Anti Muslim sentiment accusations

Islamic faith based schools are under investigation and support for them is growing in Muslim communities.
Parents, who wish to remain anonymous, are talking to and accusing the press of victimising Islam, making false accusations and flat out lying in the media.
Irrespective of the investigations report, they say they will continue to send their kids and support these schools.

Should this be surprising to non Muslims?
Is this something you are concerned about and what possible negative outcome could result in withdrawing interference?
Do you believe there is false reporting and possibly a deliberate attempt to bolster anti Muslim sentiment from within the government as suggested?

Hark!

I hear the sound of onrushing liberals.

Difficult area for debate, espicially on here, lets all be careful and adult please. :o)
All education should be secular imo, all religion is divisive.

I’m happy that there are schools for our secular society, where else would they go for education?
If they can affort it then why not.
If they can’t afford it then create a fuss over religious content.

Any faith school is wrong.

To educate anyone about an imaginary bloke who live in the sky is wrong.

It it intellectual lazyness to continue to believe in religion, never mind it being quite wrong to allow the promotion of homophobic ideas and the seperation of the sexes etc.

A child is no more a member of a religion than they are a member of the Postal Workers Union. Therefore “faith” schools shouldn’t exist. Don’t care whose faith it is.

**** all religions.

Can we start a Star Trek or a Star Wars school ?

This is a big problem for any of the left wing who believe in multiculturalism and also want a secular society.

You cannot have both.

I was educated in the 70’s and 80’s and went to Catholic schools. This did cause some issues and I personally think they were a bad idea.

Eh ? you just have a secular multicultural society. They are not mutually exclusive
Most people who are devout who send their kids to a faith school care more about the faith bit that the school bit – certainly more true of Islamic schools than christianity IME – I have never worked in other faith schools]

Neither catholic nor muslim schools allow outside agencies [ NHS or youth workers] to discuss contraception C of E was mixed on this respect.
It easier to shout racism than discuss the issue
That said some objectors are just racist [ probably on both sides of the debate]
I would ban all faith schools there is no place in education for indoctrination IMHO and the state should certainly not be funding this.

Eh ? you just have a secular multicultural society. They are not mutually exclusive

Yes they are.

A well accepted definition of multiculturalism:

“at ease with the rich tapestry of human life and the desire amongst people to express their own identity in the manner they see fit.”

If someone wants to send their children to a Faith school who are you to tell them they can’t?

Faith schools shouldn’t be funded by the state and private schools should be forced to adhere to a common curriculum. If they choose to supplement this with Islam, Catholicism or learning how to beat servants then that’s their own business and that of the kids and parents.

Yup. Faith schools are a bad idea and there is no way the state should be funding indoctrination of children into any religion.

If someone wants to send their children to a Faith school who are you to tell them they can’t?

Parents don’t own their children. They aren’t allowed to beat them, neglect them or mentally abuse them – so we already place restrictions on what parents can do with their children.

[troll]Arguably indoctrinating children into religion is a form of mental abuse.[/troll]

Mr Jefferson, build that wall.

who wish to remain anonymous

There’s always something suspicious about stories based on comments by anonymous people.

If they wish to remain anonymous why are they talking to the press ?

That’s the press which they accuse of victimising them, which makes it even more bizarre.

If someone wants to send their children to a Faith school who are you to tell them they can’t?

two points

1. I am saying we should not pay

2. [ reductio ad absurduum]If i wanted to send my kids to a school that taught about the joys of suicide bombing and that was how they graduated by doing one …who are you to object?

All tolerance has a limit.

If your end goal is an integrated society of different but equal and respectful people then any school that is not is inclusive is part of the problem irrespective of what they ‘preach’. Trouble is, that is not a shared goal both within the islamic community or the wider community

All tolerance has a limit.

So your limit is that children should not be taught about their culture and religion in a state school?

So your limit is that children should not be taught about their culture and religion in a state school?

People should be taught about all cultures and religions in a state school.

People should be taught about all cultures and religions in a state school.

There wouldn’t be much time for anything else if you taught them all.

So your limit is that children should not be taught about their culture and religion in a state school?

Religion should be part of the history class. Anyone that wants their children taught that one religion is true should fund the school themselves.

Education should be secular. Religion, if it has a place, is for the home and church. Glasgow is full of pairs of catholic and proddy schools beside each other. What a waste of money!

Dunno, my Religious and Moral education colleagues manage it on 2 50min periods a week from 12-15.

People should be taught about all cultures and religions in a state school.

