The Falklands

Oh, and FWIW, the Navy personnel that I new and were down in the Falklands came home with a burning hatred of Thatcher. For having to do a job that they shouldn't have had to, and for the 1981 Defence Review and not having the kit to do the job.

plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

Our troops are curently working alongside argentinian troops. That could become akward.

PMSL !

Committee for the Liberation of Integration of Terrifying Organisms and their Rehabilitation Into? Society

is TJ a member?

TandemJerry,tandemJerry;are you Chamberlain is disguise? Are you Chamberlain in disguise?

The Argentinians has already taken down the British street signs, they had also advertised for a Spanish teacher for the Islands,with a start date of September,hardly suggesting they would be willing to retreat while the situation was resolved.Thankfully a diplomatic solution was not sought on this occasion.

So TJ – at what point does negotiation fail?

I'm guessing at about the time you blow your opponents second hand 40 year old antiquated Battleship out of the water with a nuclear submarine several hundred miles away from anywhere it could do any damage, (presuming of course that it had the capability to in fact get close enough to the task force to do any harm, which it couldn't self evidently)

Leave TJ alone! 'Hes doing a Hitler'. We need to keep him online as hes doing the Social Worker cause such a disservice by arguing the way he does 😉

Hora WTF?

Berm bandit – or alternatively when his carrier fleet launches a wing of skyhawks carrying Exocet, and wipes out a couple of troop ships…. which do you let happen first? 🙄

Malvenas to Argentina? Hmmmm

http://www.facebook.com/search/?q=argentina&init=quick#!/group.php?gid=25845468632&ref=search&sid=670495805.299819657..1

This group could do with some new members? 🙄

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=25845468632&ref=search&sid=670495805.299819657..1#!/photo.php?pid=30493754&op=1&o=all&view=all&subj=25845468632&aid=-1&oid=25845468632&id=1351497114

Dont they anything at home of note to follow or feel proud of? Some of these photo links are ridiculous. Dont they know the Junta 'disapeared' alot of their compatriots etc?!

Zulu-Eleven – Member
Berm bandit – or alternatively when his carrier fleet launches a wing of skyhawks carrying Exocet, and wipes out a couple of troop ships…. which do you let happen first?

Isn't that an argument for sinking a carrier rather than a battleship??

Some of the thinking on that facebook group.

Basically:
'You only won because the Canadians, US, Chile and NATO fought Argentina who fought alone'

Propoganda spoonfed to make the youth think it was a heroic lone-battle? Is that the Latin-American thinking?

There's an excellent book by Max Hastings on the Falklands War that covers the politic stage as well as the actual conflict (wartime) command decisions.

I believe that Argentina had two capital ships, the RN was looking for both. When the Belgrano was attacked it was in an area that meant it was not a threat, however within a matter of hours it could be. One of the effects of ssinking it was to ensure that the aircraft carrier stayed well within Argentine Waters which meant that for practical purposes it was out of range of the Task Force & especially the Troop Ships.

ps didnt the French fight with the Argentines, or did the just sell weaponry under the counter?

BB That presumes you know where the carrier is… As already pointed out, the effect of the Belgrano incident was that the Veinticinco de Mayo was immediately recalled to port, the lack of a sea borne platform reduced the Argentine air forces effective loiter time over San Carlos and could well have saved hundreds of British lives…

Gee-Jay – Member

ps didnt the French fight with the Argentines, or did the just sell weaponry under the counter?

Quite legitamatly sold them arms before the conflict. Refused to sell more during the conflict.

Dubious morality of international arms sales aside of course but IMO hypocritical.

What have I missed? 😆

Buenos Aires – Macc Lads

There was a load of bloody fairies in Buenos bloody Aires
With greasy hair and sweaty bums, they'd never heard of Boddington's
A different culture and a different race, – no chippies in the f*****g place,
You can keep that poof Ardiles, we're going to have your Malvinas
Eh Up!

They got our backs up without a doubt, time to sort those Argies out
Costa Mendez lives in fear of real men who can hold their beer
Eh! Eh! Eh! The lads are on their way,
With bayonets and tommy guns and bellies full of Boddington's
Eh Up!

Fray Bentos and cheap red wine is all they eat in the Argentine
But after a scrap with the English Navy, they'll ask for the recipe for chips 'n' gravy

etc

ps didnt the French fight with the Argentines, or did the just sell weaponry under the counter?

They didnt 'fight' they sold equipment legitimately before the conflict. There were backroom diplomacy missions to stop private companies from selling further Exocets through grey channels to Argentina.

Basically capitalism. When someone realised that Exocets were in huge demand they bought with the idea of selling them onto a desperate party for a high-price.

for the precursor to the full conflict watch
An Ungentlmanly Act – an excellent film and apparently has held quite well to the truth of what happened when the Argies first invaded.

