XX1 / X01 Cassette Wear

No, because the 42t is almost solid, to close the back of the cassette, it would weigh a ton if it was steel.

You mean, like 70-100 grams heavier? oh noes 😛

You mean, like 70-100 grams heavier? oh noes

You think most people will pay £300 for a cassette weighing more than a £20 one? Good luck with that.

Just push the pedals a bit harder so you’re not reliant on the 42, or admit you’re not as fit as you thought as fit a smaller ring. It’s not really difficult!

You think most people will pay £300 for a cassette weighing more than a £20 one? Good luck with that.

I should imagine manufacturing it from steel would reduce the cost somewhat. I’d rather have durability over weight when it comes to drive train parts, especially on a system like 1×11 whereby you’ve lost a load of weight anyway (albeit you’re adding rotating weight by going to a larger cassette).

1×10/11 systems get more wear anyway because of the funny chain lines involved. It sounds like a lot of ball ache for the sake of getting rid of the front mech.

To the point that I don’t see the point of it, will just stick with 1×10 36r/32f and develop more strength.

I should imagine manufacturing it from steel would reduce the cost somewhat

Of course it wouldn’t, maybe £10 or so, the expense is in the fact it’s made of a single piece of steel, which takes hours to machine. They then stick the alu 42t on the back to ‘close’ the cassette. That’s just a flat plate that’s machined, negligible effort involved. So you’d have a £290 cassette instead, much better!

You don’t trade durability, it’s perfect durable anyway.

To the point that I don’t see the point of it, will just stick with 1×10 36r/32f and develop more strength.

So you don’t actually have it? You’re worrying about a theoretical problem, which isn’t a real one?

Of course it wouldn’t, maybe £10 or so, the expense is in the fact it’s made of a single piece of steel, which takes hours to machine. They then stick the alu 42t on the back to ‘close’ the cassette. That’s just a flat plate that’s machined, negligible effort involved. So you’d have a £290 cassette instead, much better!

Do you seriously think that manufacturing costs go up by 5-6 times to go from a fully steel 10 speed cassette to an 11 speed? It could be priced at SLX costs and still make a profit, it’s just that 1×11 is priced so high because it’s an aspirational product.

So you don’t actually have it? You’re worrying about a theoretical problem, which isn’t a real one?

I’ve been working out whether it’s worth splashing a **** tonne of money on. And my conclusion is that it’s ridiculous given the durability complaints on here.

Do you seriously think that manufacturing costs go up by 5-6 times to go from a fully steel 10 speed cassette to an 11 speed?

No. But if you compare apples with apples, then that’s not the case. But let’s not let facts get in the way of ignorance eh?

9 speed XG-999 11-32 cassette: £275

10 speed XX 11-36 cassette: £314

11 speed XX1 10-42 cassette: £338

SLX is an entirely different construction, it’s entirely irrelevant in this context. Go and look at how an XX1 cassette is assembled.

All of those I’ve linked to have the largest sprocket made from aluminium. So yes, make that out of steel and you’ll probably save £10 or so and add a shed load of weight.

You could indeed make one like an SLX cassette, which would weigh a bit more, and cost a lot less. Shimano are going along those lines with XTR M9000, but it’s only 11-40, and the biggest ones are ti anyway, so still not all steel. I imagine there’ll be an M790 XT a year or so down the line, which will have a full steel construction, but it’s a narrower range than XX1 and it’ll weigh more, perhaps that’s more your thing.

As for “aspirational pricing”, XX1 is cheaper than XX as a whole groupset…

Would just like to point out that Shimano XTR M9000 cassette is half the price of XX1 at £160 !

In fact the M9000 groupset is good value. Priced about £590 on CRC.
I know what I’ll be going for.

You could indeed make one like an SLX cassette, which would weigh a bit more, and cost a lot less. Shimano are going along those lines with XTR M9000, but it’s only 11-40, and the biggest ones are ti anyway, so still not all steel. I imagine there’ll be an M790 XT a year or so down the line, which will have a full steel construction, but it’s a narrower range than XX1 and it’ll weigh more, perhaps that’s more your thing.

