Ah so the Tories could ignore that referendum then?
Why would they? Tories are mostly anti-EU.

Why would they? – they’re mostly anti-EU.

Don’t forget the Tories are unable to carry out their final cuts to corporation tax because they say they want more money for hospitals.

This is despite the fact they say that lowering corp tax brings more in.

They never tell the truth. No one tells the truth about the monetary system save a few prominent MMTers.

That’s because there are other constraints:

Now you’re getting it!!! Keynesian stimulus has its place but it isn’t a panacea for all countries at all times. (Trump is trying it now and I can’t find a single informed commentator who things it’s a sane thing to do at this point in the cycle – can you???)

Why do you think the Tories have be an abject failure ? – it’s because they don’t spend

They’ve been spending plenty. We’re currently spending more on interest on debt than we spend on welfare.

We spend our money on film equipment and get 100% tax relief

Yes, you avoid corporation tax. It’s easy to avoid, that’s the point.

Don’t forget the Tories are unable to carry out their final cuts to corporation tax because they say they want more money for hospitals.
This is despite the fact they say that lowering corp tax brings more in.

Corporation Tax Revenue has steadily gone up with almost every cut in rate in recent years. That doesn’t mean it wold go up if it was cut again. By definition HMRC are looking for the sweetspot and *think* this is it. If they thought another cut would increase revenue they’d already have made it.

No one tells the truth about the monetary system save a few prominent MMTers.

😀 Thousands of people from all countries in the world who would all gain from growing the economy are all lying to stop the economy growing? Hope that tin foil hat isn’t too tight for you.

Yes, you avoid corporation tax. It’s easy to avoid, that’s the point.

But this is not a loophole, n it’s deliberately designed that way to encourage the money to be spent back in the economy where it creates growth.

Avoiding it is doing stuff like creating a UK subsidiary of an overseas company,then the overseas company charges the UK one a license fee to use their branding, which funnily enough is usually just about the same figure as the UK company makes profit.

And Greece tried spending their way out and went utterly tits up.

That’s precisely the wrong way round – Greece adopted (was forced to adopt) austerity (to satisfy German political constraints) and it went from bad to worse.

Greece tried to spend their way out of it? Eh? Thats a somewhat interesting interpretation. You’re making it sound like they were attempting to build some kind of utopian Keynesian economic model. They definitely weren’t doing that.

Greece actually took advantage of lax EU financial oversight and moral-free UK-based ‘creative accountancy’ to cook the books and spank loads of other peoples money on unnecessary shiny things, vanity projects and good old fashioned corruption. All while simultaneously making an executive decision that nobody was going to pay any tax.

Can you spot the flaw in that plan? Hence needing to be bailed out. Greeces problems were entirely of their own making, but the government tried to blame those horrid nasty Germans for making them face up to the reality that magic money trees don’t actually exist

German banks were happy to lend them billions even though they knew they couldn’t pay it back.

Don’t be ridiculous. No bank is ever going to do that. The Greek government spent millions with UK based accountancy firms to cook their books for them to display a rather rose-tinted balance sheet, thus qualifying for finance that they knew they could never afford to pay back.

You’d kind of think, as a bank, that the accounts you were being presented with by a sovereign government within the EU weren’t actually the work of pure fiction.

You can’t blame the German banks for what was systemic huge-scale fraud by the Greek government. Which is why our ‘oh no… poor us’ act afterwards didn’t elicit much sympathy

Still… lots of UK firms in The City made a killing out of it. Which, somewhat ironically, points us to the direction of what our economy will be based on post-Brexit

I’m hoping for heavy snow and sub-zero temperatures. Weren’t they predicting a flu epidemic too?

Let’s hope there’s some truth in this

“>25% ! of the economy was off the books just before the crash, that was the worst in the developed world in the time”

Spain says “hold my pint”

Anyway this is all off topic. Where’s Dannyh? I was quite enjoying trolling him with silence. I thought he had more perseverence that that

<Waves>

Still here buddy – but what about you? I was getting worried I might have to source an online picture of an ice sculpture to stand in for you.

I haven’t got time now, but later on I will pose the question again in a specific manner – with a couple of quotes from you.

And in other news….Ofcom reject Tory complaint about placing ice sculpture on plinth in place of Johnson.
Complaint is probably the wrong word – whingeing is more appropriate.

I’ve posted my vote and my wife has hers also.

I’ve posted my vote and my wife’s also. She was going to vote LibDem so I had to take pre-emptive action.

Anyway on the subject of thick voters.

Channel 4 news had a piece on focus groups. They had a bunch of working class people being asked questions/looking at TV clips etc,. and then asking for their opinions.
Most were traditionally Labour voters but not really because of Labour values but because their parents had always voted Labour.
They were showed clips of Boris and Corbyn. They like Boris just because, but they can’t trust Corbyn for some reason.
After their discussions about NHS, employment etc,. they were shown a clip of Boris saying, “We will get Brexit done and then spend 2020 doing all the things that will be make us great”
They all then said they would vote for him as he is saying exactly what they have been talking about. Even though he actually really said nothing at all

Shocking.

I hope youre happy Binners

? New with @alexwickham: As negotiations with BBC over facing Andrew Neil in prime-time drag on, Boris Johnson’s team confirm he'll sit with ITV’s Phil Schofield and Holly Willoughby before election day.https://t.co/BYhXUc5xsy

— Mark Di Stefano (@MarkDiStef) December 3, 2019

Malcolm Tucker would never have allowed this to happen…

Perhaps unwisely Boris Johnson now in front of a “Simply Nuts” sign pic.twitter.com/ADQzYgdtoy

— Rowena Mason (@rowenamason) December 3, 2019

Now you’re getting it!!! Keynesian stimulus has its place but it isn’t a panacea for all countries at all times. (Trump is trying it now and I can’t find a single informed commentator who things it’s a sane thing to do at this point in the cycle – can you???)

Oh, irony.
Expansionist monetary policy and demand side fiscal policy doesn’t make it Keynesian. In fact Keynes is against expansionist monetary policies during periods of low interest rates.

Keynes also proposed tax cuts and spending in response to recessionary conditions or pressure. He did not propose it as a solution to non recession conditions. He was in favour of protectionism though. Quite liked military spending too.

So Trump’s protectionism is good, his monetary policy is not Keynesian because its at the wrong time. Ditto Fiscal policy.
Stop conflating Keynesian economics with expansionary monetary and demand side fiscal policies. They aren’t the same thing.

They’ve been spending plenty. We’re currently spending more on interest on debt than we spend on welfare.

As was explained the last time you raised this red herring, that is based on ideological choice, not sound economic reasoning.

They’ve also spent the least in the NHS ever, once you adjust for inflation etc. Is this Keynesian? Or just ideological stupidity? Is Austerity a good idea? Does it work or is it ideological stupidity? Enquiring minds want to know.

Unless you’re a hedge fund manager then voting for the Tories or Brexit makes you pretty ****ing stupid in my book

Unless you’re a hedge fund manager then voting for the Tories or Brexit makes you pretty ****ing stupid in my book

binners stop making the assumption that everyone who voted for Brexit is a Tory/thick as mince/racist. You and plenty of others on here are not doing themselves any favours by banging on about this. I voted for Brexit but haven’t voted Tory for some 20 years and have no intention of doing so ever again.