Airwheel legality

350 quid for one?

that’s for a dodgily sourced one or one with an low-power battery…

They reckoned that are probably classified like an electric cycle and can only ride where an electric cycle can.

But they don’t actually know.

Good to know if you’re in Woking because you now know that’s how they’re classifying / enforcing it, but every other police force in the country might have their own idea of what it “probably” is.

Guy in Brighton has one, looks like a shit version of the future.

looks like a shit version of the future.

everyone has their own standards, some people on here think Skoda Roomsters look fine…

Are they road legal?

Sorry, I read that as Roomba, so that joke makes no sense. Ignore me.

Well they didn’t invest, sales are not as healthy as the manufacturers were hoping for.

I have now asked 4 met policemen and they all say that there is no issue and that the Airwheel is usable in the pavement (and road…).

I was asking the 3rd policeman and saw no issue, and then recommended I go to talk to his boss (the 4th) as he had a very extensive knowledge of the law and had once knicked someone in London based on some law from 1760, or thereabouts !

He saw no issue as it was not motorised. He mentioned that several times things like gopeds had been to court and the court had avoided passing judgement as they didn’t want to set a precedent.

He saw no difference between the Airwheel and those micro-scooters that some people commute on.

He wished me good luck with the pavements in London!

Thing that is putting me off most is the thought of fixing punctures on it – the whole case would need to be opened and then I have seen someone complain that the tyres are a bitch to get off.

The big problem on Dragons Den was that he kept running after it trying to catch it, but effectively keeping it upright instead of falling over, when it would have cut off. But in reality I think you would want a leash, like you might use on a snowboard.

He saw no issue as it was not motorised.

Huh?

Huh?

that’s what he said – electric motor – not petrol or the like.

There’s various Chinese knockoffs available.

Airwheel will bleat about them being not as good, but Phuket, they’re a lot cheaper.

that’s what he said – electric motor – not petrol or the like.

Like the Segway then surely?

He saw no issue as it was not motorised. He mentioned that several times things like gopeds had been to court and the court had avoided passing judgement as they didn’t want to set a precedent.

Right, the problem there is that the far from avoiding passing judgement, the court actually clearly ruled the goped to be illegal for use on either the road or pavement, the same with the mantis electric scooter, the fact that it was electrically powered and only did nine miles an hour still saw it ruled a motor vehicle.

He saw no difference between the Airwheel and those micro-scooters that some people commute on.

I can only point you to the words of the court in the goped case

regard must be had in determining these matters to the context of the Act as a whole, in which section 72 is directed towards eliminating nuisances from the footpath (and, included in that, ensuring pedestrian safety on it)

By which standard even you admit that it would be bound to be ruled illegal

You’re welcome to accept the word of four coppers, but I can guarantee you that:

i) when you are standing in front of the magistrates after being nicked by the fifth copper that comes along the road, ‘four other coppers told me it was Ok’ is not going to cut any ice.

ii) if you fancy risking not only a fine for riding on the pavement, but points for no tax & no insurance on your driving licence, then you are welcome, but I sure as hell don’t see the two lads on dragons den offering to pay the lawyers to fight a test case on your behalf .

Like the Segway then surely?

well, that is what he said – and he said that you could use it on the road as well.

well, that is what he said – and he said that you could use it on the road as well.

Well if he doesn’t think it’s motorised then I’d suggest he mightn’t be fully informed about it.

Go-ped
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2000/409.html

City Mantis electric Scooter
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/2008/447.html

Segway
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2011/2032.html

PS, in the Segway case, one of his defences was that the sentence was excessive, because he had been using it in the pavement for 21 months with the knowledge of the police – guess what the judge said to that?

Nissan Leaf on the pavements here I come.

Well if he doesn’t think it’s motorised then I’d suggest he mightn’t be fully informed about it.

yes, my statement that it had an 800W electric motor was probably misinterpreted…

Looking at those 3 cases it seems clearer that those met coppers might be right after all 🙂

For case 1 it was determined that the goped was not a motor vehicle, and that it was not roadworthy, but that the disqualified rider was using it as such.

