EU Referendum – are you in or out?

@rone – this is genuinely too late for a lot of serious debate, they have dodged the question had all the opportunity to deal with this – what other option will they present? Why bother they should have done this while there was time to go back to the EU. Even if they win a vote for their plan somebody needs to go to the EU who will say piss off (most likely). Then that takes us to about the 20th March if we are lucky to set out to push for a 2nd ref.

It then relies on the EU to grant an extension long enough to hold the vote.

They are putting pointless steps in the way of the position they are going to have to end up at.

Ah, you know better then? Do tell.

You told us about the rumour, so it’s up to you to provide evidence to support your claim. Or is that too difficult?

You want evidence that there’s a rumour?

You want evidence that there’s a rumour?

That’s not unreasonable is it? Otherwise you might as well just say “I reckon there’s a rumour”.

People speculate way too much on here and come to a sarcastic conclusion before an official announcement with detail has been made – within minutes of announcements.

Plenty of time. Let’s not speculate.

FFS

Or, the announcement could have come with detail. There has been time to flesh this out in the last THREE YEARS.

Tick. Tock.

You want evidence that there’s a rumour?

As I said, you were making the claim, not me.

Anyway, from ITV:

Labour’s Emily Thornberry tells @itvnews there should be a second referendum. It should be Remain versus Theresa May’s deal on the ballot paper. She would vote for Remain. She would campaign for Remain. Jeremy Corbyn would campaign for Remain.

Told around 70 Labour MPs would vote to stop a second Referendum
IMHO Corbyn hoping here that he gets the plaudits but never has to actually go through with it

— Steve Hawkes (@steve_hawkes) February 25, 2019

You want evidence that there’s a rumour?

That’s not unreasonable is it?

Isn’t that the whole point of rumours – that they haven’t got evidence..?

Mind you, it is amusing watching the usual suspects tie themselves in knots, scrabbling around to find a reason to dislike exactly what they’ve been asking for.

Isn’t that the whole point of rumours – that they haven’t got evidence..?

There could be evidence of the rumour without there being evidence of the subject of the rumour. I just wanted to check which was being sought. But, you know, SQUIRRELS….

Watching the repeat of 4 news it looks like the plan is to try and get red unicorns through, for this to be adopted instead of May’s deal, which won’t happen, but ‘at least we tried to deliver brexit’, then push the amendment for a vote which will be binding on May’s deal or remain.
I think there might be a glimmer of hope worth looking to.
Fingers crossed.

Btw Thornbury did say ‘it’s perfectly clear’ (;

Mind you, it is amusing watching the usual suspects tie themselves in knots, scrabbling around to find a reason to dislike exactly what they’ve been asking for.

When a Labour backed amendment hits the floor asking for a second referendum people will probably believe it, currently that is quite a way down the line

Btw Thornbury did say ‘it’s perfectly clear’ (;

Damn. Anyway, I thought she was… for the first time for months… it increased my levels of hope significantly (yes, I know).

When a Labour backed amendment hits the floor asking for a second referendum people will probably believe it, currently that is quite a way down the line

They’re doing exactly what they said they would do. If that stops being the case then of course they should be criticized, but the one-eyed opprobrium on here is truly pathetic.

They’re doing exactly what they said they would do.

What push for a GE and if that fails hold a second referendum? They had a shot at that a few weeks back, this is try for a deal that cannot pass and then maybe a 2nd referendum if there is time. It’s not what they said they would do.

What push for a GE and if that fails hold a second referendum?

No, deliver a Brexit deal as per the terms they set out in their manifesto.

Plenty of time. Let’s not speculate.

FFS

Or, the announcement could have come with detail. There has been time to flesh this out in the last THREE YEARS.

Tick. Tock.

So what purpose does forum speculation achieve?

Other than everyone tying themselves in knots?

BREAKING: Corbyn to back second referendum, on grounds that he passionately believes in not losing any more MPs.

— Have I Got News For You (@haveigotnews) February 25, 2019

It could however be part of a deal with the EU for a short extension with a vote of the Deal or remain being put to the people and implemented as soon as the votes are counted.

