650B – dead already

650b is not new it has been used for ages and is used on both the Millennium Falcon and some of the early model ATAT walkers it can also be found in Snowflake fractals and Bracken spores.

Genuine LOLs. Nicking this.

🙂

650b is not new it has been used for ages and is used on both the Millennium Falcon and some of the early model ATAT walkers it can also be found in Snowflake fractals and Bracken spores.

matther01 – Member

Perhaps those that need an extra 1.5 inch are compensating for something else?

They’ll still be waiting 😉

DC the reason you are sore is it is so much further to fall from a 29er than from a 26″ bike. I am not in the slightest bit sore. It didnt even hurt when I ripped off the scab on my hip from the road rash that had bonded itself into the mesh on my bib shorts. Not even a little bit. A 650b would probably be somewhere in the middle I guess?

Wise words TimP – maybe we should try riding one!

I was at some jumps today with a short run in.
Dude on a 26″ wheel bike managed fine, Dude on a 650b bike couldn’t get up to speed quick enough and crashed. Proof surely that 650b makes you crash more and should be abandoned on safety grounds.

I dont know anyone who has a new bike who has 26″ wheels.

It’s here. If you want to sell your new bike on without taking a hit over the equivalent dont buy an old standard.

I rode a (tame) DH Track yesterday on my 29er HT, I’m still alive. How awesome does that make me?

Good spot on the falls from height tho, might get a stinky 2-4 for future adventures.

One of the Shipham crew, its most venerable and respected rider, recently bought a 29er. The shockwaves are still reveberating!

650 what?

At least some places are making things much easier to know your limits

Amazing.

“Where are they?”
Surrey.

Nope, 29er country down here.

In fact, most of them seem to be down here, when I was at BPW last October the only 29er was mine.

tomhoward:cheeky, what size rims do you suggest?

what ever one comes on the bike you like the most.

I personally have a 26″ HT and 2 650b FS bikes. Wheel size specifically played no part in the decision making process.

I know very few people who’ve bought a brand new bike in the last year or so, but the ones I do know have mainly been 29er, but also some 650B or Fat-Bike. Lots of the gang have “new-to-them” bike builds though, many of which are 26ers. Very few people I ride with buy complete bikes either.

Darkcyan, you need a little less air in those big tyres you’re running I think, that 2.4 Chunky Monkey will run in the 22-24 psi range no probs. Some carbon bars and softer grips might help too with the rigid set-up.

“These threads remind me of “Who needs a Full Suss anyway?” and “Why do we need disk breaks?”

Really? – full suss was an obvious and massive benefit – same as front suss was over rigid. Disc brakes too – an obvious and massive benefit over cantis and V-brakes which was well overdue and well worth the money. Both were genuine, new innovations too – adapted from motorbike technology. 650B’s an ancient standard, nothing new, no real advance.

Are they any worse though? Granted, those that feel compelled to upgrade all the time have more to think about, but are the people that buy a new bike once in a blue moon and keep it for quite a while really going to lose out if 650b are what’s readily available just now?

So, upside down forks then… 😉

At worst they can’t be significantly worse, for the same reason that at best they’re not significantly better- it’s a very small change. (Nico Vouilloz, the king of bike testing, decided that it’s .55% faster on his test track)

The point isn’t whether 650b is better or worse; it’s whether it’s a big enough difference to justify retooling an entire industry, making existing designs and stock obsolete, making your bike worth less and making it harder to upgrade. And tbf I don’t think anyone believes it is.

Most of the bike shops round here stock a high percentage of mtb’s compared to road bikes.
I guess that must have something to do with having such amazing off road riding round here.

Where is this, then?

RSPCA called; there are only 11 kittens left in the country.

ratherbeintobago – Member
Most of the bike shops round here stock a high percentage of mtb’s compared to road bikes.
I guess that must have something to do with having such amazing off road riding round here.
Where is this, then?

Probably Norfolk

In my last post, I was attempting to be prosaic and succinct…should have added some caveats like

Feel free to experiment with different wheel sizes on a 29er for added danger/ excitement/ wilderness touring potential, at the loss of mechanical efficiency and traction.

Personally, though I wouldn’t go back to 26″, I got fed up with the ‘gorilla on a moped’ analogy.

There’s no reason why someone 5’2″ or less shouldn’t ride a 29er if it fits. I’m aware that there must be a certain size at which the bigger wheels cause toe overlap and/ or geometry issues.
I just assumed as a ballpark figure that 5’2″ was the minimum. My bad.

But to offer only 650b as the perfect, goldilocks wheel size, would be daft, given differences in human height and performance/ thrill-seeking expectations.

I recently rode in a group of 7, and 4 of the 7 were riding 650b wheel bikes. I’d say that’s a little way off dead.

