How many policemen does it take to……

Clegg also wheeled out the stat today that only 12% of policeman are available to deal with crime at any one time.

So if we needed one policeman available to be policing the STW forum at any one time day or night, how many policemen do we actually need to employ to do that? By Cleggs reckoning we’d currently be employing 8.3 policemen in order to have one available. So what are those other 7.3 doing?, or rather what could they not be doing so that they could be available to police us filthy crinimals?

shift rota, to cover 24hrs a day, sickness, training days and holidays…. mmm feels like about 5 required

You’re going into Political Maths and none has ever added up to be correct.

What about annual leave?

Bistromathics

There =there is booking the crims into custody, writing up the reports, giving evidence in court, training, supervising custody suites, crime prevention, school visits etc etc

Its a classic right wing canard free the cops to get out on the beat – stop them having to spend hours doing paperwork – cut the red tape – its nonsense..Made worse by the cuts in support staff of course.

time in court, training, sick leave, maternity…. its bull isn’t it. Always seems to be poor cleggy that gets given this shit to say

24 / 7 cover needs 5 employees to have one on duty at any one time

shift rota, to cover 24hrs a day, sickness, training days and holidays…. mmm feels like about 5 required

Would be my best guess, poor sick record then medical retirement

Sounds about right – there are 168 hours in a week and an average person does what, 40hrs a week? Then there are sick officers, officers on leave, officers on training courses. Then there will be officers who have an non front line role (training, “management” etc). Then, no matter how hard they work to eliminate it, there will be paperwork to complete as follow up from the front line work they were doing and court cases to appear in.

I’m surprised thinking about it that it’s that big a percentage.

5 employees to have one on duty at any one time

but you need more than 5 if anyones going to get a holiday

Being duty isn’t the same as on the beat, coppers giving evidence in court are on duty, so are ones that are in training and excercises.

The crucial thing is not what other officers are doing, but how the Tories define dealing with crime. Presumably young clergy means being on the streets, but even a lib den can work out dealing with crime is more than than that.

Hang on… Is that 12% for all coppers, all the time? Ie including off-shift time, holidays, sick days? Because if it is, it’s really quite impressively high.

This should give you some bedtime reading!

http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/2011/02/21/more-paperwork-less-staff/
http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/2011/02/02/our-mission-total-bureaucracy/
http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/2010/07/30/waste-management-made-easy/
http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/2010/03/23/unnecessary-police-bureaucracy-part-1/
http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/2008/01/30/stop-and-account-replaced-by-more-new-forms/
http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/2006/06/18/missing-the-target/

Hang on… Is that 12% for all coppers, all the time? Ie including off-shift time, holidays, sick days? Because if it is, it’s really quite impressively high.

it includes all that – and being asleep too

maccruiskeen – Member

it includes all that – and being asleep too

Then TBH I guess we should thank Nick Clegg for bringing to our attention how efficient the Police must be- that’s an impressive achievement. I’d have assumed it’d be lower tbh.

I wonder… If you were to take their maths and work out exactly what % of time policemen spend at work (ie include all the stuff that stops them from being “available to deal with crime”, what would we get? I just did some very rough numbers for myself and it’s under 19%.

Blimey, just worked out I only spend 7.2% of my life actually in front of a class teaching. If my classroom needed manning 24hrs a day, 365 days a year there would need to be 13.8 of me! That makes me only 60% as efficient as a Cleggy policeman.

I only spend 7.2% of my life actually in front of a class teaching

Did you ever see the Lee and Herring sketch with two student teachers. Lee’s character explains that he grades his student’s homework according to the social status of the parents because “I work from 9 oclock in the morning til 3 oclock in the afternoon, 5 days a week 39 weeks of the year. I’m not going to waste what precious little spare time I have reading something thats been written by somebody half my age!” 🙂

further to mr cleggs words the beeb reveals that 46% of coppers work mon – fri 9-5 and that more are on duty at 9am monday morning than saturday evenings..

Why are you even giving anything that vomits from that turncoat ****’s mouth any head space? Clegg is a complete and utter **** who should be ignored at all times. ****.

Don’t beat around the bush. Tell us what you really feel.

