Many teachers 'working 60-hour week'

If it’s got so bad then why don’t you all get together and just stop doing the shite pointless stuff.

They can’t sack everyone.

Without getting into any philosophical/political debate on the mindset of public employees versus private employees, my late Mum who was a committed primary school teacher probably did work a 60 hour week, with being in school by twenty to nine to do whatever it was she did, and leaving at about half past four or five in the afternoon, and doing some marking each evening, and then some work during part of the weekend, it would have been around 60 hours a week.

Whatever some people think of the ‘mindset of public sector employees’ she taught at a private school as it happens, and I think this point of view may as slanted as anything which humans think – rather than being some kind of objective truth, the issue of people needing adequate pay for working these kinds of hours still remains. If people keep leaving the profession the future prospects of the country may suffer.

km79: I think people stick in the job even when it’s crap due to their commitment to being a teacher, that the better ones couldn’t do anything else with their lives, so they carry on anyway. The partner of a friend couldn’t do anything else, and my Mum was the same. You might say (the better) teachers need to teach – from it being their calling.

You’d be quicker listing the jobs that DON’T need doing. I’ll start…

Manicurist

the issue of people needing adequate pay for working these kinds of hours still remains

Give or take a bit the pay isnt the issue.

Problem is that, like doctors and nurses lorry drivers, farmers,

Funny thing is my old man was a lorry driver and the law prevented him from working too many hours.

So, got to school at 8 this morning.
Did some prep first thing, then staff briefing and tutor group.

taught a 4 lesson day, with one free period (where I had to chase up some material orders that had gone astray on the system).

Break time I was on duty, and lunchtime I had some keen students in working on a project (DIY guitar with piezo pickup, if you’re asking).

After school I held a dept meeting where we looked at progress and assessment, and targeted low achieving Yr10 and 11 students for intervention.

Home for 6pm, dinner and put the 3 year old to bed.

Working on and off, with a few tea breaks, until 9.30….general emails (cos when do I get the chance during the day!?), a bit of marking, and planning an staff INSET training session for next Friday.

So I make that about 11 hours today, and that’s pretty typical. Though I am a Head of Faculty, and teach a pretty full timetable too.

Works out about 50-55 hours a week, not including any work I do at the weekend. Though last week was probably more, as I was at school until gone 8pm on two evenings – open evening and Yr11 parents evening.

I love the job (well sometimes!), but hours-wise it bears no comparison to any other job I did in the decade before I did my PGCE.

Finished a four day Gold DoE yesterday at 5pm for the school ( October hols up here) One parent was 45mins late collecting their child. ” Oh well; it’s an hour’s overtime for you.” was the comment. Even changing the lighting in the Bentley couldn’t unboil my piss.

Right i’m at work, start the clock!

I’m not aware of any other profession where someone who has never done the job, thinks they know everything about it!

I’ve been a passenger on a plane, doesn’t mean I know how to **** fly it!

Right i’m at work, start the clock!

Only when you stop surfing the net. Time spent on here when you are “at work” is essentially stealing off your employer unless you are self employed 😉

The breaks thing can certainly be true.

mrs rkk01 went weeks at a time without a coffee or lunch break. Many days she wasn’t even able to take a toilet break. Not acceptable in any job, IMHO

mate – I’ve worked 36 – 48 hr shifts in the past. I still sit down and eat at some point.

None stop? Bollocks!

Not none stop. I’ve certainly worked 36 hours without sleep on occasion, stopping to eat. Then grabbing 3 or 4 hrs sleep before going back.

This is not routine, 1 or 2 times in a 12 month period. Not unusual for my industry.

The reason I call BS on teachers routinely working 60 hrs per week, is that working 60 hrs per week every week is exhausting and almost impossible if you have any kind of other responsibilities, travel, cooking, cleaning, kids etc.

In an offshore environment, a 84 hour working week is normal and you also get meal breaks, so probably more like 77, however, this is normally for a 2 week or max 4 week period and you don’t have anything else to do, no cooking, cleaning, laundry etc. It’s also followed by a matching leave period.

The reason I call BS on teachers routinely working 60 hrs per week, is that working 60 hrs per week every week is exhausting and almost impossible if you have any kind of other responsibilities, travel, cooking, cleaning, kids etc.

VVVVVVVVVV

I’m not aware of any other profession where someone who has never done the job, thinks they know everything about it!

I’ve been a passenger on a plane, doesn’t mean I know how to **** fly it!

Sleeping at work now there’s a novelty.

Sleeping at work now there’s a novelty.

Not really.

Air crew, marine crew, fire fighters, offshore workers. Probably a few more.

Nice.

Just a question for the parents on here. I am currently based in the USA and it surprised me to find out that they expect the kids to do what seems like 3-4 hours of homework each night including interactive stuff on the internet and most of the parents expect to tutor the kids for 1-2 hours.
It might be the aspirations of the guys I work with but just wondered how this compares as I certainly did not have that level of work to do outside of school

mattrgee – Member
I’m not aware of any other profession where someone who has never done the job, thinks they know everything about it!

You’re on a bike forum. Do you ever read any of the other threads? Everyone on here is an expert bike mechanic and shopkeeper (apparently).

I’m not aware of any other profession where someone who has never done the job, thinks they know everything about it!

Possibly because we all have thousands of hours of watching teachers doing their jobs?

I can’t think of any other profession, apart from my own, that I have so much 1st hand experience of.

… that working 60 hrs per week every week is exhausting and almost impossible if you have any kind of other responsibilities, travel, cooking, cleaning, kids etc.

