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It's an £850 optional extra, but the car is still a compelling option even at that higher price.It's an optional extra, that will put a stack of private customers off. It'll also impact BIK in some markets. Especially as every other 800V car (so far) is compatible out of the factory door.
it's a luxury marque,
Is it really? I mean there was a time when driving a Merc was a 'thing' and well before that there was a time when they were actually good because they were beautifully engineered, lasted longer than most other makes, rarely broke down and if they did, the dealer network was second to none....and for that you paid a well deserved premium. But now? Surely they are just mass produced tat like all cars...is there really any difference between a Kia and a Merc beyond the shiny dials and slightly plusher fabric?
is there really any difference between a Kia and a Merc beyond the shiny dials and slightly plusher fabric?
Give me the Kia any day of the week.
They have made cheaper Mercs, namely the A class and CLA. But IMO, as an owner of a fancy Merc (albeit 2013) and a Hyundai, I think that yes the 'proper' Mercs are still good. The more I drive it the more I can see the work that's gone into it. It's not without reliability issues, of course, because all cars are more or less equally reliable now. The basics are there, but there's probably equal chance of a **** up in some component somewhere due to a design or manufacturing blunder across most brands. But everything in it shows that it's been really worked on. The seat is always comfortable in any position, it's just different. My knees don't bang the steering column shroud. The infotainment boots up immediately. The transmission shifts exactly as I would shift, it doesn't do anything weird. The brakes are really powerful but not at all grabby, just progressive. The climate control never blasts you, it's always weighted just right. It doesn't assault you with bongs and bings. The drive is outstanding, it somehow manages to corner flat, be sporty (for a big car) and also really comfortable etc etc. At first you just think 'yeah ok' then you realise four hours have gone by and you're not in the least bit stressed or uncomfortable. Any time I get to drive it is a treat. If I plan a long trip I genuinely look forward to the drive.
I don't know if the CLA is like that mind 🙂
So my dead Citroen eventually got looked at over a week later after being booked in.
First diagnosis £159 turned nothing up. Garage is saying they need to move the next diagnosis which involves unstrapping everything which is going to cost £770.
So that's £900 before they know anything.
Car is 3 months out of warranty and only 18,000 miles on the clock.
Garage are very poor generally but it's the local Citroen dealer and they've giving me the impression they simply don't know how to fix it.
In the background I've raised a request with Citroen who are looking into what should be done. I'm awaiting a response on that.
It staggers me these cars are so hard to diagnose.
It staggers me these cars are so hard to diagnose.
They’re not IMO. Your garage is just rubbish. Take it elsewhere.
It seems common with the most modern cars that the skills are in short supply. When our Hyundai's brake controller failed, they couldn't diagnose it and had to wait weeks for someone to come from Hyundai (allegedly). How hard can it be to diagnose a brake controller? These things have been on cars for 30 years.
It staggers me these cars are so hard to diagnose.
They’re not IMO. Your garage is just rubbish. Take it elsewhere.
Qualify that? I'm all ears. If you know a garage that can help me for this problem that's in the Citroen pathway let me know please. Just saying that is not hugely helpful.
There are limited options.
I've got to pay at least £100 plus to shift it and then go through the process of diagnosing that again £200 to get to the same pont. So if be £600 down to get to the same point.
(I'm not saying it's not rubbish I just need an alternative thanks.)
It seems common with the most modern cars that the skills are in short supply. When our Hyundai's brake controller failed, they couldn't diagnose it and had to wait weeks for someone to come from Hyundai (allegedly). How hard can it be to diagnose a brake controller? These things have been on cars for 30 years.
Skills, staff, morale and support from manufacturers.
I can't get my head around they can't just plug it in and get a fault list. It's a COW.
In the old days I get taking an engine apart but not now.
I also need to look into what happens legally with a lease car if it doesn't work when I return it.
I think the lease company is on shaky ground if I can prove it's a pre-existing fault. Dangerous fault.
I also need to look into what happens legally with a lease car if it doesn't work when I return it.
My PS4 is on a lease which ends when the warranty does for this very reason.
I also need to look into what happens legally with a lease car if it doesn't work when I return it.
My PS4 is on a lease which ends when the warranty does for this very reason.
Yeah what I got wrong with this lease unlike my hundreds of others it was registered 3 months before I got it. Problem with an in stock car.
Warranties apply from registration.
Which we only realised after.
I also need to look into what happens legally with a lease car if it doesn't work when I return it.
My PS4 is on a lease which ends when the warranty does for this very reason.
Yeah what I got wrong with this lease unlike my hundreds of others it was registered 3 months before I got it. Problem with an in stock car.
