[Closed] tight IT band and foamrollers

When I had tight IT bands, it was because of something else. Foam rolling was prescribed as complementary to fixing the issue. Mine was weak glute max, which let the IT band become irritated.

Look at glute strengthening exercises. I then had to roll the glute first to loosen it, then the band.

But was told rolling just the band and not addressing the issue was like putting a bandage over a bleed but not repairing the leaking artery!

I've always rolled the TFL, as that is often what is making the IT band tight, but glutes insert into so that will likely help too- it depends which one needs switching off!

There's very little evidence to suggest that massage works, but it does seem to work, my own understanding is that switches the muscle off by taking it to it's end of range- as lengthening a muscle does work, which is why stretches make a difference.

So: crack on, it will be sore at first and then get less so- when there's no pain it's an indication that you've done as much as you can do. There's no need to give yourself howling pain, but you are unlikely to do much damage in that area by foam rollering anyway so I wouldn't concern yourself too much with that. (I'm assuming you are doing this as you have knee pain, not hip pain?)

TFL ?

I can feel the tightness all down the sides of my legs - not really painful just uncomfortable.  Been getting worse for years no hip or knee pain.

Hmm - looks like I need some pro help then

There’s very little evidence to suggest that massage works, but it does seem to work, my own understanding is that switches the muscle off by taking it to it’s end of range- as lengthening a muscle does work, which is why stretches make a difference.

I would say the opposite to that. There is evidence that (there are a range of types) massage works. On the other hand there is no evidence that "stretched" muscles provide any benefit, either in injury recovery or prevention. Added to the fact that the IT band is tendon like and cannot stretch anyway....

ITB

There's a lot of bollocks but apparently some truth. I had loads of pain outside my knees every run after 3-4km no matter what I did, for a year or more. Then two sessions with a foam roller cured it pretty much for good, only came back slightly a few times, this was ten years ago. So clearly it did something for me.

I just did the normal rolling outside my thigh with as much pressure as I could take. Rollering other body parts has not done anything beneficial for me.

It may not help you as your problem sounds different to mine. My mate on the other hand has had good results with ITB area stretches which helped him a lot, although they did nothing for me. It's not scientific but you can just try stuff until you find something that helps.

You can stretch tendons and ligaments - thats how you increase flexibility.  Ask any gymnast or dancer!

MRs TJ got knee pain a couple of years ago - recomended the foam roller to stretch the ITB and it cured her

I just rollered the IT band. And did the stretches. Moving the saddle forward a little cured the problem as mine was caused by over extension when pedalling.

I like the classic sit up on floor. Cross leg over with offending side foot next to other knee. Then pull the knee further across. There are other stretches too.

Ta for that Tired - I'll try that stretch

i think a physio appointment might be in order

You can stretch tendons and ligaments – thats how you increase flexibility. Ask any gymnast or dancer!

Number of assertions there but sticking with ITB. The ITB is adhered to the femur along its length. You will need to stretch your femur at the same time.

The ITB (tendon) is attached to the TFL (muscle) so releasing the TFL will take pressure of the ITB. Massage in general is good too, but you've got to figure out what is causing the tightness in the first place, usually muscle/activation imbalances in the hips/glutes etc.

The ITB gets tender as the tension creates irritation and misalignment

Google TFL release/massage for exercises.

Do the rolling including rolling/massaging/stretching the TFL, but see a therapist to identify the cause would be my advice.

it really is not surfer.  its a band of fascia that does not atttach to the femour at all - its runs from the pelvis to shin outside of the muscles of the thigh.  Remember I do have a basic understanding of anatomy and physiology.  I suggest you are getting confused with something else.  if it were adhered to the femour then it would lock your leg solid

That diagram is the first clear sensible one that relates to the symptoms I used to have despite having googled it to death at the time.

The TFL is where I feel stretching when I do ITB stretch exercises. And also how I get around London.

If it's really tight, might be worth getting a physio to make sure that there isn't another underlying cause being missed - I had knee pain, which turned out to be due to a tight ITB being aggravated by weak glute muscles. A few stretches and exercises dealt with the root cause (though if it's really tight, accupuncture helped release mine quicker and with less pain than rollering or manual pressure - others on here will be along shortly to say my experience was incorrect and it was witchcraft)

That picture is an xray of my issue!