That would be perfect for me. I’d rather plow the rest of my budget over the next year into carbon rims, that new schwalbe tubeless system and an avalanche cartridge.

1×11 has been relegated to about last place in terms of build priority. I have a habit of destroying rear mechs on rocks as well, so would rather go with an XT mech coupled to an XTR shifter.

If it was more durable than reports seem to make out and cassettes were a little cheaper, it would be near the top of my upgrade list.

Would just like to point out that Shimano XTR M9000 cassette is half the price of XX1 at £160 !

Well, you mean it’s £50 cheaper from the same vendor (and £190 elsewhere), and weighs 331g, versus 260g for XX1, and has a 364% range as opposed to a 420% range.

So yes… M9000 is indeed cheaper, although it’s actually only 20% cheaper, not half, it has a narrower range, and it weighs 70g more. Which is probably among the cheaper weight savings for the sort of people buying it. XD bodies weigh less too, so more weight savings there.

I know which I’ll buy…

Fair point- was being lazy and looking at just your post.
Weight isn’t everything though and rather than just steel it features some Ti too.

Am I right in thinking the XTR will fit on a normal freehub body too? That saves even more money.

Each to their own. Glad Shimanos in the game (with a cheaper price and retro fit option too).

Weight isn’t everything though and rather than just steel it features some Ti too.

Ti is softer than steel, so it’ll wear quicker than XX1, as a greater proportion of the cassette is ti. The only longevity benefit is that there’s no alu 42, but there’s no 42 at all, and longevity of the 42 isn’t really an issue anyway.

Am I right in thinking the XTR will fit on a normal freehub body too? That saves even more money.

That is true, so it depends on whether you’re building from scratch or not.

Glad Shimanos in the game (with a cheaper price and retro fit option too).

I agree that competition in this respect is only good, but it is only £50 cheaper than XX1 as a whole groupset, and more expensive than X1, it’s not really a low cost option per se.

Don’t get me wrong, I much prefer Shimano stuff, but IMO M9000 isn’t a true rival to XX1, it’s a more holistic groupset solution, with the double and triple options. I’ve long said I don’t think Shimano are trying to take the market segment from SRAM and XX1. There are a lot of misconceptions around the cost of XX1 which are largely wrong.

just another update – ive just calculated using garmin connect my mileage since I had it

now about 1472 miles! its still actually shifting fine (bar sometimes it takes a little longer in 3&4th to shift but nothing too long and absolutely like new still shifting up through the same gears), and to be fair its probs more so to do with cable stretch (new cable etc)

so on that basis, given that’s all peak mileage (bit of wales/lakes/etc etc) all thrown in its actually quite good I think, ok yes weve had a great summer so its endured a easyish weather wise usage but still good going, theres ALOT of climbing involved in those miles too which id imagine adds to wear,

I must admit im shocked its still going really strong, and even the alloy cog albeit looking a lot worse than the rest has only slipped on me one ride (due to lack of lube if nothing else!)

Can someone take a look at this, I have been in touch with SRAM Tech and explained that I am having problems with noise and shifting after 3.5 months with a new XO1 drivetrain and they said it might be a warranty issue and to take it to a bike shop. I know chainrings get hooked when worn but would appreciate a second opinion on these before I follow it up.

I have found that the chain is a little worn being somewhere between 1/8″ and a 1/16″ stretched over 12″. I have calculated I have done about 300 miles through the summer since new in June.

Expensive if I have to replace 3 times a year at £85 a time and this was the driest summer for years.

looks like my chainring did after 100 miles, whats your issue? is it dropping the chain?

i essentially rode my launch month XX1 drivetrain, with little maintenance, for over a year, my chainring and jockey wheels looked like this, the cassette was worn as much, and the chain, never, ever dropped once

It makes a noise under force that sounds like it is skipping at the front I have stripped everything down lubed crank cassette splines etc. but cant get rid of the noise and it seems to be getting worse. Shifting is not great but I guess that is the chain my main concern is if the noise is because the chainring is worn.

sheeesh mine looks new 🙂 think I should just change the chain and try that?

when you fitted the chain did you shorten it as per the sram instructions? Could be chain is too long.