That’s the point. It’s bloody hard with little reward, and getting harder.

In an offshore environment, a 84 hour working week is normal and you also get meal breaks, so probably more like 77, however, this is normally for a 2 week or max 4 week period and you don’t have anything else to do, no cooking, cleaning, laundry etc. It’s also followed by a matching leave period.

A good friend of mine works offshore, welding rigs back together. He has a pretty dangerous job as he’s often dangling over the North Sea with a load of heavy and highly explosive kit. He’s trained – high ropes courses, various welding tickets – but he’s not got a three year degree and a one year PGCE (equivalent of a Masters) plus a year of NQT to do his job. He also does 12 hour days for his shift. That said, he does 12 hour days that are very, very broken up by breaks that are legally enforceable – I don’t believe he’ll do much more than an hour and a half in one hit. If the weather’s foul he doesn’t go out, bearing in mind he’s in the middle of the North Sea.

For every week he’s on the rig he also gets that off – strikes me as a better deal than a teacher’s holiday. He also gets paid a damn sight more.

This isn’t intended as a dig: what I am saying is the two are not particularly comparable.

I can’t think of any other profession, apart from my own, that I have so much 1st hand experience of.

But you don’t have first hand experience of it. You have second hand experience of it; you have first hand experience of being a student.

You’d be quicker listing the jobs that DON’T need doing.

What I meant was that in some jobs, if you refuse to do more work your employer’s bottom line is all that’s affected – and they will (or should) eventually hire more people or reorganise the workload. But that starts with you saying no.

In other jobs, if you say no to extra tasks then third parties are directly affected. People would die, houses would burn down and so on. You simply can’t say no. And in this modern austerity world the employers (often the government) know this and take advantage of it.

I didn’t particularly like my current job (local authority children’s homes, very long hours, increasingly poor pay, bullying management and high staff turnover). My wife suggested I give teaching a go, so I looked into it.

**** that, I said.

Yup. In a sane world, the most critical jobs would be treated the best and valued the most. Instead, we get “It should be a vocation not a job” “You’re just greedy if you put yourself before kids”, “Oh so now I’m supposed to look after my own kids am I?” “you’re putting lives at risk”, “they should be banned from striking”. The more essential the job is, the more dickish we are when dealing with the people that do it.

The reason I call BS on teachers routinely working 60 hrs per week, is that working 60 hrs per week every week is exhausting and almost impossible if you have any kind of other responsibilities, travel, cooking, cleaning, kids etc.

Which is why my wife (who is also a teacher) has recently given up her job to look after our daughter, she is also going to be doing some child minding to bring in a bit of money. If I was a single parent I doubt I’d manage the job as it currently stands.

Most teachers spend the first part of the holidays recovering – literally! Almost every year I reach the summer holidays and as soon as relax I develop a nasty cold or cough 😐

Stop the clock. Going home…do I win anything?

Get on with the marking… 😉

Km79. You’re right if teachers said enough en masse then things would change. Exactly what’s been done in Scotland. To cut a long story short. Assessments used to be marked externally and payments were made, these moved to internal marking no payment. Lots of other encroachments on time. eis members worked to rule. Now things are set to change according to the politicians.

The more essential the job is,

Who defines what an essential job is?

Guardian now have an article up by a teacher emphasising Scotroutes point about learning to say ‘No’

Guardian linky

You’re right if teachers said enough en masse then things would change

What, like striking? Its not helping imo. Scotland has a somewhat different political context.

dragon your point is valid but suggesting that all teachers in england are too wet to say no whilst those in scotland can manage it doesnt wash.
That article is also shit in that it says **** all about what corners to cut. The interesting but was about teachers with 10+ years experience ate as rare as hens teeth may help explain much of the issue. I have that level of experience and can keep things on an even keel by knowing where to cut. Most havent learnt that yet. I also have the advantage that management leave me alone whilstvthe less experienced are checked and pushed to death.

PE Teacher here, Im in around 7.30, leave around 5.30 each day. Friday leave at 3.30. Fixture will mean I get back to school around 6ish, sometimes later. Cricket in the summer might be 8, but im being paid to umpire a cricket game (hopefully in the sunshine).

I feel like I work hard, im exhausted by the time the holidays come around. I don’t do any work in the holidays or weekend. Rarely take work home.

I love my job, I think there are definately harder jobs and I wouldn’t teach a different subject, they are heroes, When I think how long my marking etc… takes for my few classroom lessons there is no way I would be a teacher of anything else. They work really hard.

But I don’t think teachers are heroes, the pay is good, we get lots of time off, I don’t think we are under the crazy pressure and targets of some private sector people. Maybe our pay reflects that?! I am under no intention of retiring early….35 years to go! 😀

Just to state the obvious, it’s not the job of teachers to resist unreasonable demands from institution and management; it’s the job of management to avoid making unreasonable demands.

gobuchul – Member

I can’t think of any other profession, apart from my own, that I have so much 1st hand experience of.

Professional gobshite?

PE Teacher here,

No one gives a shit what you think 😆

Scotland has a somewhat different political context.

and weaker educational attainment despite the SNP’s rhetoric – no surprise there though

Literacy and numeracy standards
Educational equality
PISA scores (FWTW)
Student grants
Transparency of performance

Good old SNP – you’re safe in their slippery hands

How are you comparing thm. If you compared scottish to similar socio economic areas of england and wales how does it look?

Partially and where relevant

Northwind management are people also, they make mistakes or don’t have the whole picture. In the best places I’ve worked management push everyone hard but also listen and take on board issues. A them and us attitude never leads to good performance.