Nah accupuncture/dry needling has helped release back muscles in me a few times that were in spasm and massage wasn't touching. Not painful, but not a pleasant relaxing experience for me with much weird nerve sensations.

I suspect its just a usage issue - too much cycling leads to shortening of the ITB and also the hamstrings.  I am pretty sure I do not have weak glutes - I can crack walnuts with my arse!

Looks like a physio appointment is in my near future tho

Acupuncture is an odd one - its the only "alternative" medicine that actually had decent evidence for it being effective without placebo effect even if the explanations given are at best "unscientific"

Yeh it not just the glute max it's all the ancillary muscles too, hip flexors etc. I have a similarly nut cracking arse, but have lots of other hip muscle tightness I have to keep on top off or I get issues with the piriformis which is another PITA.

I have no pain - I can just feel the tightness

It may be the glute med. If I feel mine tightening while running I switch to that funny sideways run for a wee bit.

I was switched onto this via Del from Proactive physio (she reckons he is either there or at Vivo physio now, Edinburgh based) after he sorted out my wife's IT band issues.

To prevent I do what I know as gorrila walks with a band or sideways leg raises.

TJ don't overlook your piriformis, tightness here will cause very similar and agonising knee pain. I had dreadful knees, tried the usual ITB stretch/rolling to no avail and then by chance learnt about the piriformis. Easy to do with a tennis ball ideally or just your fist, first time I did it instant relief in the knee.

Also psoas release really helps, again a tennis ball on top of a book works really well

edit just reread your post and realised you don't have pain. Which is great! But I had the tightness too, so maybe worth a try...made a big difference to me

You need to do hip abduction to work the gluteus medius, do you waddle when you walk?

that funny sideways run

Which funny sideways run?

I have had cycling related pain in ITBs a few times. Always related to bike postion. From memory if your hips rotate too far forward that mucks up the angle the ITB runs at relative to everything else. This then causes rubbing. In the short term a slightly more upright position helped. Sorting out the tight muscles round the pelvis means its just a distance memory

i had classic ITB symptoms, and like most cyclists (ask any yoga teacher) i did minimal or no pre or post ride stretching. I rollered the ITB and it its very painful just using your own body weight but it did improve the symptoms after a couple of weeks of post exercise rolling

do you waddle when you walk

No - should I?

I like the classic sit up on floor. Cross leg over with offending side foot next to other knee. Then pull the knee further across

This one was key for me when I had trouble with the ITB.

Moving the saddle forward a little cured the problem as mine was caused by over extension when pedalling.

Same for me.

Years ago I was chatting to the tri-club coach on a group ride that I was having ITBFS and he suggested moving my saddle forward an inch or two (it was quite far back). Pretty much cured it overnight.

As for foam rolling. 10 years ago the thinking was that foam rolling broke down / changed myofascular (sp) tissue whereas now it's pretty much agreed that is causes no physical changes to tissue but can desensitise an area by increasing the pain temporarily which causes the brain to reduce it's sensitivity to the nerves in that area. So if the root problem is the IT band is too tight, unlikely foam rolling will do anything.

I would have thought IT band specific stretches would be better if you want to elongate the tendon, although it will take a lot of stretching to achieve any gain as tendons are tough as old boots and take ages to lengthen (ask any gymnast how many years it took to achieve the splits).

Interesting that footflaps - a senior NHS physio told ms TJ to do the foamroller as a tight IT band was causing her knee issues. totally cured it

I like the classic sit up on floor. Cross leg over with offending side foot next to other knee. Then pull the knee further across

Just tried that - that gets right to the spot

I do not have knee or hip pain or anything else - just this very tight uncomfy feeling down the outside of both thighs

Athlean X - Jeff Cavaleres videos always work for me. He demonstrates the jt band is attached to the Glute Medius and the TFL and the imbalance in muscle strength causes the tightness and the inflammation.

