Armstrong charged with doping.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/armstrong-charged-with-doping-by-usada

Will he admit it this time? Or deny, deny, deny – again?

Lance Statement

i think it is fairly clear

Wowsers.

In it, the agency alleged that some of Armstrong’s blood samples from 2009 and 2010 were “fully consistent with blood manipulation including EPO use and/or blood transfusions.”

I find that hard to believe but I am less convinced that he was so good he was able to beat superb athletes who were cheating earlier in his career.

Anyone bored of Lance and the circus that surrounds him.

will no doubt degenerate into another Lance haters v Lance lovers thread and run for 12 pages.

I do hope they have some good evidence that he cannot squirm out of.

While there is a huge pile of evidence against him so far none of it is rigourous enough to convict.

tis better 10 guilty men go free than one innocent convicted.

Clear as mud, that’s the same line he’s been towing since 1999.

In it, the agency alleged that some of Armstrong’s blood samples from 2009 and 2010 were “fully consistent with blood manipulation including EPO use and/or blood transfusions.”

I find that hard to believe but I am less convinced that he was so good he was able to beat superb athletes, who were cheating, earlier in his career.

Is he up for doping whilst riding for USPS?
That would be pretty serious if he was also cashing a pay cheque from the gov
It’d be guaranteed jail time if convicted

is better 10 guilty men go free than one innocent convicted.

Innocent until proven guilty. As yet, 500 tests or more, he’s innocent.

I just don’t see why they are bothering, what will this achieve? Why haven’t they gone after Carl Lewis, and striped him of his olympic golds? Equally pointless this long after the event.

Carl Lewis.

Not proven CFH –

I hate his lies – he is not the most tested athlete ever

He has failed tests ( but got a retrospective exemption)

there is a mountain of evidence he has doped but nothing to convict upon.

Many now known to have doped never failed tests.

Keep believing, Flasheart.

Why haven’t they gone after Carl Lewis, and striped him of his olympic golds?

Because Armstrong was being funded by the US gov?

Did I say I believed? No. I said innocent until proven guilty. As yet, he’s still in the former category. Not proven. Therfore, until proven either way, innocent.

As mrmo says, why haven’t USADA chosen to go after admitted dopers instead?

I find that hard to believe but I am less convinced that he was so good he was able to beat superb athletes, who were cheating, earlier in his career.

Ullrich, Mayo, Basso, Pantani, Zulle, Rumsas, Garzelli………oh, and Vino

teammates (Landis, Hamilton, Basso, Andreu, Contador)

watch Armstrong in Fleche Wallone in 96, shades of Vandenbrouke, big ring up the Mur.

(failed tests are irrelevant during these times..read Matt Rendalls
biog of Pantani and the ridiculous and systematic drug abuse throughout his career – what did he ever get dione fior , haemocrit values. I am sure LA’s UCI donations would have done him no harm)

read M Ashendens interview after testing LA’s bloods (albeitt he didnt know they were LA’s)
LA Clean ….bolleaux.

The real problem is there is still no definitive test for r-EPO. The testing and assessment regime is circumstantial evidence only.

You have to face it, they were all on something mid-nineties to mid-noughties. Those that weren’t didn’t win anything.

When one of the senior officials of the TdF says openly – if you want a Tour raced at 25kph rather than 15kph, then the athletes must ‘prepare’ – it’s pretty obvious carte blanche (just don’t get caught). BTW I probably haven’t got the quote 100% right, but read ‘Bad Blood’ and you can do your own research.

Lance was/is just better protected and orgainsed than the others that have been caught. Simple.

Technically you may be correct CFH, that’s meaningless to me tho.

if you want a Tour raced at 25kph rather than 15kph, then the athletes must ‘prepare’

Where do I sign up?

Bad Blood’s a good read, and incidentally J Whittle wrote Millars biog which IMO wasnt particularly sympathetic towards Millar.

Interesting peice in that re LA’s and Millars relationship after Millar became vocal post doping.

big ring up the Mur

so Cancellara too, then ?

I can’t believe that anyone can do what these people do without a little help.

has cancellara won Fleche Wallone ???

Dont think so.

Or do you mean Mur de Grammont in Flanders ??

