I see the England "fans" are doing us proud again.

Indeed…got carried away. That’ll teach me to link to twitter before checking veracity. My apologies.

deadlydarcy – Member
it clearly shows French police doing the bare minimum.

Presumably they’re doing the bare minimum as it appears to be a video taken in Ukraine

beaten to it 🙂

After years of England terrorising the football world they’re now the victms.
Met a guy who went to France 98, he mentioned that one day he (and his mates) saw a sea of orange coming down the street, “What were we supposed to do?” he asked me.

I had the pleasure of being in a European capital while Man Utd were visiting and witnessed a group of fans shouting down a group of kids who were trying to have a bit of banter.
Victims my arse!

Looks like Ukranian police tbh, Deadly.

Edit: That’ll teach me to not refresh the page before replying. All the same, that guy must have been sore/dead in the morning.

I’m struggling to feel a great deal of emotion or sympathy – as an outsider it just seems to be what (some) footballers supporters seem to do. Lack of education, lack of culture, bunch of retards who knows but for as long as I’ve been alive it’s the sport that seems to attract those ‘types’ irrespective of nationality.

What I can’t fathom however is what goes through the heads of cabinet ministers sat around the table who sanction an application to host a championships. Surely it’s a headache no one sane would volunteer for.

Well reasoned and balanced article from Ian MacIntosh, Guardian/ESPN, about the trouble so far:

http://www.espnfc.com/european-championship/74/blog/post/2891011/euro-2016-fan-clashes-at-england-vs-russia-match-troubling-sign

Seems Polish and N.I fans have just been chilling in Nice, but have come under attack from locals.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/violence-nice-northern-ireland-poland-8171259

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=599_1465686321

It’s lazy to look at other sets of fans and point at that there had been very little trouble elsewhere. England are the scalp that everyone wants as they travel in larger numbers than everyone else and are more boisterous than everyone else. All eyewitness accounts I’ve heard and evidence I’ve seen has indicated that the trouble has occurred as a result of bewildering incompetency from the French police and a committed and savage group of Russian hooligans plus some local Ultras.

It amazes me that a developed country like France can **** up an event like this so badly.

Look at all the bother England fans had during the qualifiers…. oh what’s that, virtually none.

Brits attacking the police, Russians attacking Brits. Brits fleeing Russians.

Didn’t realise that Wales and Northern Ireland fans were involved. Shocking.

What I can’t fathom however is what goes through the heads of cabinet ministers sat around the table who sanction an application to host a championships. Surely it’s a headache no one sane would volunteer for.

I couldn’t agree more. This tournament is the last thing France needs given the ongoing security situation.

Professional sport has grown into a monster, the amount of money on the table is ridiculous and with that comes huge corruption.

That’s not a bad appraisal in your first article, Bongo. As for the tear gas thing, police always use tear gas here once a crowd gets rowdy, it’s a tradition. The police hate using it because they usually get a good dose themselves. In Britain you expect mounted police, in German water canons, in parts of Asian live rounds.

This tournament is the last thing France needs given the ongoing security situation.

Just like the London Olympics, which went very well. You don’t cancel an event because of a “terror” threat unless you want more terror threats. You don’t pay blackmailers.

@Edukator, I’m not sure your average French police officer would agree.
Football tournaments are far more difficult to manage security-wise than the Olympics due to the hooligan element, which seems particularly organised this year, and heightened due to the rise of nationalism in Europe.

Didn’t realise that Wales and Northern Ireland fans were involved. Shocking.

The Welsh fans will end up being attacked just like the English fans were when they play Russia. Then I think the anti-English hostility on this forum might start to change somewhat.

People seem to be blaming the French authorities and the poor security, but what saddens me the most is that people still go to these things with the sole intention of fighting: It is a festival of sport and you shouldn’t need draconian policing.

@Edukator, I’m not sure your average French police officer would agree.
Football tournaments are far more difficult to manage security-wise than the Olympics due to the hooligan element, which seems particularly organised this year, and heightened due to the rise of nationalism in Europe.

Agreed. Olympics supporters are almost without exception compliant and respectful. (Some) Football supporters behaviour makes it so much more difficult for the authorities to do the right thing in terms of anti terror because such a proportion of resources are consumed by anti social behaviour.

I wonder how much of a positive influence it would be to limit the number of people who can enter stadiums without accompanying a child? If most people who came to support were with family members, I’d like to think that the odds of violence inside the stadium would reduce.

Reflecting on how targeted the England fans are, I think it will be for the best if England fail to get out of their group. I imagine a number of people with plans to travel have now cancelled their plans.
Reports now that a woman in a wheelchair was attacked by Russian fans. But then again, she is English, so I daresay was asking for it.

Reports now that a woman in a wheelchair was attacked by Russian fans.

Do these reports have a source?

But then again, she is English, so I daresay was asking for it.

Stop that, or I’ll lob a table at you 😀

Source

And as Pilate said, what I have written, I have written.

My mistake – it was reportedly a man not a woman.

Now this is the sort of confrontations we want to see 😀

There was footage of England and Russia fans just as happy before the clashes, Bongo. Give them another five pints.

Your Express link is mainly hearsay, Badnewz. The guy in a critical condition was beat about the head with an iron bar not kicked according to French sources. I suggest watching videos rather than believe what journos say.