Interesting total shell – the ones in edinburgh have more on duty on a weekend evening than at any other time.

I assume thats all police service not actual active coppers. So including al teh police that are training – both trainers and trainees, those that work in liaison roles and the like those that can work at any time thus its cheaper in office hours – some CID jobs for example. Fraud investigation shall we say?

Now then… If you have a large number of people on a 9-5 shift, does that mean you’ve got a shift ending at 9am or overlapping into the morning? If so that’d explain why there’s so many coppers on duty at that time.

Seems to me the government is doing a big job on us at the moment
Heard Cameron sayin the police got it wrong in the riots, but when cobra met the government gotmit all back on track
Then clegg telling us his bullshit
Didnt see them fighting back the looters last week
I think the police service will be in for a sustained attack in order to discredit us and get the public thinking we are underworked and overpaid !
Ok guys go on , say it, we are underworked do nut eating thugs

easygirl – I suggest it will backfire on the politicians and leve them looking even more stupid

I also heard Clegg say this morning that police forces have been helping each other during the recent troubles, and that the cuts in policing can be implement because there be “a lot more of that in the future”.

Well here in Croydon we have had police officers from Wales on duty. Does he seriously expect that on a regular basis coppers will, at the drop of a hat, leave their homes and families, and travel a couple of hundred miles staying in temporary accommodation, just so that the government’s ideologically motivated cuts, with their patently false economy, can be implemented ?

I am starting to seriously hate Clegg.

I suggest it will backfire on the politicians and leve them looking even more stupid

I’m not sure where you get from TJ, governments have quite successfully, with help from a compliant press, vilified those they choose to take on. Just look at the attitudes of some on here towards teachers, firefighters, etc.

Surely that works out massively expensive as well? I can’t remember the costs for the G8 policing, when we had officers from all over the UK up in Edinburgh, but it was pretty bloody enormous. Not to mention that local coppers can surely do the job better than imports?

I think the majority of the country are smart enough to see thru the rhetoric. Thing is – the politicians could make decent attacks but they lose all credibility by insisting that cuts will not affect operational ability.

Its the wrong target – the press will not be so compliant over this – they right wing press like the police.

Its the wrong target – the press will not be so compliant over this – they right wing press like the police.

The Tories/right-wing press don’t let things such as “loyalty” get in the way of their self-serving agenda. They are perfectly prepared to be ruthless and stab whoever needs to be in the back, in pursuit of their goals. People who are totally committed to “the market”, however brutal and inhumane it is, aren’t sentimental about stuff like that – they can’t afford to be. Remember that despite everyone else’s best efforts in the end it was Thatcher’s own colleagues, and those who owed her so much, that stab her in the back and put an end to her political career.

I agree that the police is not the natural target which you would expect the Tories to have their sights on, but the reality is that they have. The 20% cut in police budgets and the insistence that the police must accept pay cuts proves that. And a constant drip-drip of little digs, subtle criticism, and negative reporting by the press/Tories, will, as easygirl suggests, help to achieve that.

A totally unlikely Daily Mail headline a couple of years ago, but a very real one a couple of months ago :

Police officers will have to accept pay cuts or jobs will be lost, says Home Secretary as she warns of two-year pay freeze

I suggest it will backfire on the politicians and leve them looking even more stupid

I hope so, I really do.

I am starting to seriously hate Clegg

Welcome to the club. I’m afraid it is not a very exclusive one. Lying, two-faced ****.

This should cheer you up easygirl………early results from the police v politicians

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/12/riot-poll-public-back-police

Of course it’s still early days and politicians have a huge advantage over the police in that they can openly make political speeches and argue their point in a way the police never can, but it’s still very encouraging.

And there is every possibility that if the overall creditability of the government diminishes in the eyes of the general population, which is quite possibly what is happening, then the government’s opinions on all matters, including on issues such as policing, will carry much less weight. Public opinion can sometimes be very fickle…..as Harold Macmillan once said, “Events, my dear boy, events”.

So how many MPs do we need to elect to ensure that there are always 650 in the house of commons? Just asking.

Northwind, what you’ve got to remember is that when you are wanting coppers to crack heads, it’s easier to use cops from other areas (a la Miners Strike) as they don’t have to worry about local repercussions.