Brexit benefits – lets start a list

Perhaps the remain side should have made a stronger case at the time?

or that leave shouldn’t have told a pack of lies? And should be treated accordingly

Still waiting for a Brexiteer to list a tangible benefit. Could be a long wait…………………………………………

potential doing a lot of work there

Hence my last point. The benefits of brexit are almost all dependent on what government we have and what policies they are prepared to implement. Now that we are out of the EU we can do a lot of stuff that we couldn’t do before, but it needs a govt with the will to do it, and that motivation will only materialise if the voters understand that it’s our govt that needs to do these things rather than someone else. At the very least different things are possible now when before they weren’t.

Well i suppose there could be a reversion back to imperial measurements. £ and shillings, groats.

dazhFull Member
The potential future benefits are pretty obvious for anyone with an open mind

Go on then, we’re all ears, it’s all in the thread title. You voted remain, Dazh, you said you would, and even if you got some stick for being a Brexit apologist and Lexiter after the vote you knew what was best for Britain back in 2016.

Beyond becoming even more of a financial rogue state and the social/environmental dumping possibilities I really can’t see any obvious advantages however open my mind.

High wage rises might just have something to do with runaway inflation, I doubt they are record rises given the inflation driven (and driving) rises in the 70s and 80s.

Leaving the EU as a benefit of voting to leave the EU is; in of itself an article of faith to some folks, it just is. It doesn’t need explanation or inspection.

Agree.  If you hate the EU for whatever reason then leaving the EU is enough.  Don’t look into the ill effects of leaving and just carry on regardless in your own little “I left the EU so I am happy about it” world.

But when you take into account inflation we are markedly poorer. The wage growth is fuelled by inflationary pressures, not a good thing at all.

Totally.

The UK is in quite a dangerous spiral when it comes to the value of the £ out there in the real world. Obviously there are inflationary pressures everywhere – availability of basics will go down due to population growth, shocks like Ukraine, raw materials being held by rogue states etc.

But actively choosing to be a PITA to deal with for our neighbours and allies seems doubly stupid given the backdrop.

“The EU has inflation too”.

Er OK, but we are exposed to the same external pressures – probably to a greater extent AND we have opted to add friction to trade with our nearest neighbours.

But this doesn’t really answer the OPs request. Shutting the thread with a last comment of “sorry, couldn’t think of any” with a link to a blank Word document would be the ideal, I think.

One of the big benefits that Moggy et al forgot to share was the current immigration problem and loosing the ability to return migrants to the EU.

Brexit apologist and Lexiter

You’ll be calling me a nazi sympathiser next. Grow up FFS.

what was best for Britain back in 2016.

What was best in 2016 is very different to what is best today. No doubt everyone on here thinks rejoining the EU would automatically solve our problems, but the fact that we still have many of those problems after leaving shows that rejoining would make very little difference, whilst at the same time cutting off the opportunity to change things.

For reference I personally would prefer to still be a part of the EU.

However, atop a hill in rural France in June the speed limit was exceeded by me and a camera in a rock flashed at me. Apparently driver details can no longer be shared. I repent my sins and ask for your forgiveness. This is my one and only * benefit* so far, others may well say I should have been punished.

You’ll be calling me a nazi sympathiser next. Grow up FFS.

I would ask what you’d prefer to be called but no doubt you would say, ‘a realist’ or ‘a very smart person’.

But if Brexit apologist or Lexiter has become an insult, what is the non-triggering term for someone such as yourself who accepts that the vote happened and feels remaining out of the EU is the only viable course for the UK?

Pros: Hmmmmmmmmmmm

Cons: I now know that the majority of my close family are racists.

I can think of two:

1. The Cameron UK government’s EU “reforms” didn’t happen when the UK chose to leave instead. I told remain canvassers at the time that I was sufficiently opposed as an EU citizen to consider voting leave on principle.

2. We can no longer return asylum seekers to the first EU country they entered. The UK now has to face its responsibilities to some degree, though it still hides behind Le Touquet by placing passport control on French soil and forcing refugees into boats.

or that leave shouldn’t have told a pack of lies? And should be treated accordingly

Given that the clever ones are still counting their winnings and laughing at the people they conned, what treatment can be imposed?

Or are we talking about the true believers amongst the politicians? I wouldn’t worry about them – they are already rightly ridiculed at every turn – that ridicule is appreciated by those who are able to see it for what it is. Their dwindling followers? What’s the point? If someone still thinks Brexit is a good idea they are a lost cause.

But it still is not answering the original question. Which cannot be answered in any tangible way by anything other than there aren’t any.

I would ask what you’d prefer to be called but no doubt you would say, ‘a realist’

Well on the subject of EU membership, realist is exactly what I am. What makes more sense, trying to focus on stuff that is possible, or mourning what is already lost and fantasising about stuff that will never happen?

