Osbourne says no to currency union.

Because, and we’ve gone over this many times, the currency union wasn’t made up by Alex Salmond when he was sitting on the lav, it was what an independent group of experts including a couple of a novel prize winners agreed was the best option, after a lot of of analysis.

No country has complete control of the levers of its economy, but at the moment we have none – with independence we can choose things like this, including choosing who we have unions, political or economic, with.

rUK also has a choice, no major party in rUK is going to go to the polls in 2015 offering up currency Union and the associated loss of rUK sovereignty and the liabilities with the unbalanced financial sector in a post independence Scotland

The stats all seem to be correct, but they’re talked about as if they would have a tangible effect, as if Scotland leaving would physically make men live a bit longer

maybe rUK men will live longer without all of this referendum grief

Quick note to say I wish all those involved in the Commonwealth Games directly or indirectly best of luck for what I am sure will be a wonderful occasion for Glasgow and for Scotland.

maybe rUK men will live longer without all of this referendum grief

Is it not because there life is easier without carrying Scotland?

Salmond carries on straight up the middle with bags of smoke, reiterating that they will demand a currency union or walk away from the debt and that the BOE and Sterling are assets.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-22/salmond-digs-in-over-pound-as-scottish-campaign-pauses-for-games.html

Do you know what, f**kit, I’m switching allegiance, I want them to win now, just to see it all fall apart

In other news – heres the latest attempt to convince us

Not for the first time, the DO is incorrect on both counts. Good job neither are important! We all (not just Scotland) deserve better.

Jambalaya +1 lets hope they are good games. I found them puzzling when I was a wee lad – watching my hero at the time David Jenkins (that dates me) running for the oppo!!! I still cheered him on!

a wonderful occasion for Glasgow and for Scotland.

…so long as the Scottish athletes live long enough to complete their events.

They are a real asset to their country.

@kona and @JY very good. Has anyone done a study of how many of the Scottish athletes are eligible to vote in the referendum ?

No idea but the GB olympic curling team will be ****

A bit naughty for the FT but quite funny nonetheless

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/dc5ae97e-11c8-11e4-8279-00144feabdc0.html#axzz37vfDJjPk

maybe rUK men will live longer without all of this referendum grief

The truth is that life expectancy south of the border is already higher. Salmond would do well to sort things like this out instead of spending all day, every day, campaigning for independence.

Salmond would do well to sort things like this out ….

Any suggestion how this might be done ?

Problem with low life expectancy in certain areas of Scotland is far too big for one person to fix. If it was that easy then surely one of his four predecessors (none of whom were SNP) would have sorted it before now?

What about pre 1999? or is it just a modern problem?

Cheap attempt at point scoring from you there.

Actually scottish life expectancy is only 2 years less than the UK average.

There are much greater differences in life expectancy between London boroughs.

I would go along with the cheap point scoring remark.

So why hasn’t Boris sorted that then instead of wasting all his time playing with bikes?

I have just looked at figures for a range of different causes of death and Scotland is worse than England and Wales in all of them that I looked at (didn’t check them all though). It is also worse than a lot of European countries. There has been big reductions in deaths for some causes since the 1970s so it is not as if nothing is being done. I just think more could be done and Salmond should be spending his time on this instead of devoting 24/7 to independence.
After all Scottish independence is not just about the SNP, couldn’t the various independence groups have joined forces and created a “better apart” organisation to campaign for independence? This would have freed Salmond up to get on with his day job.

Governments everywhere are struggling with increasing life expectancy and the burden it puts on the health service and pension provisions. I would imagine no politician would ever admit it but a lower life expectancy amongst their population is their friend. Perhaps that is part of AS’s economic masterplan 😉

I just think more could be done and Salmond should be spending his time on this instead of devoting 24/7 to independence.

Well go on then, list all the things which Salmond should be doing and that he hasn’t been doing to increase Scottish life expectancy.

You obviously feel very strongly about this issue as you chose to bring it up, so you must have a few ideas about what isn’t been done that should be done.

Unless of course it was just a cheap shot and you’re utterly clueless concerning what a Scottish government can do to increase life expectancy ?

BTW :

Scots life expectancy ‘highest ever’

Some quotes from your article

However, life expectancy in Scotland is still lower than elsewhere in the UK.

But Registrar General for Scotland Tim Ellis said: “More generally, while life expectancy at birth in Scotland is higher than it has ever been, life expectancy at birth in Scotland is still the lowest within the UK.

“In Scotland, males and females can expect to live shorter lives (by 2.5 years and 2.1 years respectively) than in England, where male and female life expectancy is the highest in the UK.”

Ernie I don’t have the answers but I would expect a politician to and to be making it their number one priority. This is not a cheap dig at Salmond and I am genuinely concerned at the inequality in health between Scotland, N Ireland and England and Wales. To add some balance to this I would also like to know what the UK government has been doing about it.

There is something called the “Glasgow Effect” which occurs, funnily enough, in Glasgow (and West Central Scotland in general).

The gap in life expectancy in Scotland vs England and rest of Europe is down to an unexplained higher mortality rate in Glasgow. In some parts of the city males are not expected to see their 60th birthday. Take Glasgow out of the equation and comparisons with Scotland vs Elsewhere is much more even.

The Glasgow Effect was first noticed in the early 1950s when life expectancy elsewhere started to increase, but stagnated in Glasgow.

A number of academic studies have been done since then, as far as I know the exact cause has yet to be explained. Sure, high levels of deprivation, poverty, drug and alcohol abuse and a violent culture all play a part.