No they shouldnt and I would not want my children wasting their time learning about all the hundreds of religious sects in existence.

Faith schools shouldn’t be funded by the state and private schools should be forced to adhere to a common curriculum

@atlas, what do you mean by faith, CoE, Catholic, its a very tricky subject ? What concerns me is the division this creates in societies where certain communities group together and don’t integrate and such segregated schools contribute to this. What about Northern Ireland or Glasgow as referenced above ? Rather anti-choice isn’t to say private schools have to adhere to a common curriculum, that’s just as draconian and dictatorial as the strictest religion. Private schools should have to follow certain academic standards but a focus on specific religious teaching or even sports should be the choice of the school or parents.

People should be taught about all cultures and religions in a state school.

@grum agreed totally, and to an extent they are.

Surfer – like it or not religions have played a major part in world history and culture. Daft to pretend they don’t exist.

Rather anti-choice isn’t to say private schools have to adhere to a common curriculum, that’s just as draconian and dictatorial as the strictest religion.

What a ridiculous statement.

When Lord Parekh explains the rise in racist attitudes in terms of “People have a feeling that we are losing control of our own society”, is this not the inevitable result of his prediction in 1998 that Britain was becoming a “community of communities”?
People living in divided parallel communities and schools are much more likely to generate distrust and hostility to ‘outsiders’, whoever they are. The taxpayer should not be financing this.

If you consider Freedom of Religion to be a fundamental human right, then how are you going to allow for the different traditions and practices of the various religions?

Muslims have different Holy Days and holidays from Christians and Jews.

Catholics have their own Holy Days.

What about the daily prayer times for Muslims?

Or do the children have to leave their cultures at the door when they go to school?

Yes

Daft to pretend they don’t exist.

I didnt say they should be ignored Grum did I? You said children should be taught about “all of them” which given the number is a ridiculous suggestion.

Religions aim to isolate and control people, particularly women, with their different holy days, diets, languages of religion, clothes, attitudes, lifestyles, prejudices, cutting of children. All of that should be left at the door of institutions of learning.

I believe the Abrahamic religions are a blight on mankind. I truly wish we could do away with them. In the meantime we ought to discourage schooling that creates division, religion is for the home and the church and should have no place in British schools.

Religion is without a doubt the Worst, Thing. Ever. I increasingly find it hard to separate the believers from the beliefs.

All of that should be left at the door of institutions of learning.

So which holidays will be taken by the secular schools?

This holidays thing is often bandied about. In the UK we have a legacy of certain christian holidays which most take, why does that need to change?

If you consider Freedom of Religion to be a fundamental human right, then how are you going to allow for the different traditions and practices of the various religions?

Freedom of religion doesn’t include the right to ‘bagsy’ children for a particular faith IMO. Let them decide as adults which religion they’d like to follow, if any.

surfer – ok, didn’t really mean all of them.

What a ridiculous statement

Current private school system has demonstrated quite clearly it’s strength in exceeding the current nation curriculum, whether that be for academically focused schools (criticised for being too good and thus an unfair advantage) for sports focused schools or for those which favour a less-academic approach to learning.

We need faith schools in this country to support the communities which require them. The question is whether they should be state funded (as CoE and Catholic schools have always been) or private, and if private what regulations they should be subject to.

Yes

@Bill, your approach is very dictatorial, you are trying to force your (non-religious) views onto those who believe otherwise. I see that as the same as a religious group who try and force everyone to adhere to their beliefs.

We need faith schools in this country to support the communities which require them. The question is whether they should be state funded (as CoE and Catholic schools have always been) or private, and if private what regulations they should be subject to.

Why do “we” need them?

Freedom of religion doesn’t include the right to ‘bagsy’ children for a particular faith IMO. Let them decide as adults which religion they’d like to follow, if any.

@grum, that’s your view and you are free to raise your kids that way. But every religion I am familiar with has a commitment (made at marriage usually) to raise any children in that faith. Its a totally normal thing to do.

Its a totally normal thing to do.

It really isn’t, It’s abusive.

Freedom of religion doesn’t include the right to ‘bagsy’ children for a particular faith IMO.

Most religions insist that you will teach your children and bring them up as Christians/Muslims/Jews or whatever.

To prevent this would be seen as preventing religious and cultural freedom.

certain christian holidays which most take, why does that need to change?

To allow families to express their religious freedom and to worship together at their important religious holidays.

Why do “we” need them?

Because we are a multi faith country and those faiths require it, CoE, Catholic, Islam, Jew etc