DVO diamonds are now here

Well I’m looking at it compared to pikes.

150 pikes: 542mm A2C
150 DVO’s: 545mm
150 Fox 36s: 539mm

So it is the highest of the lot, but not by a huge amount. If I was on the 36’s, I’d think about running them at 160 though.

Well they’re on the bike now

Interface between the mudguard and the forks is really nice

Only had 30 mins on the local loop on them so far, but they’re outstanding. That top out thunk you don’t notice at all actually riding it out. Mid and up progression is superb and supportive without being harsh. Small bumps (downhill over roots) is plush as hell with only slight mod off the recommended settings. This is something I’m seeing as a huge improvement over the pikes as a fat (115kg) bugger as I could never get that mix of supple and supportive.

The only thing that could be considered negative is I’m noticing I’m using more travel (actively rather than sat in) when I’m out the saddle and sprinting and/or climbing.

I’m getting the feeling they’re a bit like the CCDB in that if you know what you want, they’ll be ace, but if you’re unsure then you could royally screw them and make them feel terrible

More low speed compression will sort that, presuming they have low speed adjustment.

This is something I’m seeing as a huge improvement over the pikes as a fat (115kg) bugger as I could never get that mix of supple and supportive.

Anyone who weighs well out of the average should get a custom tune, the fact that the DVO gives you enough low speed support tells me it’s got a really wide adjustment range – which is IMO a poorer substitute.

EDIT: It seems you’re saying it dives as well though, so perhaps the fact that it has a tuneable negative spring helps for people on the heavy and light side of the spectrum. It could also feel more supple simply because the compression tune isn’t as heavy as a Pikes.

No offence meant but green and that green?

I like it.

Then again I love in your face colours. Which is half the reason why I’m tempted to void my Reigns lifetime warranty at some point and nitromors it.

He just needs to get rid of the blue grips, hubs and saddle and then match them to the fork.

Mrs just saw that bike and first thing she said, “Must be a Norwich City Fan”…

hora
No offence meant but green and that green?

Think he also needs to spend less money on poncy forks and more on his lawn……..

Who said it’s my lawn?

Anyway, no, I’m not saying it dives I’m saying it’s more active when peddling. I think I’ll get rid of that with a mix of maybe 10psi more, more OTT and ramp up the LSC as well as I don’t have time to add a few more CC’s of oil in there (which I think is what it needs).

And yes, custom tunes would be nice – but I’m also not hugely out the standard weight range. Having the ability for the stock fork to better support me than the pikes did is a very good thing – but it’s early days, give me a few rides on them and I may end up hating them; never know.

And colour wise – yes, they’re bright. Really bright. But I couldn’t get hold of the black ones and I needed forks by today, so these are what got ordered. At least it means people can see me from a distance when I spanner up a simple turn and end up rolling down the side of a welsh hill and get a good laugh though.

gardron – Member

Anyway, no, I’m not saying it dives I’m saying it’s more active when peddling. I think I’ll get rid of that with a mix of maybe 10psi more, more OTT

That’s the USP of these forks for me – you can stiffen then with more air, but then use the OTT to restore the sensitivity in the early travel. Neat, if it works as claimed.

I don’t have time to add a few more CC’s of oil in there (which I think is what it needs).

Noooooooooo

Do it properly, change the compression shim stack if adding more LSC doesn’t help. Don’t add more oil, even a few mm extra can put them out of whack depending on the cartridge. My Lyriks used to hydrolock if you went even a little over the recommended amount!

And yes, custom tunes would be nice – but I’m also not hugely out the standard weight range.

Most forks are setup for people who weigh 160-180lb – not 253lb. They even designed that DVO so you could easily pop out the shimstack and do it yourself! Get some tuning guides with advice on weight from them and buy some shims and get to it!

As a big fan of coil negative springs I really like the idea of the OTT adjuster. I like what they have done to make it easy to tune and service.

Here’s a semi-free but old book that I recently stumbled upon that’s helping me get my head round the basics of suspension tuning.

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=kuYFuUqzNBMC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q=high%20flow&f=false

🙂

It goes into a bit of detail about tuning for bigger chaps.

I’m a massive nerd….I have to develop a semi-decent understanding of anything I’m doing….might start pestering some suspension tuners to do a little course in fettling with forks.

