More clever advertising that I don't understand…

DS using brand names is one way (the easiest) of describing different products, you are barking up the wrong tree.

DS using brand names is one way (the easiest) of describing different products, you are barking up the wrong tree.

True.

But which part of the business is responsible for the brand?

Mainly correct IME.
The only way IMO to be immune to marketing is to have very high self-awareness, and total honesty about your motivations, weaknesses, need for status, belonging and the identity you wish to project about yourself.

Very difficult to achieve of course… possibly only Ghandi and the Dalai Lama come close!

OT but seriously? The Dalai Lama? The man who claims to be the priest king of a nation? Who focuses his whole strategy projecting and an ascetic attitude whilst trying to regain his place as head of a feudal nation divided by social and religious classes? Or do you mean a different Dalai Lama

More importantly, which Gandhi does brooess mean ? ……. there’s been so many Gandhis.

I do hope brooess comes back and makes clear which Gandhi and Dalai Lama he means. I’m really quite confused.

Speaking of Ghandi,

Mahatma Gandhi walked barefoot everywhere, to the point that the skin on his feet became quite thick and hard.

He was also a very spiritual person. Even when he was not on a hunger strike, he did not eat much and as a result became quite thin and frail. Unfortunately, due to this diet he also wound up with very bad breath. Therefore, he came to be known as a super calloused fragile mystic hexed with halitosis.

Therefore, he came to be known as a super calloused fragile mystic hexed with halitosis.

That sounds like something quite atrocious 😐

ok, for clarity then!
Ghandi – the Mahatma one in glasses and a robe and not much else
Dalai Lama – the Tibetan one who’s still alive and bothering the Chinese. Also wears a robe.

The point being, the levels of self-awareness of your own motivations and psychology required to be immune to marketing, are, IMO, heroic to the point of needing to be a saint…

Either way, after 16 years of being a marketing practitioner, I totally agree that a fair chunk of marketing is exaggeration, false, lazy, cheap manipulation etc and I despise it and those who create it for the sake of their own careers. Like RLJers, it gives the whole community a bad name.

But I will defend good marketing which is honest, helps people make choices about what to buy and keeps honest companies in business by helping them sell stuff. Not to mention charity marketing and tourism marketing and other less corporate forms… And I don’t like my profession being attacked by people who have no knowledge or experience of marketing and are coming at it from an ignorant/ideological point of view…essentially prejudice…

double post

The point being, the levels of self-awareness of your own motivations and psychology required to be immune to marketing, are, IMO, heroic to the point of needing to be a saint…

Well that is what confuses me, nothing saintly about this Dalai Lama. He may be immune to marketing, but only because he is a world class expert.

So it’s not a great example.

The point behind it remains the same though 🙄

Interesting topic (if you ignore the trollposts),
as someone who doesn’t fully understand the intricacies of branding/marketing/selling my thoughts are something like this:
Brand awareness – I know Shimano are a major cycle parts producer, their stuff is pretty much everywhere so hard to miss.
I also know through trial and error that a Shimano size 44 shoe fits me spot on, so when I buy shoes I buy Shimano because they are a widely available brand which suits my needs
Marketing I presume Shimano carry out global research on potential sales areas and design/produce products at a variety of price bands to fill those markets, so maximising sales
Advertising special offers/product displays via retailers and “aspirational” magazine/web presence (buy this and be like xxxxx or buy this and live like xxxxxx)

I can think I am immune to advertising (but probably aren’t), know I’m affected by marketing (as a member of a potential target group) and enjoy the benefits of branding as it lets me choose a product which I have previous experience of….

…would that pretty much sum it up for most people

Credibility is being lost by the second TJ.

i don’t fall for your marketing bulls*te, he has no credibility to lose.

I know, but I do think I/we need to take the opportunity to dispel the notion of the Dalai Lama as a benign teddy bear.

So anyway……I told the 17th National Congress of the Party “we need to take the opportunity to dispel the notion of the Dalai Lama as a benign teddy bear”. And it seemed to go down rather well.

I know, but I do think I/we need to take the opportunity to dispel the notion of the Dalai Lama as a benign teddy bear.

Consider it dispelled.

(irrelevant, but dispelled 😉 )

Some of the posts here were the funniest seen on STW for a while…. *doffs cap to the comedians*

So anyway……I told the 17th National Congress of the Party “we need to take the opportunity to dispel the notion of the Dalai Lama as a benign teddy bear”. And it seemed to go down rather well.

Is that our hero, Hitch I see there?

Oh dear – I really should not have dipped back into this. Very funny tho that there is two more pages of people I have never met trying to tell me I do things I know I do not

its quite phenomenal how many of you simply miss the point

Junkyard – lots and lots of phrases where I qualify the absolute. even in your quote most people would not take “bugger all” as absolute zero would they? Why yo keep on doing this selective quoting and then inventing things yo claim I will say is rather obsessive

One more go

What you guys seem unable to understand is the separation between what the object is and what its marketed as – sometimes this gulf is small,sometimes large

I’ll pick a couple of posts apart to try to explain once more

nealglover – Member

How do you know what something is before you have bought it?