There was footage of England and Russia fans just as happy before the clashes, Bongo. Give them another five pints.

I am still confident those same English and Russian fans would be happily getting pissed together after 10 pints. I’d wager it wasn’t the ultras drinking with the English early on, but normal Russian and English fans having a laugh.

Badnewz, this has nothing to do with **** being English but rather **** being ****. No matter what way you spin this there is NO excuse for engaging in running battles, especially with police. Only a child thinks ‘he started it’ is a valid excuse for equally bad behaviour.

Not going to comment on this, one way or another.

What I will say is that it’s glaringly obvious from people’s comments, exactly who has, and who hasn’t, ever been to a high profile footy match, never mind an international.

French TV (channel 6 showing the England game) asked why there where only 6 British police advisors. Major security failings for the Russins to have flares etc in the stadium. Its not like the Russians don’t have form for this sort of thing. No doubt guilt on both sides.

Mrs Vardy had some pretty critical things to say on Twitter, teargas for no reason etc

@Squirrelking, I suppose the question then is, what should they have done?
I think the English fans throwing bottles at the police were not victims.

But there were lots of England fans amid them who were victims, who were picked on, and that’s what I’ve tried to point out. It seems to me you simply think anyone in an England shirt is a hooligan and deserves what they get.

This is the PC line to take – always blame the English, and frankly, it’s boring as it is inaccurate. Infact, it arguably makes the England fans more of a target, as the attackers know they can blame it on the English.

For the record, I can’t stand football, and you’d have to pay me to attend a tournament. I’m more bothered by the way in which the mainstream media always go immediately for the anti-English angle. How we ended up with such levels of self-hatred is beyond me.

How we ended up with such levels of self-hatred is beyond me.

South Yorkshire police might have had something to do with that one.

@badnewz care to point out where I said it was anything to do with folk being English? From the start I have been discussing the behaviour if those retaliating, not anyone else. And don’t back pedal now, you have defended the aggressors umpteen times now.

As for what I think they should have done, close ranks, keep the provocateurs’ at bay and then let the police do their job instead of fighting them. Hardly rocket science is it?

This is the PC line to take – always blame the English, and frankly, it’s boring as it is inaccurate. Infact, it arguably makes the England fans more of a target, as the attackers know they can blame it on the English.

There’s a long tradition of England going to major tournaments and being involved in trouble. It has its roots in a particular brand of oafish patriotism which is fuelled by a right wing media.

It’s an arrogant, aggressive and xenophobic approach to the world. It’s a hatred and distrust of anything ‘foreign’, an attempt to cling to the last scraps of the British Empire.

It’s a boozed up extension of what’s constantly preached in the media by Farage, Johnson and pals. And yet this is never the issue.

It’s the Russians. It’s the French police. It’s French hooligans. It’s the Muslims.

English hooligans are one of the world’s most oppressed minorities – forever targeted and mistreated. Why can’t they just be left in peace; free to get pissed in town squares and allowed to hurl abuse, hatred, bottles and chairs at non English people?

Can’t the authorities organise a fake football match just for the thugs and let them fight it out?

Some pics doing the rounds of some lovely exchanges* between German and Ukrainians in Lille.

*Possibly debates on the merits or not thereof of joining the EU, although I doubt it. I did wonder about the risk of contagion from the clashes in Marseilles spreading to other cities.

I am just hoping Russia don’t play Ukraine. People will probably die.

Link ?

Deutsche Hools drehen in Lille durch… Polizei: kaum vorhanden. #EURO2016 pic.twitter.com/71rcXAz5Hf

— Rafael Buschmann (@Rafanelli) June 12, 2016

This is fun! 😯

We don’t need a Brexit to plunge Europe into all out war, we just needed the beautiful game to help it on its way!

@squirrelking, how exactly do you “close ranks” when the police are firing tear gas at you, and Russians are picking you off?

You’ve simply cast those who “retaliated” as villains, I’ve noticed you haven’t said anything about Russian culpability either.

The Russians also attacked Welsh fans in Moscow a few years ago in their hotels.

England has historically had problems with hooliganism, but the main hooligans arent there, and it was basically a bunch of drunk england fans retaliating after being attacked. The vulgar songs are vulgar, the drinking is excessive, and people like your good self I daresay get a self-esteem boost from telling your friends how ghastly they anyone in an England shirt is.

My main point remains: the English fans were for the most part victims, and the media refuses to accept this as it goes against the politically correct narrative that white english men are basically the scum of the earth.

My main point remains: the English fans were for the most part victims, and the media refuses to accept this as it goes against the politically correct narrative that white english men are basically the scum of the earth.

A lot of reports in the media have stated that the English have been targeted. Which outlets are saying it’s all the English causing the trouble?

The various analyses of news reports amongst the world’s big media outlets show a fairly even split of blame-apportionment between Russian and English supporters. Even some Russian agencies were reporting that some of their fans had been a bit naughty. If I had some kind of obsession which requires me to blame everything on the PC brigade, I probably wouldn’t bother checking what’s being reported though.

No, but it’s clear why it happens – because for those thugs wanting to go and have a fight with somebody foreign it’s just about the best opportunity they get. They don’t care that it’s a festival of sport – just that it provides a ready source of opposition.