Cheers Tom – I’m not opposed to doing proper tuning myself, it’s just time before I’m touring with the bike meaning I can’t do it. I’ll have a read through the book though as I’m interested in stuff like this anyway

So a week on them now going round Wales – so they’ve been round LLandegla, Coed Y Brenin, Nant Yr Arin, Afan, BPW and a quick run round Ashton Court/Leigh Woods on the way home, so I think it’s probably enough for a quick review

So first the bad:
When I got them the LSC dial wasn’t aligned to the numbers. Not a big deal, just an allen key to undo it, lift up, move round and tighten back up, but odd on an expensive set of forks.
There is a noticeable top-out thunk. Mine have a DHX bumper at the top of the stroke to reduce this but it’s still there. Actually riding it’s very unusual to notice it but different people will get annoyed by this to different levels.

The weird things:
They are more active in cranking down and going uphill, even with LSC turned up, but when I look at it I’m not going into the travel any more than I did on pikes before. I think it’s because you’re starting at 20% sag rather than 25-30% sag so there is more to move. I’m no slower on them though, that’s for sure.
They’re noisier than I’m used to, which was a little weird at first but I’ve got used to it now.
OTT adjustment needs to be done without (much) air in the forks, so not a quick trailside adjustment without a shock pump.
Axle is odd – it’s got a weird thread on it where the axle is the female part mounting to the male end of the forks; not totally convinced by it – but it’s ridiculously easy to adjust the tension point on the axle – you just back it off a touch, give it a smack and move the adjustment ring round so you can get the lever exactly where you want it.

The good:
I’ve always struggled with forks to get that fix of supportive mid & progressive end stroke with still having small bump compliance because I’m heavy; I either get one or the other. Fox 34’s were the worst for this as they’d either feel like I was riding rigid until I hit something or just blow straight through the travel. Pikes were considerably better, especially with the bottomless tokens added to give a bit more ramp up in the progression but over anything really bumpy (especially hitting it at speed) I always felt knocked about and got a lot of jolting into my arms. I can honestly say that these have dramatically improved that. It’s like the OTT is dealing with the small bump stuff and the air shock is used for mid & upwards, so I’m able to get a really nice mix where the fork just feels lovely.
It’s hardly scientific, but the only one of the welsh loops I’ve done before was BPW but I’ve been shaving some serious time off the rockier sections in there just because I’m not getting as much arm fatigue. I expected a difference in how the fork worked (just because the design is so different) but it’s honestly a stunning piece of kit, at least for me. I’d still have gone black in preference.

Good review on the forks, cheers, suspension is something i really enjoy reading about and learning about (like Tom_W1987)….its a huge subject with constantly evolving tech and materials complicated by the fact it can be a very subjective area…short of putting your forks on a dyno theres no real way for the average rider to tell if their new forks are actually better than the previous items except by ‘feel’ only….and thats where opinons differ, experts contradict casual fettlers, etc etc…

One thing i would say is that in recent years i have been left disappointed by lots of the ‘innovations’ that have appeared on forks and the fact that the forks seem to arrive half finished with the end user having to carry out modifications or buy custom tunes.
There also seems to be a huge amount of hype from all over the place when a new fork comes along, the media have to sell magazines or bump up website clicks so i understand this and the public always want to justify their new purchase so i also understand if from that point of view….but….but….

…once the hype dies down we start to hear that all is not rosy in the land of the Fox-34, the Pike, the whatever etc etc…we start to get reports of CTD not making much difference, forks that either blow through their travel or bump the user around like a rigid, fancy stanchion coatings that rubs off, creaking crown steerer units, leaking seals, top out clunking, the need for bottomless tokens, additonal spending on custom tunes because the rider is unlucky to fall outside the typical 80kg limit that manufacturers cater for etc etc….

Is it really too hard for a fork manufacturer to build a reliable fork that works for 60kg and 90kg riders?…is it unreasonable to expect both small bump compliance with plenty in reserve for bigger hits?…it must surely be possible to factor in both a smooth linear action in the initial and mid stroke that then ramps up in the last third for example?…why as the buying public do we think its acceptable to have to dismantle our £600 forks and bugger about with plastic tokens?!

I know manufacturers are always looking for the next USP so they can steal a march on their rivals and that R&D is an essential part of pushing things forward and sometimes an innovation does comes along that lives up to the hype and stays the distance….