Warranties apply from registration.
Which we only realised after.
I'm in a similar position, but only by a couple of weeks. It will be being handed back and I'll take a hit on the 2 weeks before the 3 years is up.
I also need to look into what happens legally with a lease car if it doesn't work when I return it.
My PS4 is on a lease which ends when the warranty does for this very reason.
Yeah what I got wrong with this lease unlike my hundreds of others it was registered 3 months before I got it. Problem with an in stock car.
Warranties apply from registration.
Which we only realised after.
I'm in a similar position, but only by a couple of weeks. It will be being handed back and I'll take a hit on the 2 weeks before the 3 years is up.
Fully intending on returning this before the lease ends if/when repaired.
And paying the 40% lease outstanding bill.
This was a 4 year lease - and very limited availability just after the pandemic otherwise I wouldn't have considered a Citroen.
It's just a classic example of multiple bad things aligning.
Have you spoken to the leasing company @rone? Who is the funder? Is it Citroen? If so then they might have some clout with a dealer. I would still be taking it elsewhere even if I had to pay the £100 to get it there.
This needs its own thread really in any case....
Have you spoken to the leasing company @rone? Who is the funder? Is it Citroen? If so then they might have some clout with a dealer. I would still be taking it elsewhere even if I had to pay the £100 to get it there.
This needs its own thread really in any case....
Yes spoken to them. They can't take a broken car back but are making some pushes where they can. They are speaking to Citroen fleet.
Moving my car is not the issue - moving it only to have to diagnose again and end up with the same result is.
The Citroen customer care women was absolutely so rude to us. Saying she will 'maybe' get back to us.
I'm guessing the whole group is in a mess.
(Yes I didn't want to overwhelm this thread but just wanted folk to know Stellantis have big issues. And they own a lot of car companies.)
This was yesterday.
Big Share drop and retreat over EV roll out.
Big Share drop and retreat over EV roll out
Probably as much to do with them owning lots of dinosaur brands that weren't great to start with and have failed to keep up with Koreans, Chinese and Germans.
Got a bit of a curve ball the other day. My Mercedes EQA 250+ is going to be replaced at 12 months (September) so i have to choose another car from the Mercedes family. Ive enjoyed every minute with it and due to having a home charger i really havent had a seconds range anxiety with it since i got it. I dont really give a hoot what it gets range wise because i dont begrudge putting an expensive charge in every so often if needed and i find there is ALWAYS a charger if i need it somewhere.
So my options were
Another EQA AMG Premium Plus which would have given me money back each month as they are cheaper now
EQE Sport 350+ As standard - Seems we are getting stupid deals on these
CLA AMG Electric Saloon or Fastback - A couple of quid either way tbh
Then it was just bigger and more speccy models for more and more money each month.
Ive gone for a EQE as its range, whilst not that important should mean i never even have to resort to expensive charges anymore. Its also back to driving what i deem a proper car against the fake SUV style of the EQA. Ive watched a few videos. Its rather bland in an aerodynamic type of way. It hasnt got quite the spec my Premium plus had but the extras are options i really didnt give much of a care about.
Looking forward to it
probably true but they're all big brands. They just needs some investment.Big Share drop and retreat over EV roll out
Probably as much to do with them owning lots of dinosaur brands that weren't great to start with and have failed to keep up with Koreans, Chinese and Germans.
Wife’s Hyundai inster won’t charge. Been at dealer since Saturday and not due to be looked at until Thursday. 6 months old. Looks like it might have the known Hyundai ICCU fault. I hope not (thought they had resolved this) but looking on line a few other inster owners have started to mention it. For comparison my Cupra is 2 years old and no issues (other than one or 2 initial non EV niggles).
well we got the Inster back yesterday with a new ICCU unit ( and change of coolant and de-ionised water?) The invoice states “ICCU upgrade - ax EV charging improvement ICCU GPU”, glad to see it was not a like for like change, but a different ICCU, so hopefully it won’t happen again. So it looks like these new insters have the same known Hyundai ICCU issues. Not sure why Hyundai don’t just fit the upgraded ICCU to the cars at the factory as the fault was known about before they ever launched the Inster.
probably true but they're all big brands. They just needs some investment.
Not sure about that jeep /dodge /fiat /Chrysler/lancia/were all suffering from shititus long before stelantis came along.
probably true but they're all big brands. They just needs some investment.
Not sure about that jeep /dodge /fiat /Chrysler/lancia/were all suffering from shititus long before stelantis came along.
Even as a long time Peugeot fan -stelantis have a habit of making minimum viable product and often don't hit the mark.