Holyshitballs something he said i agree with

However grandad may just be a slithering as maybot as he has been and weaseled his way round Brussels recently with his own vision of red brexit

(I’m guilty of my own criticism here but) I very much fear that a 2ref will give the Tories ammo in a general election to sink Labour as the party that went against the people. (Toby Jones and co are already at it.)

And then we will have a Tory Government for a long time.

That’s a proper FFS.

Labour as the party that went against the people

If the result of the second ref was remain, they could hardly be going against the will of the people. Doesn’t make sense, but then, it doesn’t have to these days.

No, deliver a Brexit deal as per the terms they set out in their manifesto.

I thought we had done the evolving nature of politics here, that was at the last election since then there was a commitment from their conference to move on from that position and if they were unable to secure their brexit (hint they have not) they would push for a 2nd ref. That is the bit they should have been at last wee or the week before.

I thought we had done the evolving nature of politics here,

Certainly a matter for debate, but it seems to me that if Corbyn fed the 5000, folk here would be complaining that there was no gluten free option.

So what purpose does forum speculation achieve?

Sorry, I must be in the wrong place.

ransos

Subscriber

I thought we had done the evolving nature of politics here,

Certainly a matter for debate, but it seems to me that if Corbyn fed the 5000, folk here would be complaining that there was no gluten free option.

I’d certainly think it was a bit inconsiderate tbh. No vegetarian either, he preferred ham as.

Certainly a matter for debate, but it seems to me that if Corbyn fed the 5000, folk here would be complaining that there was no gluten free option.

Not really though is it, unless you just want to argue irrelevant points here. We could go back to their 97 manifesto if you want. The position of the party is from the last conference.

Chapeau, Northwind. Chapeau! Lol.

We could go back to their 97 manifesto if you want. The position of the party is from the last conference.

So the manifesto all of its current MPs were elected on is irrelevant. Aye right.

So the manifesto all of its current MPs were elected on is irrelevant. Aye right.

Well they all voted to update their position. That is a FACT, does that mean the position was updated or was it a non binding vote?

Well they all voted to update their position. That is a FACT, does that mean the position was updated or was it a non binding vote?

Is their most recent manifesto irrelevant, yes or no?

Oh, and give the shouty capitals a miss.

They lost. Their last manifesto for government is dead. In opposition they can oppose government policy if they wish, however they wish, and begin work on their next manifesto… both based on how the world is now, and in the coming years, not in 2107… and how they do both will inform whether people vote for them at the next election.

Pathetic gestures really.
This is just UK political shape shifting.

Labour are just as impotent as the Conservatives in this respect.

A second ref will be damaging and pointless.

Brexit needs to be stopped on facts, not UK political one-upmanship. It’s catastrophically damaging, what more reason is needed?

They lost.

This is most of what needs saying. They lost to a really really shit government with an even shitter campaign. Parties do not lose MPs under competent leadership.

U-turn incoming

The crucial caveats: 1. To avoid total Brexiteer meltdown, PM still wants to keep the option of No Deal alive for later in the year after any delay kicks in.

— Tom Newton Dunn (@tnewtondunn) February 25, 2019

Corbyn has realised too late that his support for Brexit has sunk him.

This gesture is simply too little too late

Westminster voting intention (ft. TIG):

CON: 36% (-2)
LAB: 23% (-3)
TIG: 18% (+4)
LDEM: 6% (-1)

via @YouGov
Fieldwork before today's announcement.
Chgs. w/ 19 Febhttps://t.co/folJ0Br2iQ

— Britain Elects (@britainelects) February 25, 2019

They lost. Their last manifesto for government is dead

That’s not how our electoral system works.

Is it not? Well, that’s me told. No new policies from any opposition parties ’till… when?

Is it not? Well, that’s me told. No new policies from any opposition parties ’till… when?

You appear to be refuting an argument I haven’t made.

Best way to respond to that is to repeat the whole of my post you selectively replied to. But what would be the point?

More government payroll MPs flexing muscles it seems. Don’t rule them out when looking at parliamentary vote arithmetic.