The video shows the necessary corrective action.

End of thread

Seems like there's a bunch of conflicting anecdotes in support of different interventions.

I'm not a fan of foam rollering, partly because it hurts, but mostly because I don't think anything that's supposed to help mend your body should hurt like ****.

As I understand it, when you hurt yourself, your body creates scar tissues/adhesions which limit your motion until your body can heal the injury. The limitations lead to tightness. If you bulldoze them to the point of significant pain, what you're doing is pulling those adhesions away from the muscle/fascia they're fixed to, creating more damage, and your body's going to want to create more adhesions, more scar tissue to give your body the time and space to repair the damage.

Some people love the rollers, but is it a constant, symptom-reducing effort when that effort might be spent targeting the cause of the symptom - the tightness, the instability, the damage?

I'm going to watch that vid edward2000 posted a few times - it'd be easier if he didn't shout so much! I'd love to run a bit, but ITBS means it's not worth it as my body is at the moment - cycling's just funner and faster and less painful.

Good luck with yours, TJ!

it really is not surfer.

https://www.painscience.com/biblio/iliotibial-band-is-uniformly-firmly-attached-to-the-femur.html

bulldoze them to the point of significant pain, what you’re doing is pulling those adhesions away from the muscle/fascia they’re fixed to, creating more damage, and your body’s going to want to create more adhesions, more scar tissue to give your body the time and space to repair the damage.

I agree however its a bit like training itself. You need to be near the point of breaking down otherwise you have scope to train even harder. Get it wrong you become injured/ill/stale etc. Testing/prodding an injury at the right time triggers a positive response and can speed up recovery. Difficult to get it spot on though.

sorry surfer =- thats a basic misunderstanding of the anatomy.  the IT band is not connected to the femour.  It just isn't Look at the picture in that article.

Where the misunderstanding lies is all parts of the body are interconnected but as the IT band lies outside of the muscles its only attachment to the femour is indirect thru those muscles and the facia sheaths on the musckles

if the IT band was as you seem to think attached to your femour the whole way down your leg could not bend

The picture shows nothing. The peer reviewed stuff makes it clear.

Even if (and the evidence indicates it is) the ITB is not adhered the length of the femur, even attachment at certain points would negate the ability to stretch it. The article explains that it can only be stretched around 2% in total anyway and that may come from the elongation of the attachment points.

This is largely moot anyway unless there is evidence that "stretching" a tendon or muscle provides any benefit in terms of injury prevention or cure, that evidence doesnt appear to exist.

I do not have knee or hip pain or anything else – just this very tight uncomfy feeling down the outside of both thighs

Haven't you just upped your riding volume a lot? Sounds like it could be the ultimate cause, that sort of thing happened to me when changing volume suddenly.

The article Surfer links to says that foam rolling doesn't alleviate ITB pain. However for me, it very quickly alleviated some pain that was very similar to how ITB is described, so clearly it's worth a try given the low cost of the experiment.

but is it a constant, symptom-reducing effort

Not for me, the roller is currently under the bed gathering dust. Did my third 5k in about a year on Saturday, no pain.

Molgrips yes but the tightness has been getting worse for years

Just tried that – that gets right to the spot

Thanks. The other one is stand up with good leg pointing forward. Tight leg foot behind at 90 degrees and bend forward. Not as easy for balance.

The outside knee pain was entirely due to saddle position and over extension. The pain is due to rubbing just above the attachment point on the knee. I avoided knee surgery after an MRI that allegedly showed wear and tear some 15 years ago and a surgeon recommended (naturally) surgery. Never had a problem since. I make that recommendation to anyone with outside edge knee pain on cycling now. Lower and further forward.

@molgrips I am not dismissing foam rollering my unscientific opinion is that it may help. I agree it cant really hurt unless you are a real masochist... I am a believer in "frictional" massgae techniques and they can be excruciating!

Yeah there could be many issues that appear the same. I can't imagine what would only take to roller sessions to resolve and not come back despite how infrequently or frequently I run, but there you go.

Sorry-ish for the long post...