Well it's all news to me. Having not had a french car since a Renault 5 turbo circa 1994 and that was a pile of trouble.
Well it's all news to me. Having not had a french car since a Renault 5 turbo circa 1994 and that was a pile of trouble.
(I do wonder about these big parent companies bleeding stuff dry though.)
Let's not confuse stelantis with Renault Nissan mitsubishi who are an entirely different group.
Stelantis appear to be a VC group who buy ailing brands and try to re market them using the name - like a car version of Fraser group it seems.
I was interested in buying a second hand ev. It is interesting watching the reviews on YouTube but none of them talk about the reliability or cost and ease of repair. I know you can find the reliability surveys but cost, ease and availability of repairs would be the most useful info. For example all the reviews rate highly Kia’s cars but they also seem to have issues with motor bearings and electrical faults. Where is the best place to find this kind of info.
Most of the 'reviews' are just shilling for the EV manufacturers or selling leases - stuff like Car Wow, What Car and Everything Electric are a basically adverts. I mean what can they really tell you other than the boot is this size, look at the lovely big wheels (yuk) and oooh scratchy plastic not as good as much more expensive car brand...
When I was looking for a pre reg/demo/secondhand EV I found the only You Tube worth watching were some of the owner channels for a particular model I was interested in or those that were doing long journeys in one. I found Mr EV (Andrew Till) reasonably useful for the Megane and Kia (if you can get past his annoying family) as he has a particular model for several months and some guy in the US called the Ioniq guy has had several Hyundais for a few years. These type of channels at least give you an idea of potential issues.
Also the owner forums for a particular model are sometimes a help though they tend to be populated mainly by idiots who can't work out simple controls so its difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff
In the end I decided to kick the can down the road (so to speak) as firstly I'm not convinced my model of buying a 1 year old car outright and keeping it 10 years is viable any more due to expense of out of warranty repairs and I just hate being conned - which is where the new car industry is right now. Cars are more expensive than they have ever been and designed to be almost un repairable.
It looks like my wife is going to have access to a salary sacrifice scheme by the Spring so we'll prob do that and get something like a Scenic or an EV3. If I'm renting it I don't care as much about the car which I guess is where we are all being forced to go.
Which sucks.
Yeah, when you watch a few different channels for the same cars and noticed the same points consistently being made, even niche ones, you realise they are just saying what the manufacturer told them to!
Most of the 'reviews' are just shilling for the EV manufacturers or selling leases - stuff like Car Wow, What Car and Everything Electric are a basically adverts. I mean what can they really tell you other than the boot is this size, look at the lovely big wheels (yuk) and oooh scratchy plastic not as good as much more expensive car brand...
This - and they all say the same thing as each other “This switch has a nice damped movement and feels premium brand quality “ etc etc. identical but with a different presenter as if they haven’t bothered finding out for themselves but have simply watched a few other reviews.
Ha ha. Yes exactly what I felt. Maybe someone should start to build a repairable ev company that had open schemas and parts. That would be novel.
I went to the launch of the Megane at the dealers. I asked if they were going to do more basic models with sensibly sized less bling wheels suitable Winter tyres. Nope.
Is it me that's a million miles from the current buyer demographic or are the currently lousy sales of new EVs down to them being a million miles from the EV buyer demographic? You know, people who give a **** enough to buy an EV.
I don't want an SUV, I want a car.
I don't want a car I can barely see out of even if it's got cameras to help me park.
I don't want huge ninja wheels with rubber bands, I want steels with Cross Climates that have compliant side walls.
I don't need heated seats, electrically adjusted stuff, a television screen and a thousand things I'll never use to go wrong.
So I'm sticking with the simple first generation EV I've got - what's that doing for your sales ?
I need heated seats. Now I've had them, I'm never going back. So much quicker and more efficient to heat the person rather than the whole car.
I need everything that can be heated, heated - screen, seats, wheel, washers, mirrors....! I also need plenty of other tech as well because it's so useful. I wouldn't buy a car these days that didn't come with things like adaptive cruise, speed limit assist, mirrors that dip in reverse, rear camera, remote start, keyless entry, wireless Apple Car Play.... Plenty of models have all this sort of stuff as standard now though.
So make high end stuff for people who want it and are happy to pay for it, and something simpler and cheaper for people who want smaller steel wheels, wear a coat when its cold and are just waiting for the unnecessary tech to fail.
Speed limit assist sounds useful, the rest I doubt I'd use or have turned off if I have it.
The mirror dipping thing in reverse confused me for a moment, I dip the mirror when the car behind is on main beam, does it change the position of the door mirrors? I like cars I can turn in the seat and look out of the rear window when reversing, not many made now.