He also didn’t have the protective headgear on that was required for riding on the road, if it had have been a motor vehicle, and he didn’t stop at a red light, although he wasn’t on a motor vehicle.

He also didn’t have 3rd party insurance, and he also didn’t stop when directed to by a policeman.

So the case was much more complicated than just the motor vehicle determination – but in any case it was concluded that it wasn’t one.

In case 2 he was also disqualified, and they determined that the scooter was a motor vehicle because it looked like it could be used on the road. The speed it, or the goped, could obtain, or the motor type, had no relevance.

In case 3 the Segway was also determined that it was a motor vehicle because it looked like it was suitable for use on the road.

In the Airwheels case I am therefore pretty sure that it would not be classed as a motor vehicle as no reasonable person (i.e. not STW 🙂 ) would conclude that it was suitable for use on the roads (is crossing the road classified as using it on the roads – I would think not).

And it probably wouldn’t also get classed along with bikes as it doesn’t resemble one – which case 2 I think has many references to.

So the biggest issue is 3rd party liability – which is a reasonable and sensible requirement anyway.

Thanks for posting the cases – even if I am wrong they were interesting reading !

I encountered one of these mono wheel things today whilst out with the dog. The walk was in a very large public park which has about 6 miles of paved paths and hard tracks. Being a nice quiet place the park was full with loads of visitors all having a nice time – walking or slowly cycling, dogs running round… Happy times all round.

Then we stopped for a coffee – more of the same people and dogs all relaxed and ambling around and some idiot and his son come flying round the blind corner into the cafe bit on their airwheel x5s. We’re not sure if it was a sound from the monowheel motors that we couldn’t hear or the humans moving at speed whilst appearing to be stationary but quite a few dogs started barking and as the closest dog to the bloke’s direction of travel ours landed up barking then leaping up at him as he leant forward to slow down – there was a sickening moment where he was leaning forward with his hands out and the dog obviously thought he was going to hit her because he was right on top of her so she jumped up and nipped him – no blood drawn thankfully.

Anyway, we were mortified that the dog had nipped him, apologised profusely and then left but I’m not sure what we could have done to avoid the situation. When people are effectively using silent vehicles in spaces where everyone else goes to walk and get away from vehicles it’s surely going to result in conflict and if hate to think what might have happened if someone with a visual impairment was using the park.

You should think about having your dog under control in a public place.

APF

My SS and I are stealthy quiet too. Boo!

So no responsibility on the part of the person using a vehicle that’s actually only permitted for use on private land?

@justfiveminutes – classic bit of victim blaming there. Your dog bit him, he didn’t bite your dog. The fact the airwheel is legal or not or stupid or not is irrelevant to your dog biting someone.

Unnecessary Motorized Vehicular Personalised Transport Systems.

(remember the New York cycle lane crash guy? He gets a Boosted Board…)

Its his regular vlog so skip to 6:00 minutes to start. He’s used various other stuff for messing about, but the Boosted board seems his first choice to get around (not sure how he’s avoided going under a truck as he seems to think he is invincible…) 24mph and it will slow down as well.

They were talking about this on the Wired magazine podcast recently and their conclusion was they’re definitely not legal in the uk on road or on the pavement.

I used to travel alot by roller blades and was told several times by the police that because I was on wheels I must be on the road, and have lights, reflectors etc.

They were talking cobblers 🙂

Several times.

They are definitely not legal as they are carriages and you can’t ride carriages on the pavements – same as cycles, and skateboards, and microscoters, and everything but invalid carriages limited to 4mph.

The two wheeled versions have been catagorised as personal transportation devices so their treatment has been established, but the single wheeled ones haven’t been so could result in a court case to determine the offense, and whether they are a motor vehicle, which I don’t think they would be, nor the swegways.