Move on FFS. Stop obsessing about what ‘brexit’ benefits exist/don’t exist and start worrying about what UK benefits are possible.

As a German resident, I got an absolute bargain when I bought a Cotic bike just after the referendum. The GBP had plummeted, Cotic and the German agent didn’t touch their prices (I assume just for those frames that were being made in Taiwan and had already been paid at pre referendum price?)

The combination of brexshit and trump which was all sort of around the same time, was very helpful in purging so-called friends from my friend list. And I mean that IRL, not just on the book of farce / twatter/X etc.  The one I skied with many times, who told me I had to change my political opinions was the first to go. Told him to F off, and to make sure he changes his opinions to that of the next government each time they change, and have never spoken to him ever since.  Good riddance, He’s not the only one permanently removed from my life.  There were several other annoying acquaintances that used to cling on like a turd stuck to your butt-beard, and brexshit/trump was the perfect event to wipe them away for good.

Building a closer relationship with the UK is entirely possible, what’s getting in the way are the “red lines” shared by Sunak and Starmer, mainly no freedom of movement.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/nov/27/keir-starmer-rules-out-return-free-movement-britain-eu

And let’s face it, the end of freedom of movement is what’s behind most of the cons on this thread.

Edit:

start worrying about what UK benefits are possible.

We really are all ears, Dazh. You are among the most prolific contributors to political threads and have so far come up with nothing.

 accepts that the vote happened and feels remaining out of the EU is the only viable course for the UK?

The second part of this sentence doesn’t necessarily follow on from the first. Like @dazh, I accept that we have left the EU, and we’d better make the most of however that looks. If offered a vote on another referendum, I would vote to re-join (I voted remain).  I think leaving the EU has exposed Tory (and Labour ) lies, and will hold them more accountable in the future, and that can only be a good thing.

Move on FFS. Stop obsessing about what ‘brexit’ benefits exist/don’t exist and start worrying about what UK benefits are possible.

these possible benefits, are they in the room with you now? 😉

if you could list them, that’d be great

I imagine we’ll end up with single market membership within the decade, whether we will ever fully rejoin I dont know

because the public are getting very weary of being told the sunlit uplands are just around the corner

??? || The Proportion of Britons who would Vote to Rejoin the European Union has Reached an All Time High:

Rejoin: 48.8% (+1.7)
Stay Out: 32.7% (-1.9)

Excluding Don't Knows:
Rejoin: 59.9% (+2.3)
Stay Out: 40.1% (-2.3)

As of 15/08, Changes with 15/07.https://t.co/kz25YAE6Wc pic.twitter.com/o2eahg3Xt0

— Election Maps UK (@ElectionMapsUK) August 15, 2023

UK (GB), YouGov poll:

EU Membership Referendum

Rejoin: 63% (+2)
Stay out: 37% (-2)

+/- vs. 13-14 July 2023

Fieldwork: 8-9 August 2023
Sample size: 2,101

➤ https://t.co/7gcpMz8djk pic.twitter.com/JABRkqLtiv

— Europe Elects (@EuropeElects) August 14, 2023

I imagine we’ll end up with single market membership within the decade

I think so as well, plus some limited agreements to allow easier travel for at (the very) least tourism.

Well on the subject of EU membership, realist is exactly what I am.

OK. and just so we’re clear, are there any differences between a realist and a Brexit apologist?  Since, as you say, Brexit has happened and it’s time to move on, how is that not accepting and arguing for the UK’s continued Brexit status?

Building a closer relationship with the UK is entirely possible, what’s getting in the way are the “red lines” shared by Sunak and Starmer, mainly no freedom of movement.

Careful, that’s dangerously close to saying that continuing with Brexit is primarily being driven by xenophobia.

If offered a vote on another referendum, I would vote to re-join (I voted remain).

Sorry, I’m struggling to get my head around the fact some people would vote to re-join but they don’t want to be given the opportunity to do so.

If you ask me this whole country has gone to aboslute shit.

The NHS is all but destroyed to the point it feels almost dangerous to rely on it. Social Services also seems to be failing given the number of shocking cases in the news. Forget about even trying to find a dentist! There is almost no policing. Public infrastructure and services all seem to be run down, roads full of potholes, train strikes, parks and public spaces badly have no maintenance. They’ve filled in all the kids sandpits round here due to lack of money. Energy and water companies underinvest whilst making huge profits and nobody seems to do anything about it. (How many billions do we owe to water companies??) Cost of everything has gone through the roof. There also seem to be just open corruption, especially with all that PPE stuff. It’s completely depressing.

It’s surely going to be a long long time if this is ever fixed.

The right wing press will blame Labour when they get in and we’ll be back to Tory again soon enough.

Most of the media seem to just distract everyone with people in boats, or transphobia or whatever other minority is the target this week.

How difficult is it to move to the EU now?? Seriously thinking of moving abroad.

but they don’t want to be given the opportunity to do so.