Maybe I'll just buy a renovated 2cv or 4l. I've already got the beret, striped T-shirt and old man driving habits. 🙂
I need everything that can be heated, heated - screen, seats, wheel, washers, mirrors....! I also need plenty of other tech as well because it's so useful. I
Seem to have needs and wants mixed up there.
I will never have another car that can’t be preheated from an app.
Bollocks to scraping ice off the windows in the morning. That’s for savages.
This is a need that I didn’t know I needed until I had it.
I will never have another car that can’t be preheated from an app.
Bollocks to scraping ice off the windows in the morning. That’s for savages.
This is a need that I didn’t know I needed until I had it.
I agree it’s very handy, not sure if I would pay a monthly subscription for it though. I have it free with my Cupra, but my wife’s Hyundai only had 6 months free, now she needs to pay €10 a month if she wants this feature (it was all she really used on the app). I think more features will go this way as manufacturers try to get as much €€s from customers.
does it change the position of the door mirrors?
Yep - when you engage reverse the passenger door mirror dips so you can see the kerb for parking. On my Volvo both mirrors dipped but on most cars wit his feature it's just the passenger one.
Seem to have needs and wants mixed up there.
Need/want meh. I need them to be available on my car because I want them.
I agree it’s very handy, not sure if I would pay a monthly subscription for it though.
I agree - I'm deffo not paying monthly for them. Mrs OS has a BMW that says you can pay £10 per month for adaptive main beam! £10 per month for as long as you own the car - no end date. Daylight (or in fact night time in this case) robbery that is.
not sure if I would pay a monthly subscription for it though.
Agreed - on my eUP it was free for 3 years, now £90/year - but that will shortly be irrelevant as the car requires a 3g (not 4g or 5g) connection. Even more annoying is that the app functionality isn't available on the dash - the only way to pre-warm is to unplug from the charger, put it in drive mode and turn the heater on. Fortunately it is possible to lock it with the spare key.
On principle, I refuse to pay a subscription to use the vehicle I've already paid for. These subscription services will only stick if people pay for them
Also, if you're paying a subscription for a function and it packs up, who pays for the repair? 8 bet it's me, isn't it.
So, I bought it, I'm responsible for repair if it goes wrong. I'll be damned if I'm going to pay to use it.
Seems like quite a few EVs have these types of features as standard which is good. BMW have to be one of the worst brands for inflating the prices of their already overpriced models with extras that come as standard on many others. When you go up the range on their cars most of the additions are cosmetic and any useful driving features are still extra.
These subscription services will only stick if people pay for them
Not really. They will stick because they are "free" for the first buyer who therefore won't care because they're not paying.
The car companies are not daft. They know someone paying for a lease isn't going to think about the person buying it next for even a single breath.
Second buyers and beyond will be saddled with them because in time there will be so few cars people want to buy that are not on a pay for services model to get features they want.
People like technology whether it's in cars or their fridge or toilet cistern. Many will be happy to pay because they're always paying for tech anyway, it'll just be another thing like Spotify or Strava premium etc.
Personally I think many of the driving aids a bit unnecessary not in a hair shirt way but in a wanting to be engaged in driving and paying proper attention to what I am doing way.
I don't like the operating model either fwiw but I know I'll be stuck with it at some stage.
The subscription model for features is taking the piss. Mine is free for the duration of my company car term, but the next owner will have to pay.
The VW Group one is sort of tolerable (to me) because it does at least include 4G connectivity and £6 a month (or so, it's an annual charge) isn't far off the going rate for a 4G sim deal. All the hardware type features like adaptive lights or whatever aren't SAAS. I wouldn't think twice about using something like a Carly (which has it's own SAAS license of course) to bypass that if you can.
My EV has a 'shop' menu where I can buy "new and exciting" interior lighting features including adaptive lights that glow brighter as you accelerate in Sport mode. They don't cost much, but it's not my thing, they're tied to my account though, if I buy it the next owner doesn't get them... it's all a bit snide really.
Not unique to EVs though, my previous ICE Skoda was the same, you just got a lot less features for your money.
Who says EVs can't be fun eh!
Another track day ticked off in the Polestar 2 - Bedford Autodrome this time. As I was heading up on my own (normally have @pictonroad as a passenger), I opted for coaching for the day.. this was FANTASTIC and SOOO useful!
I really learnt so much about weight transfer, getting power to the rear wheels when over steer occurs, and really learnt the line at Bedford!
Here's some raw un edited clips from a few sessions..
DrP
rapid. love the camera position.