The thing is though when compared to other cities in Europe with a similar socioeconomic profile there is still on average a 15% higher mortality rate in Glasgow. Even compared to Manchester and Liverpool which are about as close in profile to Glasgow as you will get in the UK this jumps up to 30%.

There are many people working on this, not just in Scotland, it is also being researched internationally.

teamhurtmore – Member
A bit naughty for the FT but quite funny nonetheless…

Nice gentle dig at our independence movement. Reminds me of the days of Punch magazine full of North Briton jokes…

Talking of days – 55 days to go 🙂

couldn’t the various independence groups have joined forces and created a “better apart” organisation to campaign for independence?

you do know the yes campaign is not just the SNP dont you?*

I would expect a politician to and to be making it their number one priority

you really expect a politician to make life expectancy the number one issue?

can you highlight an example where a politician has both got the answer to this and made it their number one priority?

I am not saying it[ life expectancy] is not important but it seems a strange reason to attack AS tbh.

*The campaign is an alliance of the governing Scottish National Party, the Scottish Green Party, and the Scottish Socialist Party.[16]
The organisation has collaborated with Labour for Independence, an independent organisation which seeks to provide a voice for pro-independence supporters of the Scottish Labour Party. In 2013, Yes Scotland covered the £245 accommodation bill for LFI’s first conference.[17]
Other groups supporting a Yes vote include Women for Independence and Business for Scotland.

Ernie I don’t have the answers

So despite not having the answers you expect Alex Salmond to have them.

Well shouldn’t you be making finding the answers your number one priority ? 🙂

The case against the nationalists is substantial, it doesn’t require cheap shots aimed at Alex Salmond because he hasn’t changed Scottish culture into a more healthy one.

And if the case against the nationalists was indeed so weak that cheap shots is the best that can be expected then that would suggest that a reevaluation might be needed – there is no point supporting something if you feel it lacks credibility.

Ernie, you should tell thm that he doesnt need cheap shots 😛

Tell me yourself – nothing cheap, all pertinent and unanswered!

But plenty of shots needed when you have one of the greatest economic and political frauds pulled since the mis-selling of the € zone happening right in front of our eyes. Fortunately, the majority of Scots are too canny to be take in this time.

It’s interesting, after talking to lots of people both Yes and No, ive come to a general conclusion: people vote No for selfish reasons, and vote Yes for altruistic ones.

There are exceptions of course, but it seems a pretty common rule of thumb. When you ask a No voter why they’re voting the way they are, it’s because of worries about their pensions or how their business will be affected. When you ask a Yes voter, it’s because they want a society that treats it’s poorest citizens better, or one that doesn’t wage wars or has nuclear weapons, or a society that’s more welcoming to immigrants.

It’s interesting, after talking to lots of people both Yes and No, ive come to a general conclusion: people vote No for selfish reasons, and vote Yes for altruistic ones.

Yes you’re right, that is interesting. And you intend voting Yes so that makes you one of the good guys, which also interesting.

Thank you for sharing your obviously totally objective opinions.

My pleasure 😉

There are exceptions, as I said – usually they turn out to be people who have some hope that, somehow, the a Labour Party will a. turn socialist again, and b. grow some balls.

There are exceptions, as I said

You mean there’s some Yes supporters who are selfish ?

This is turning out to be more interesting than I first imagined.

nothing cheap, all pertinent and unanswered!

Aye calling him the DO and referring to the the 3 B over and over again is not cheap and it is academic levels of insight 😕

Are you going to call me a troll again and then say that is not cheap or playing the man? 😀

You mean there’s some Yes supporters who are selfish ?

Probably. I can’t think of anyone I’ve met who’s voting Yes for selfish reasons. One person who’s voting Yes because he thinks an independent Scotland would clamp down on immigration, that maybe counts as a selfish reason. He’s also likely to be disappointed, but I’m not going to enlighten him 😉

I can’t think of anyone I’ve met who’s voting Yes for selfish reasons.

Maybe there aren’t any selfish Yes supporters, have you thought of that ?

gets brew offers biscuits

Cmon Ben think about what you are saying here

When you ask a Yes voter, it’s because they want a society that treats it’s poorest citizens better, or one that doesn’t wage wars or has nuclear weapons, or a society that’s more welcoming to immigrants.

which is all great but there has still hasn’t been any articulation of how independence would concretely assist in achieving any of that.

you say that your yes voter acquaintances want a society that doesn’t wage wars, but is the Yes campaign proposing to withdraw from NATO, dissolve the military, end subsidies to arms companies, pursue a foreign policy of neutrality? no…it’s saying that there shouldn’t be any nuclear weapons in Scotland apart from the ones possessed by foreign militaries that Scotland isn’t told about!

in other words – the same old airy fairy bollocks.

Cmon Ben think about what you are saying here

I’m just offering observations on the reasons people give for voting the way they do.

in other words – the same old airy fairy bollocks.

Yup, though that could apply equally to both sides – the clumsy lovebombing attempts are equally airy fairy.

the same old airy fairy bollocks

For a while now I’ve been struggling to think of the most appropriate description of the separatist argument, I think you might have hit the nail on the head there.

I’m just offering observations on the reasons people give for voting the way they do.

I think every person who votes tory is a self serving **** and I am not biased on this issue 😉

Nope, I’d say you’re spot on there 😀

You say “also”. Is that as well as all the other Yes voters hoping for stuff?