Cancellara – clean as fooking whistle. Been awesome all way through his career with steady development from his start with mapai and fassa to the awesome rider he is now.

Why are they bothering going after a retired Athlete? It just seems like a vendetta now. Whether or not the guy did dope, he no longer competes professionally, so even if they did convict him, it won’t change anything. Seems like a huge PR stunt when they should be worrying about current doping in professional sport.

I think that pretty much every pro sportsperson is taking supplements, things like IV vitamins, water, etc have know been banned, The use of Creatine or Caffine is ok, if your an asthmatic then inhalers are legal, otherwise they are not.

The whole thing about drugs in sport is very very messy, yes there are definite boundaries but in a lot of cases they ride pretty close to the rules.

But the thing that gets me, LA, his career is over, just let it go, use the time and money to go after the current dopers, to educate the next generation. Everyone knows that the 80s,90s, were rife with drugs. So what is the point?

ootflaps – Member

Why are they bothering going after a retired Athlete?

He has just won the half ironman in Hawaii at the weekend! What about the poor chumps that had just had a bowel of weetabix, instead of a bag in intravenously injected blood for breakfast?

LA, his career is over, just let it go, use the time and money to go after the current dopers, to educate the next generation. Everyone knows that the 80s,90s, were rife with drugs. So what is the point?

The point is that the most well known, influential, succesful cyclist of the past 10-15 years may have been doping, just like all the other cyclists that he beat.

Pro cycling is defined by its tradition and history, just like mountain biking, and if that history is false, is founded on doping, is not as clean as is portrayed, then the people who support it have a right to know.

Floyd Landis; flawed, liar, has an interview on-line with Paul Kimmage. It is worth a read.

Landis/Kimmage

i stopped believing in Armstrong after he chased Simeoni down in 2004. Ferrari was not a man to have as an acquaintance let alone a Doctor. So much circumstantial evidence now, and interesting that this new charge relates to more recent stuff as well.

And he dumped Sheryl Crow

The point is that the most well known, influential, succesful cyclist of the past 10-15 years may have been doping, just like all the other cyclists that he beat.

exactly, a doper beat dopers, so? I would much rather they draw a line, move on. Is Contador clean, was it meat or was it drugs? the Schlecks, Cancellara, et al. spend the money on improving tests, talk to the drug manufacturers, develop tests and clean the sport now. Shall we strip Fignon of his titles? Are we to believe that Merckx was clean, what about stripping Anquetil as he has admitted to doping?

He has just won the half ironman in Hawaii at the weekend! What about the poor chumps that had just had a bowel of weetabix, instead of a bag in intravenously injected blood for breakfast?

He was winning Triathlons when he was 17. Whether he doped or not, he still is a phenomenal athlete and always will be.

He may have cheated all along tho.

Kind of tarnishes it.

Certainly a line needs drawing under it all but the truth needs to be out first or at least best efforts to get to the truth

Had he been French and won seven tours, would anyone be after him now?

I’m not sure anyone will ever know with certainty whether he doped or not (other than Lance) and so whatever this particular investigation decides, it won’t end the matter. The pro and anti Lance camps will be just the same. The whole thing just seems a bit pointless…

Certainly a line needs drawing under it all but the truth needs to be out first or at least best efforts to get to the truth

If we could get the truth maybe your right, but too many interests on both sides, just feels like a witch hunt now. Throw him in a lake, if he drowns he was innocent, if he swims obviously guilty so burn him.

Who cares?

He’s used his fame and position to do more for cancer charities than a majority of squeaky clean athletes/celebrities…

He may have cheated all along tho.

Yet nothing conclusive. Since when did someone of the legal profession be happy with ‘may have’?

Who cares?

He’s used his fame and position to do more for cancer charities than a majority of squeaky clean athletes/celebrities…

+lots

Other than “he couldn’t be that good without…..” what is the evidence against him?

I am less convinced that he was so good he was able to beat superb athletes who were cheating earlier in his career

I’ve seen him beaten plenty of times, but those athletes weren’t consistent (which arouses suspicion). Armstrong was consistent and had good team support, therefore won. I’m not especially a fan, just don’t understand the vitriol.

He say’s USADA pursuing him is motivated by spite.

You can’t help feeling that if he wasn’t such a C U Next Tuesday he might have got away with it.