Yes I did 2 chain links visibly it looks right too when in highest and lowest.

m_t_b – not sure what you think is wrong? the chainring looks absolutely fine to me???

if its purely just the noise, then are you riding gritty/wet etc? cos it does make a hell of a lot of noise if im honest until the lube clears it all off, in summer dryness mines is absolutely silent, but on wet and muddy/gritty rides it does sound awful, sadly that’s just the nature of the thick/thin ring up front i’d guess

if its not dropping the chain and shifting fine and just the noise issue then that’s just how it is, just make sure you lube up plenty and try and keep the whole system clean and debris free! (especially oily gunk on chainring and jockey wheels)

Yes I can see where you are coming from looking at above just not sure whats making the noise, its in the dry and the wet, I use a fairly dry lube so its not clogging up. It started about 2 weeks ago and has been getting worse so I’m thinking it could be the chain thanks for taking a look,I always find it hard to gauge wear on chainrings.

On a side note any idea if KMC chains are worth a look?

Two links visible? That’s not what sram says. You take the chain off rear each, compress suspension and then shorten on biggest rings

Mine was noisy after I changed the chain, a sort of grating when pushing hard, particularly in the larger sprockets. Seems to have settled down, particularly after a good clean and lube with Squirt, although probably coincidental.

Mine also made a grating sound when pushing hard, but it was a knackered chainring – replaced & it went away 🙂

Same experience as njee20 on new chain. Now running quiet. Also best thing I did was to drop down from 34 to 32 chain ring. Lot better wear in the mid range at the back and also better chain line which also helps to reduce wear overal.

it does love being ‘lubed’ up, I find nearer the end of a gritty peak ride it sounds far worse than at the start, keeping it all clean is the real key to both performance and longevity/noise I’ve found

as I said last week in the wet and mud, it was noisy, out the other night in the dry and it was silent throughout

the noise will be coming from the chainring/chain interface on the thicker front teeth, theres no room for grit/mud to pass and the noise will be a lot worse than a normal chainring

that’s my take on it as it stands, again once it all starts to clear (road section or dry section after the grit/mud) it does eventually clear itself

also as its so important the b-screw actually makes a hell of a lot more difference to noise/running smooth etc than any other gearing ive used, if its just a quarter turn to far either way it can affect its shifting/noise too

still worth it all though 😉 and still no dropped chain for me yet 1500 miles in

Well, I’ve just changed the chain on my X01 at the 0.5 chain stretch after 600 miles and the 42t cog jumps like crazy on the steep climbs, put the old chain back on and it appears fine. So should I just run the old chain and chain ring / cassette into the ground or should I try replacing the 42t cog? Found an Italian website which appears to offer a replacement, but can’t find any other info on whether it works or not. Although at 90 euros its a lot cheaper than buying a whole new cassette, but is it worth the gamble?

http://www.aribike.it/pignone%20sram%20XX1%20html/pignone_cassetta_sramXX1.htm

Just keep running the old chain and cassette and then replace the lot when it stops working.

Although you may have ruined the new chain by now.

Then consider a smaller chainring so you’re not using the 42 as much.

The 42T seems quite sensitive to setup being correct.. mine was starting to jump so I thought a new cassette was imminent. Turned out the mech hanger had come loose (mech itself seems to occasionally too) resulting in unwanted side-to-side movement – tightened everything up and it seems fine now. Cheap fix! 🙂

Yeah those were my thoughts as well, guess when I’ve worn it out and I replace it I could run two chains and alternate them. Might try one of those oval chain rings as well next time around to help me pedal more consistently up the climbs. Did manage one climb in 2nd gear on Sunday so maybe I should just MTFU and pedal harder!