I have had "ITB" type problems for years when running. I use speech marks, as I went to see about 4 different physios (might have been 5) over the years, they all had an opinion on the cause & all had different solutions to solve the problem. I am reluctant to call it ITBS specifically, even though all the symptoms point to it.
Nothing really worked to solve it.
The last time I attempted to solve it through healthcare routes, I had private healthcare so threw everything at it - consultation with a knee specialist (who apparently used to be part of the GB Olympic medical team), ultrasound, MRI, physio & gait analysis.
I did everything asked of me & that didn't work. I basically gave up running as a result.

I can cycle for hours on multiple days & get no issues although the outside of my thighs going up into my hips always feel tight.

Several years ago I started doing yoga once a week at work. Once I got used to the moves, I started doing my own short stretching routine to target the area.
I do a combination of pigeon pose, piriformis stretch, happy baby pose as well as the traditional figure four stretch & a seated variation (no 4 here:)

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/325377#10-hip-stretches

I also started doing some exercises to strengthen my hamstrings and the muscles in the outside of my hip (adductors, or abductors I can never remember).

This made a massive difference & I went from being unable to run for 20 mins, to training for a half marathon. I didn't get to run the half marathon in the end:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/oct/13/great-eastern-run-called-off-armed-police-response-peterborough

but ran an unplanned one about 6 months later on local roads.

I didn't find foam rolling made much difference. It was the regular stretching that got me running again after struggling with this for years & years (~15 years I suppose).

A few days of foam rollering now and doing some of those stretches advised - I can feel a significant difference

Clearly there is a lot of differing opinions as to what is actually going on and its not an area I know much about beyond the basic anatomy so I will organise a physio appointment to make sure I am not just treating the symptoms but go after the cause.

Ta for your thoughts and help

A few days of foam rollering now and doing some of those stretches advised - I can feel a significant difference

Clearly there is a lot of differing opinions as to what is actually going on and its not an area I know much about beyond the basic anatomy so I will organise a physio appointment to make sure I am not just treating the symptoms but go after the cause.

Ta for your thoughts and help

A few days of foam rollering now and doing some of those stretches advised - I can feel a significant difference

Clearly there is a lot of differing opinions as to what is actually going on and its not an area I know much about beyond the basic anatomy so I will organise a physio appointment to make sure I am not just treating the symptoms but go after the cause.

Ta for your thoughts and help

A few days of foam rollering now and doing some of those stretches advised - I can feel a significant difference

Clearly there is a lot of differing opinions as to what is actually going on and its not an area I know much about beyond the basic anatomy so I will organise a physio appointment to make sure I am not just treating the symptoms but go after the cause.

Ta for your thoughts and help

FFS - got the 502 failure so clicked reload - usually this does not result in multiple posts.

If you watch that video I linked above, there is really no need to see a physio to treat this issue.

I had pain so bad in that area it stopped me sleeping. It was the stretching that sorted it. Foam rolling hurts too much. Try just stretching without the roller, see if that works.

edward - sorry mate but what I need is a diagnosis which needs a hands on professional.  Youtube vids are no susbstitute.  I do not have pain at that point that he shows so that vid is irrelevant to me

Oh sorry. I misunderstood the first sentence in the OP

FFS – got the 502 failure so clicked reload – usually this does not result in multiple posts.

When that happens I click back, and on Chrome my text is still there in the box. But if the post actually worked you can see your post already committed so you know if it's received it or not.

edward - I thought I had the classic IT band syndrome but after a few answers actually what I have is a tight IT band but not the classic pain at the knee.  so my failure - sorry

I will organise a physio appointment

YMMV, I did 10+ physio sessions and follow-up exercises over many months, it fixed me (ITBS) for a sedentary lifestyle but not hiking and biking. Paid for an app-based course "mountain proof knees", did it religiously and was sorted in 6 weeks. I'm sure it could be sorted free with the right research and understanding (I tried and failed), but I just got to the point where this thing had to be fixed 'cause I really like going up hills and coming back down again.

I need a hands on diagnosisand a suitable set of exercises / stretches I think not a series of treatments

I have been continuing with the stretches and rollering tho and it feels better