Worst debate ever.

I take all the rear seats out of my car for long journeys without the kids. They weigh a fair bit.

40mpg has happened on a long run

Blimey, that’s better than I can ever manage, in a far less enjoyable car to drive.

Anyway, people who leave roof bars and bike racks on their cars all the time…

Absolute bollocks Cougar.

Carrying 25kg extra takes exactly the same amount of effort whatever the weight of the vehicle carrying it. The fact cars are heavier now makes absolutely no difference; you are carrying surplus weight and burning fuel and creating emissions as a result.

It might be so small as a % to APPEAR insignificant, but it isn’t if multiplied by all those cars in the UK. Saving 1% would have the same effect as removing 320,000 cars worth of emissions.

Once again – your complaint seems to be that it’s a bit of extra work. Yes, it is very mildly inconvenient but we don’t have a choice.

Hmm, an Allegro with maybe one of those 1 litre ford turbo engines, it’d be brilliant and terrible all at once.

Fair points TBH, assuming that there is a 1:1 ratio between gross weight and emissions. Is there?

I take all the rear seats out of my car for long journeys without the kids. They weigh a fair bit.

40mpg has happened on a long run

Blimey, that’s better than I can ever manage, in a far less enjoyable car to drive.

Modern ECU, injectors and some other updates, fairly small frontal area and not especially heavy.
No ABs, Airbags, traction control, stability stuff, Aircon, heated seats, cup holders, self folding mirrors etc etc.

I genuinely thought you’d be using twice as much fuel.

It can be incredibly thirsty, if you use the available power.

There’s no free lunch.

I used to drive a 7.5 ton truck, loaded you can feel the drag and accelerating is more of a grind so you try to keep moving more than you would in a car, leave bigger spaces and drive timed to stops like traffic lights, flowing and continuous sort of thing, less acceleration and braking, if you do this in a car you get more miles to the tank by a surprising amount, it’s not a small saving, actually it’s maybe the biggest we can make, you would notice it in tenners a week.

Fair points TBH, assuming that there is a 1:1 ratio between gross weight and emissions. Is there?

Not an absolute – absolute because of course you can build a car that is low emissions that is heavier than one that isn’t and so on.

But in the real world, where we’re talking about the same car with the same engine efficiency and the same frontal area and the same tyres at the same pressures and so on, clearly you wouldn’t put 300kg of paving slabs in the back and expect it to make no difference.

So why do it with 25 or 40 or whatever of fuel, that you don’t need to. It might not be a linear correlation, it might not be a major difference on a personal level, but it does make a difference.

I take all the rear seats out of my car for long journeys without the kids.

I am more dedicated than that, I remove the passenger seat too.

Or in reality I don’t give a shit about carrying 20kg of fuel as my car has never done less than 60mpg in 3 years so guessing I am in the top 1% of cars on the road as far as economy is concerned.

so guessing I am in the top 1% of cars on the road as far as economy is concerned

You aren’t, because 1% of cars on the road are fully electric.

of course you can build a car that is low emissions that is heavier than one that isn’t and so on.

But in the real world, where we’re talking about the same car

Sure, but that’s what I was asking. In the same car with no other variables, does a percentage increase in gross weight cause the exact same percentage increase in emissions?

What if it was on a conveyor belt? (-:

@theotherjonv
Do you have air conditioning in your car or van, and if so do you use it?
Or do you open the windows?

Do you have air conditioning in your car or van, and if so do you use it?
Or do you open the windows?

i believe that below ~30 windows are more efficient, above air con is more efficient.

I suppose if it had a smaller tank I might, obviously the spending over £100 mental barrier comes into play.

cross the £100 barrier and you have to go inside to pay – think of the extra wear and tear on your shoes

Sure, but that’s what I was asking. In the same car with no other variables, does a percentage increase in gross weight cause the exact same percentage increase in emissions?

Depends on a load of factors. A heavier but more aerodynamic car would be relatively worse in town and better on the motorway than a light but less aero one. Also lots of other factors including gearbox ratios and how the engine is set up.

@theotherjonv
Do you have air conditioning in your car or van, and if so do you use it?
Or do you open the windows?

Yes, and I only use it to demist windows or in extreme conditions.

But i think you’re just another that’s saying because there are other things that can / should be done that’s there no point in doing this easy if mildly inconvenient thing. We need to save fractions of % wherever we can. Do them all…..

But i think you’re just another that’s saying because there are other things that can / should be done that’s there no point in doing this easy if mildly

Actually no, that wasn’t what I was saying, at all. The point I was trying to make is that you accuse people of being selfish because of one decision they make. By using air conditioning or opening a window at speed which uses extra fuel, following your argument that is also a selfish act, small increments etc.

It is. Prioritising comfort over the future of the planet. It’s all choices and I am of course aware of my own failings at times.

That’s why I am careful not to label people, but the act. It is a selfish act. I’m not going to start hating someone because of their choices; I’m just pointing out that there are choices.

The point I was trying to make is that you accuse people of being selfish because of one decision they make.

Everyone’s selfish to an extent, we need to be. So some of our acts are always selfish. Saying that something someone did is selfish is not the same as calling them an overall selfish person.

We need to save fractions of % wherever we can. Do them all…..

But while the large petrochemical firms are still digging the stuff up from the ground, your teeny efforts are being totally wasted. You’re planting saplings in a forest fire. We need to put the fire out first.

I am of course aware of my own failings at times.

As am I, in so many ways.
An example, I had understood that you had accused people of being selfish per se rather than of undertaking a selfish act. There is a difference that I had missed in your original comment.

But while the large petrochemical firms are still digging the stuff up from the ground, your teeny efforts are being totally wasted. You’re planting saplings in a forest fire. We need to put the fire out first.

Exactly, the difference by saving 20kg in your cars is so irrelevant compared to the sheer volume of traffic that is increasing rather than decreasing.

We are already now in a time where dealing with the consequences should be the main activity as hitting goals by 2050 is going to achieve f all.

I cycled into work today to offset a lifetime of filling the car up to the brim, I’ve done the numbers and the two are equivalent.

But while the large petrochemical firms are still digging the stuff up from the ground, your teeny efforts are being totally wasted.

And why are they still digging it up? Because we (all of us) are still buying it.

I cycled into work today to offset a lifetime of filling the car up to the brim, I’ve done the numbers and the two are equivalent.

Imagine what you could achieve if you did both. They’re not mutually exclusive.

I wonder if the sole reason these stupid threads drag on for so long is because people are bored at work? It’s certainly the reason I’m here.

I wonder if the sole reason these stupid threads drag on for so long is because people are bored at work? It’s certainly the reason I’m here.

I’ll see your bored and raise you a tired. I’m tired and bored. The work is boring and I’m too tired to do it, which means it’s not getting done. Which makes me stressed.

I wonder if the sole reason these stupid threads drag on for so long is because people are bored at work?

Nah I am just bored waiting in a queue to put a tenners worth of petrol in. I could top it fully and so not be in the queue but thats environmentally unfriendly.

Bored, cruise control set to 56 to save fuel and I’m out of Haribo. I’ll get some more when I stop for fuel in 700 miles.

Actually I can’t as some chumps have brimmed their cars to go 5 miles to the supermarket, then sit on the drive.