Tom

Or fit a smaller chainring…? 😕

rooster – out of interest did you cut the new chain to exactly the same length as the one it replaced?

I found/remember when I changed my chain last time, I added 2 links to the new chain as I thought it was maybe a tad too short, and it did exactly the same in 42t cog, I took the 2 extra links back out and it shifted back to normal, it was jus in that 42t cog the same as you describe

mines is starting to get a little slow now shifting in some gears I must admit, much better when freshly cleaned/lubed, but aftr a few hours in the saddle shifting down to 3/4th and now 11th is becoming a little laborious, im just hoping to run it out through winter now and change it all in the new year, as thers no point in changing one item now going into winter, I may as well just run it in the ground!

and as njee says, get a smaller ring up front if your using it all that much, then youll be able to use the 2nd cog down (which is steel) for a lot of the climbing, and only use the 42t when desperate/legs gone etc

I cut the chain to the same length as the one it replaced, worked ok in all the gears apart from 1st (42t) but only on steep climbs, but noisy in all the gears. I could put an easier cog on the front and not use the 42t as much, but doesn’t that defeat the point of having the 42t? Or are you suggesting that less load on the 42t by having a smaller front chain ring will reduce wear? For info I’m running a 34t on the front with 26 ‘ain’t dead’ wheels, the whole bike with transmission was new from May, and considering its been the driest Summer in the Lakes for the last 6 years its not had a hard life. Chain de-greased and lubed after every ride, although I have recently swapped from Wet Lube (Green) to R&R Dry Lube (Blue) which is slightly noisier but less mess.

Tom

I haven’t noticed much wear on my cassette and checking the chain that seems fine too and have done 670 miles on them. But I do find that it takes an extra second longer to change down the gears. First I tightened the cable and then noticed that the derailleur wasn’t tight to the hanger. I tightened this up but there was still a slight wobble as if the bolt on to the hanger was not tight enough. Is this normal to have a little bit of play? Or is there supposed to be a washer between the hanger and derailleur? 11 speed X01 cassette and derailleur btw. Thanks

Well, I’ve just changed the chain on my X01 at the 0.5 chain stretch after 600 miles and the 42t cog jumps like crazy on the steep climbs, put the old chain back on and it appears fine. So should I just run the old chain and chain ring / cassette into the ground or should I try replacing the 42t cog? Found an Italian website which appears to offer a replacement, but can’t find any other info on whether it works or not. Although at 90 euros its a lot cheaper than buying a whole new cassette, but is it worth the gamble?

I’ve not long changed my xx1 chain for an x01 chain and now it’s doing exactly the same as yours.. I wonder if there is something weird about the X01 chains that causes the issue

I used a XX1 chain, same as the previous chain so I don’t so.

Have e-mailed the Italian website for more info on the replacement 42t cogs, will let you know how I get on.

Well it all worked perfectly last night around the Lakes with the old chain in torrential rain, mud and grit. My phone didn’t fare so well but that’s another story (need a waterproof pouch).

Valentina at Ari Bikes has come back and said a replacement cog is 75 euro’s plus 30 euro’s shipping. Bit expensive but cheaper than a replacement cassette so I’ll try one out and see how it goes, I suspect it should be no worse than the One Up range extender I tried earlier this year on a 1×10 setup, which worked really well. So fingers crossed that it fits OK, will report back if people are interested.

Tom

I could put an easier cog on the front and not use the 42t as much, but doesn’t that defeat the point of having the 42t?

That depends, if you’re spending a lot of time in the 42 (and rarely using the other end of the block?) I’d be looking to downsize. I’d sooner have the 42 as a bail out for the absolute steepest of climbs, rather than the gear I rely on to get me up anything uphill as you appear to:

Did manage one climb in 2nd gear on Sunday so maybe I should just MTFU and pedal harder!

Not all that surprising it’s worn if you’re doing all your climbing in it!