Riding on footpaths (not beside the road) and parks is a matter for the land owner, just like cycles.

In the above case, even if the airwheel was allowed, I think that would be catagorised as furious riding, so the rider would be in trouble.

I reality I think the single wheeled ones are probably a decent idea as the rider doesn’t take up any more space than a pedestrian, but the two wheeled ones are wider and you would have footpath sharing issues.

As for the boosted board and similar, there’s no effective brakes so I think that is an issue – on an airwheel an accomplished rider should be able to brake easily.

whether they are a motor vehicle, which I don’t think they would be, nor the swegways.
Riding on footpaths (not beside the road) and parks is a matter for the land owner, just like cycles.

I don’t accept that – even if found not to be a “motor vehicle” (under S185 RTA 1988 this means a mechanically propelled vehicle, not being an invalid carriage, which is intended or adapted for use on roads, there are also exclusions under S189 for EPAC and grass cutters) they would still constitute a “mechanically propelled vehicle” and therefore prohibited from use on public footpaths, bridleways and common land etc. under S34 RTA 1988.

People love them out here.

Probably something to do with the excessive amounts of laziness and disposable income. They’re going for ~£400 in the shops and it’s not uncommon to see a family with 3 or 4 kids all on them.

They are however banned in all shopping malls. This is quite a big thing as that’s a major use for them as the malls are more like massive indoor air conditioned entertainment centres than anything. Also, most schools are blanket banning them.

However, they are a lot of fun.

Most people also look very nimble and safe on them, and despite the ban in malls, a lot of the actual big shops use them for staff to get around on.

They work incredibly well in the real world. Can be a bit dodgy on reliability at the moment, but the technology is pretty much there. Unfortunately the do correctly fall in between road and pavement legally. Nimble as they are, a pavement full of them just wouldn’t work.

Although Segway are going a bit mental over patent abuse!

They’ll fall into the same category as Segways and “hoverboards“.

I saw a Segway with 2 people on it going up the path in that there London. The man had put a big disabled badge on the front of it though.

they would still constitute a “mechanically propelled vehicle” and therefore prohibited from use on public footpaths, bridleways and common land etc. under S34 RTA 1988.

so that would also catch any e-bikes that aren’t pedelec or have had their speed restriction removed, as I think many e-bike mtbs have.

so that would also catch any e-bikes that aren’t pedelec or have had their speed restriction removed, as I think many e-bike mtbs have.

Nope, as long as it has pedals that can be used to propel it, an e-bike is fine – assuming it’s within the speed and power limits of course.

There was an electric micro scooter manufacturer once that tried to make theirs legal by fitting tiny 1″ cranks and pedals – the DVLA said nice try.

Ben, I think that was his point, one that didn’t comply with the regs..

A derestricted/overpowered E-bike would be both a “mechanically propelled vehicle” and a “motor vehicle” (as you might use it on a road) – so not only do you get done under S134 for riding it on a bridleway, but also because a bridleway is a public place/highway you also get done for no tax, no insurance, no licence and no helmet – kerching and points!

uh-oh :

I’m a big fan of these.

The bureaucracy is the wrong way round though. Don’t ban them cos they don’t fit the old categories, create a new one and legislate appropriately.

They’re cheap, small, environmentally friendly and alleviate urban congestion by getting a person out of a whatever square metre footprint a car is and into something not much bigger than the person. Doesn’t need a parking space either.
Requires no physical effort either so folk who aren’t fit are more likely to use them than a bicycle.

Did GoSegway at Bracknell at the weekend and it was pretty good fun, although less so because you are on a big platform.

Speedyfeet are doing good prices on these atm (relatively) so I thought sod it, will risk it and ride the local woods for one thing.

They don’t seem bothered about cars driving up onto the pavement and often making it impassable, and one of the laws you would be infringing with this is the same one.

In Mayfair I saw a guy 2 up on a Segway on the pavement. It was ok though as he had made a big blue disabled badge which he had hung on the front.