….but for my 26 inch steel HT i genuinely havent found a fork that works as well as the 2012 coil spring item currently on it…it deals with small trail imperfections well and has enough in reserve that i’ve never bottomed it out…even when i was running a medium instead of a firm spring that was apparently too lightweight for my 90kg weight it never once felt out of its depth..i would like that on an air fork without paying a premium for CTD, dual position and RT3 features that are often surplus to requirements, how often do we read on this forum that said rider had a play with the features on the intial ride then just left them all ‘open’ or in the middle setting from then on?!…to be fair i had a solo-air Revelation that came close to performing in this hassle free manner but it was slightly too long and paying to have it’s travel shortened was prohibitively expensive compared to going back to the coil fork and doing the spring swap on that myself!

In the spirit of recommending what you’ve got its the main reason i went for an X-Fusion when shopping for a fork to go on my 27.5 full-suss…its a sealed cartridge damper with rebound adjustment only….you put the air in to set sag and off you go….X-Fusion have something called ‘mid-valve’ which sits inside the fork and ramps up the final bit of travel preventing bottoming out and crucially doesnt require external dials, bottomless tokens etc…i cant be the only one disillusioned with £600 forks that require aftermarket attention to get them working as they should from the box?!

I also like to ride motorbikes and when i had a set of forks apart some years ago the spring was wound with coils spaced far apart at each end becoming closer together in the middle, i understand this is known as progressively wound as opposed to linear and there are variations on this where the coils are tightly wound at one end and more widely spaced at the other other…either way it makes for a lovely suppleness in the initial stroke that ramps up the more the forks compress…fantastic and by far the best front end i had on a motorbike, i know its not exciting for engineers and their remit is to try and better this old fashioned design by by god it works and it works well!…give me that nay day over a complicated air system that either works hard or soft but doesnt seem to give anything in between.

Is it really too hard for a fork manufacturer to build a reliable fork that works for 60kg and 90kg riders?..

This isn’t just a problem with the cycling world. It’s an issue in motocross and motorbiking as well, mass produced stuff…..even the stuff produced by big players like Ohlins, Showa, KYB and WP has to be produced for the average rider. External adjustments are a huge compromise and they don’t achieve the same effect that a proper shim stack tune does – it would be impossible for them to produce forks for every weight of rider.

When you are buying a bike you should factor in the cost of suspension tuning, this is why I can’t be **** spending 2 grand on a carbon frame. I’d rather spend 1300 quid on a frame and get the shock and fork set up for me and spend the rest of the money on a wheelset with the highest strength to weight ratio.

Mountain bikers seem to think that top end bikes should be ready to go from the off, if you’re a half way decent rider then it’s exactly the same as the moto world – you have to spend time getting the suspension sorted.

short of putting your forks on a dyno theres no real way for the average rider to tell if their new forks are actually better than the previous items except by ‘feel’ only….and thats where opinons differ, experts contradict casual fettlers, etc etc…

Suspension is highly subjective anyway, what works for one rider or what looks good on a dyno might not work for another rider. The only way to start doing it really properly to chase seconds/milliseconds is to attach a shit load of telemetry gear to the bike.

I also like to ride motorbikes and when i had a set of forks apart some years ago the spring was wound with coils spaced far apart at each end becoming closer together in the middle, i understand this is known as progressively wound as opposed to linear and there are variations on this where the coils are tightly wound at one end and more widely spaced at the other other…either way it makes for a lovely suppleness in the initial stroke that ramps up the more the forks compress…fantastic and by far the best front end i had on a motorbike,

Progressive springs on motorbikes are freaking awful….

But you’ve answered your own question there – so much of suspension is preference; mix that with 60kg rider or 120kg rider and that’s a huge range of variation. As such adding oil (as you should do for the diamonds, confirmed that with DVO) or adding plastic tokens to change the spring curve is to be expected *if* you want to get the most out your forks – just as you said about changing the spring tension in your coil forks, it’s the same thing.

What makes a fork good for one person isn’t always good for another look at how Aaron Gwin likes his forks setup. Forks often feel quite different’t I think description of this feel is useful. Luckily for me at 70kg without kit I’m about an average weight rider but It must harder on those who are either really light or a bit heavier.

Progressive springs on motorbikes are freaking awful….

Kind of illustrates some of the points I made about suspension being subjective…I thought they were great!

Going back to what Deviant said about progressively wound Moto springs, didn’t Manitou release a coil fork with a lighter spring in top of a stiffer one to produce the same result a few years ago?

Tom KP