I notices Spec have released a couple of models as well – looks like it’s hear to stay.

the lads at btr dont seem to think so they busted their balls quite literally bringing this to market

[/url]btr pinner 650b sneak peak by mike mcdermid[/url], on Flickr[/img]

I’m not sure wheel size is the limiting factor for most STW riders 😀

Surely a better title would be

What waist size for STW 36-38″ seems to be the standard but I’ve been over taken by some riders on 32″ waists, will a 30-32″ waist improve my riding regardless of wheels size?

Wheel size debate aside, I’d question the OP’s grasp of statistics – just because I know nobody who drives a Ford Fiesta doesn’t stop it from just becoming the most popular UK car ever.

Setting aside Kitten Murder for a minute I’d Say 650b is here to stay, simply due to industry wide adoption, 26″ isn’t gone, and it all still works of course, but the strategy of “shifting standards” will work long term, and people will pretty much all end up using slightly bigger wheels within the next decade or so…

It’s not a trick I think they’ll be able to pull again without huge amount of negative comeback though, fair enough ~30 odd yeas of 26″ and they’ve only just decided 650b is a “better standard”…

But lets be clear, Do it again and it’s wee and bombers for the whole cycle industry (and probably a kittens head in each of their beds)…

Personally I’m wringing all the use I can get from my 26″ wheeled bikes, but I will eventually have to adopt the prevailing standard, I shall not grumble when that time comes, TBF its only a bloody wheel…

The BTR guys did the 650b Pinner because people pretty much demanded it, not because they necessarily thought it was better, the Pinner was originally 26in only, but so many people made noises about being more interested if it was 650b that they sorted a 650b version as well*.

Whether or not it is better, is not the issue, it was originally a 26er and it very much looks like the punters steered them towards offering 650b, whether that’s due to said punters genuinely believing in 650b, or being hooked by the BS and now too scared to buy a 26 is another matter!

*something the bigger manufacturers are not doing, and the source of most of the grumbles, it’s not that people don’t like 650b, it’s that they are grumpy the option of 26 is being removed so quickly and with questionable reasoning behind it.

At the end of the day parts for your 26er will be available, probably for as long as your frame will last anyway, so it’s no biggie.

It’s only the serial upgraders and meddlers that are going to be affected really, and bikes are a bizarre anomaly really, a sport where for the most part, different parts from different manufactures are freely interchangeable. There’s always been the odd company trying to be more integrated (Cannondale, Klein etc.) and you see it happening more and more now shocks and parts become tuned to the specific bike, and some parts integral and proprietary, I think this is where we are headed in the long run, more integration, more proprietary formats, especially at the top end and at some point your wheels might be the only things you can swap between bikes! Axle standards and widths permitting of course 😉

full suss was an obvious and massive benefit

Was it? Early FS bikes were pretty shit, and even now they’re not exactly ubiquitous. Bit like any of the wheel sizes taken discretely.

darkcyan – Member

I noticed Spec have released a couple of models as well – looks like it’s hear to stay.

For 2015 Specialized have dropped 26″ bikes completely above the entry level Hardrock hardtail, with the exception of a couple of their DH bikes which will be available 26″ & 650B, and their fat bike.

650B might be late to the party and unwelcome in some quarters but it’s here to stay.

ok I give in – it’s probably not a dead standard.

Apologies to any kittens that may have been harmed as a result of my rash statement.

what is this kitten thing anyway?

what is this kitten thing anyway?

Every time someone starts a wheel size thread, a kitten dies.

darkcyan – Member

ok I give in – it’s probably not a dead standard.

Splitter!
🙂

Was it? Early FS bikes were pretty shit, and even now they’re not exactly ubiquitous in the UK.

Fify.

The OP knows at least 2 650b riders on a Thursday night at Stanmer anyway – so his powers of observation pretty hopeless anyway ;)) !!!

@JCL

They’re not though anywhere, look at XC racing, still plenty of hardtails. The Europeans still love their old school hardtails too – long stems and narrow bars.

I’m going to get some serious stick on Thursdays 🙁

was browsing at giant bikes and picked up a giant catalogue in a newish bikeshop, which list the pros and cons. Something like 6 small/medium disadvantages iirc over 26 inch.. then one largeish advantage considerably more contact area in theory…iirc mmmmm 🙄 At least their honest I guess. Deffo not as straight cut though as we are being led to believe imho. Surely 24/26/650b/29 all have a place.

They’re not though anywhere, look at XC racing, still plenty of hardtails. The Europeans still love their old school hardtails too – long stems and narrow bars.

Meanwhile in the rest of the world….
Hardtails are still there for XC racing, apart from that above entry level they are not that common. Again LBS have about 3 on display all have been there for the last 6 months, all the FS bikes have been sold and rotated at least 3 times. With the exception of XC whippets racing HT’s are not that common down here in Oz.
Edit and 12 yo dirt jumpers