How have you inferred that’s the case?

If you ask me this whole country has gone to aboslute shit.

This has more to do with the Tories being in power for a decade than leaving the EU.

I’m looking at it from an EU point of view, Brucewee. Freedom of movement was at the heart of negotiations:

https://www.thelocal.fr/20211208/blame-uk-for-end-to-onward-freedom-of-movement-barnier-tells-brits-in-france

The NHS is all but destroyed

It is struggling for sure, but the people working there remain amazing. After a recent dog bite, I took my wife in to our local A&E, she was well looked after and stitched up within 2.5 hours despite us visiting after 11 on a Saturday night.

Whilst I would love to rejoin I dont think its likely for the simple reason we would not be able to rejoin on the same terms as those we had as members when we left. 3 I would imagine would be different are

1. We would loose the rebate we had

2. We would have to join the Euro

3. We would have to join Schengen.

Whilst I would be all for rejoining on those terms it would be interesting to see how polls would look if they were the terms put to the public

If you ask me this whole country has gone to aboslute shit.

You finally recognise the problem. This was happening long before we even thought of leaving the EU. It was happening before the tories entered govt in 2010, and before labout entered govt in 1997. Labour arrested the slide a bit, then Cameron and Osborne turbo-charged it, but it had bugger all to do with being in the EU. At least now people are beginning to realise that.

How have you inferred that’s the case?

Because you can’t, on the one hand, be in favour of accepting the vote happened and moving on while, on the other hand, being in favour of going back and revisiting the question of whether the UK should be in the EU or not.

You can’t move on and go back at the same time.

Whilst I would be all for rejoining on those terms it would be interesting to see how polls would look if they were the terms put to the public

Joining the Euro would be a ridiculously stupid and self-destructive thing to do. I’d be fine with Schengen, free movement is no problem as long as we have sufficient minimum wage and worker protections. I don’t mind paying whatever it costs either, but joining the euro would be economic suicide.

The only brexit benefit seems to be an entirely imaginary “we can now have really great trade deals and all the best laws imaginable now that we have Taken Back Control”.

Without any thought as to how practicable and plausible this scenario is nor how far from the reality of how it’s actually turned out.

Because you can’t, on the one hand, be in favour of accepting the vote happened

The vote has happened, That’s a fact. it does not necessarily follow that I support it, or that I am in favour of it. We are where we are. More people voted out than remain, that’s democracy it’s that simple

on the other hand, being in favour of going back and revisiting the question of whether the UK should be in the EU or not.

It’s clear that more and more folks are realising what they’ve lost, and in my opinion the likelihood is; a slow reversal of the current position back to either another referendum that is laid out with more definition than Call me Dave could devise, or (more likely) a parliamentary vote.

The real benefit of leaving was avoiding EU anti tax avoidance legislation. The problem with that is only a tiny, but influential, proportion of the population benefited from that

There were loads of threads on here pre Brexit where people were singing its praises.

If only we could look at forum history

Every time I see one of those polls about record levels of rejoin sentiment I am still wowed by only one thing. That (depending on how you look at it) somewhere between 2 and 4 of every ten people you might see in the street don’t want to rejoin. Given everything that has gone on, that is incredible and depressing.

Anyhow – tangible benefits of Brexit (without changing the entire national and international backdrop), please…

We would have to join the Euro

No we wouldn’t. In fact we probably can’t. Either way it’s not a requirement on joining

We would have to join Schengen.

See above.

We would loose our rebate, that I agree with you on,

I’ve just finished reading “Johnson At Number 10” and it’s been eye opening to say the least.

Brexit was allowed to be all things to all people because, basically, to those who were proposing it, it was seen as a panacea, with none of them particularly interested in defining how, exactly, it would work, because it wasn’t in their interests to do so.

Some of the absolute true believers such as Rees-Mogg are borderline delusional in their thinking. They see it as an existential battle for England, that will start to benefit us in fifty years. Basically they think that they will be seen as their legacy as great English (mostly) men similar to those who ushered in the American Age of Enlightenment.

Grandiose fantasies of (very) mediocre men.

Because you can’t, on the one hand, be in favour of accepting the vote happened and moving on

I presume you’re in agreement with US republicans who won’t accept that Trump lost the election? Where does this anti-democratic position end? Presumably you have no problem with authoritarian fascism as long as the govt of the day does stuff you agree with?

You can’t move on and go back at the same time.

We have to move on. We’ll probably be going back to a closer relationship in future. Both can be true.

I don’t mind paying whatever it costs either, but joining the euro would be economic suicide.

Calm down there. It’s unlikely to happen, the chance of the French and Germans at any point in the future being happy to share a currency with us after the mess of the last 15 years, even if “we” wanted that to happen, is so slim as to be ignored… but if somehow it did it wouldn’t be “suicide”.

But none of this is in the “Brexit benefits” list.