The French sold the Exocets to them. before the war. and promised tehm more. however some back room manouevering prevented further sales.
(to which the RN undoubtedly said THANK F***)

The Belgrano sinking was a political and military statement. Had it not occured the Argies fleet would have been out and many more vessels would have been sunk, ours and theres, meaning many more lives lost.

ps didnt the French fight with the Argentines, or did the just sell weaponry under the counter?

No, as posted they sold the Argentinians weapons systems, white flags etc.

No, as they sold the Argentinians white flags etc.

😆

Refused to sell more during the conflict

There were a small number of Exocets still available on the open market and were activley being sought by various countries. UK undercover agents disguised as Arabs bought them if I remember rightly but they very nearly went to a third party acting on behalf of the Argies. Proper cloak and dagger stuff!

Is it just me or is TJ cranking up his hatred lately? All that Thatcher tension is about to explode!

My comment on weaponary was mainly tongue in cheek, as you say capitalism at work. I did like the white flags comment though 🙂

BB That presumes you know where the carrier is… As already pointed out, the effect of the Belgrano incident was that the Veinticinco de Mayo was immediately recalled to port, the lack of a sea borne platform reduced the Argentine air forces effective loiter time over San Carlos and could well have saved hundreds of British lives…

Big Grey thing, with planes on can't miss it! If not try Google maps, or alternatively use the same technology that you ued to spot the Belgrano…(American if my recollections serves me right)

Weak point if you don't mind me saying so Zu old boy.

didn't the french sell the argies the exocets then supply us with some important tech info on eliminating them?

iirc wasn't a lot of the Argentinean army conscripts from the villages?

Deigo Garcia a blokes son just gone their for a 12 month tour lucky git.

Big Grey thing, with planes on can't miss it! If not try Google maps, or alternatively use the same technology that you ued to spot the Belgrano…(American if my recollections serves me right)

Sorry mate – you're smoking crack there… theres rumours that the Russians picked up the Belgrano, and the Norwegians managed to eavesdrop on that information, but that was after the Conqueror was already trailing.

I think you seriously overestimate the technology of the day, and underestimate the difficulty of finding a ship at sea.

You do recall what computers were like in those days? and that we were still using propeller planes for much of our maritime surveillance…

In the words of the Belgrano's Captain:

“I think we posed a real threat… we never had any intention of going back to shore; we were only waiting for the right moment to act”

I was at the Manchester Museum of Science and Industry on Tuesday and saw an AEW Shackleton they have on display. I was suprised to see how long it remained in service for!

Couldn't the yanks lend us one of their battle groups?

El-bent, if it wasn't so obvious you know bugger all about the RAF and airpower in general, I'd object to you calling me a dick.

But it is and I don't. Go do your homework.

Go on then, Enlighten me. 🙄

wowzers its like a game of military top trumps on here

even amongst a bunch of grown men who ride bicycles there are some proper nerds on here!

What I like most about the picture above is the guy water skiing behind the submarine!

I joined up just as the Falklands finished in 1982, do I get the chance to have a go at them again if I re-join up as I missed all the action last time around?!

LOL yea does look like someone water skiing 😀

I was at the Manchester Museum of Science and Industry on Tuesday and saw an AEW Shackleton they have on display. I was suprised to see how long it remained in service for!

Sounds like a comfy OAP armchair to me 😀

an excellent book by Max Hastings

oxymoron

You know. If it wasnt for the Argentinian air force you wouldn't go far wrong for thinking the Argies are a little bit shit at fighting.

From reading, they struck me (as a whole) as being abit Dads Army meets Malaga barman.

The Airmen are the ones who covered themselves in (rightful) glory. Imagine flying a sh1te Pucara and having to hug the contours of the land then drop into a hailstorm of lead from the ground along with missiles and of course the Harriers.

You would feel like a Pigeon with a handgun strapped to you. **** that.

Not a professional army (conscripts).

Not a professional army (conscripts).

Part of them yes.

Couldn't the yanks lend us one of their battle groups?

Ughhh – the Yanks f'cked us over with the Falklands, and it's a bit of a habit. If you're familiar with your history you'll realise that the UK / US alliance and "special relationship" are a load of bollocks – since, oh about a little tea party in Boston….

US conduct (esp foreign poilcy, bt also military) in WW2 could arguably be regarded as anti-UK (and other European "imperialist" natons like France and the Netherlands) as it was anti German, anti Japanese.

Umm, it's either a conscript army or not hora.
The NCOs and ruperts may be enlisted but it's still not a professional army.

the Yanks f'cked us over with the Falklands

American mercenaries lay buried in lime pits in many parts of the Falklands. With their service dogtags.

Make of that what you will.