TJ » read the label?

So….. read the Marketing information on the Packaging then ?

No – the legally required mandatory information – ingredients and weight and so on. the objective info. I ignore everything but this

TJ » Look at it?

And again, the way a product looks and feels is erm……. Marketing

No – wrong – what I am looking at is the object. Ie will it meet my needs

TJ » research beforehand?

Ah, Internet Marketing or Maybe another media, but either way…… Marketing

No – looking for objective information on what it is

Well done, you’ve proved yourself wrong

Well done – yo have proved me right – you do not understand the difference nor do yo understand what I do.

The Flying Ox – Member

“the IOID was an insurance replacement – to replace my commuter. its qualities matched what I wanted for that purpose”

Did the insurance company just send you an IOID, or did you choose it? Were there no other bikes on the planet with the same qualities, and if not, how did you know? If there were, why an IOID over the others?

I was offered an insurance replacement from wheelie with a value up to £1000. I had a list of criteria in my head I wanted. there was a limited list of bikes I could get – the IOID met more of the criteria I wanted thus I chose it.

Arrogant, condescending, supercilious, etc.

Words fail me.

Don’t be so hard on yourself CFH…

😆

Answer the question, Teej. Which washing up liquid?

Junkyard – lots and lots of phrases where I qualify the absolute. even in your quote most people would not take “bugger all” as absolute zero would they?

Sammo: Hey! How much sex have you had with Cameron Diaz?
Junkyard: Bugger all!
Sammo: You lucky dawg!

@ CFH 😀

I don’t know why this subject seems to cause so much agitation; TJ thinks what he thinks, and any amount of text related attempts to make him roll over and completely change his view are doomed to failure.

Give it up chaps!

Its touching how many of you have such faith in this magic marketing and how blind you are to how little influence it has in many folks lives.

All the examples you keep throwing at me are either so hypothetical as to be ridiculous – 3 lots of washing up liquid all identical FFS or show a total lack of understanding about how I make my decisions.

I understand you might make your decisions on the basis of the marketing – I do not because teh marketing is irrelevant to me

I buy on the basis of need the product that most closely meets my objective criteria in its intrinsic properties. I buy most of my possessions secondhand

CaptainFlashheart – Member

Just ignore him, chaps. This pathetic clinging to a point that is entirely untenable is just TJ trolling. It must be. The alternative is just too horrid a thought.

Not just trolling. yes it is horrible to have to come to terms with the possiblility teh emperer is anked isn’t it -thats why you all continue to insist I do something I know i do not.

I am not surprised yo cannot accept this. You need to ponder on the parable of the emperors new clothes. Open your minds. accept other world views exist that you cannot understand.

an no – I will not enter into further futile debate on this.

They’re not identical though. They’re priced differently. Which one?

The Flying Ox – Member

Answer the question, Teej. Which washing up liquid?

Teh question is nonsense

teh only answer is I don’t know – i am not in a position to say as its not a choice I have ever made as its not a position I have ever been in.

Tell you one thing – irarely get boggoff unless I wanted two anyway

See?

It’s an irresistable and occasionally well argued force, but it’s coming up against an essentially immovable object; the Teej.

There are better things to ponder..

Certainly is a pointless argument, even for those who don’t suffer the ignominity of being ignored…

If I can guess exactly what this thread has become without reading anything other than the OP, do I win a prize?

CaptainFlashheart – Member

Arrogant, condescending, supercilious, etc.

Words fail me.

Telling me what I do when I know it is wrong? Really. How arrogant condescending and supercilious is it for people I do not know to tell me what I do and don’t do?

You do realise i am laughing at the obsessiveness of folk arguing with me all day for two when I was not here and not replying? I expect an other couple of pages please after this.?

i am laughing at the obsessiveness of folk arguing

Dear Kettle, you are black.

Yours sincerely,

Pot.

It’s not nonsense. It’s a question you can’t answer because the answer either outs you as someone influenced by marketing or a buffoon with the financial decision making skills of a 4 year old.

And to clarify, I don’t think you’re a buffoon.

ignominity
You don’t get much of that to the pound here in Lancashire….

Bet TJ is a brilliant laugh to go for a pint with

For junkyard

I know you guys will never accept that there are people like me to who brands, marketing and advertising are almost completely irrelevant.

where marketing is virtually irrelevant

perfectly possible to reduce its pernicious influence to a minimum

To be 100% immune is of course very difficult.

You’re from Lancashire? Explains a lot 😛

I’m not even sure that word exists. If it doesn’t, it should.

Ah, the Edinburgh defence arrives….

It’s not nonsense. It’s a question you can’t answer because the answer either outs you as someone influenced by marketing or a buffoon with the financial decision making skills of a 4 year old.

my daughter puts forward a more compelling argument for washing up brand a rather than brand b against tj’s. she goes by colour.

this is NOT a decision she makes based on marketing. they are the colours they are by accident, not by design.