brands having no 26″ wheeled bikes in their range.

It’s like a mass scale migration, like it or not. The next few years will be the golden ones for 26″, as too many big players have invested too heavily for 27.5″ not to happen.

I dunno, a British journalist heads off all wide-eyed and excited to a glorified trade show where a bunch of Yank salesmen (who missed the 29er gold rush) are busy flogging “The Next Big Thing” to one another and he just falls in line reports what he sees in front of him …

at least, that’s how I read it…..

Waa waa waa, I hate change!