Taking the kids out of school to going skiing. Opinions?

Do I need to justify wanting to spend time with my kids in a fun environment?

I dunno, do you? (*skim reads thread*…yes, yes it seems you do)

That’s not exactly how it works though, is it? Better results don’t automatically equate to a better job (and we’re talking marginal differences in results here, if any). I know a fair few graduates who’ve almost made it to retirement age without holding down a proper job. Most skills are learnt on a general day to day basis, inside and outside of school, and if you hone them well they will far outshine any educational grades.
I don’t like to see money equated to success either. Who is out enjoying themselves skiing while everyone else is in the daily grind? [/quote]Don’t worry. As someone who left high school and went straight into work with no degree or college education I was being being ironic 😆

surfer –

I think that’s a reasonable conclusion, yes.

Is your response to me who took my son out for 4 days. Pretty unambiguous, yes?[/quote]
No, it was in response to the OP, there hadn’t been any replies to it when I started typing.

However slightly more nuanced when it comes to

So, you know, I wouldn’t say teachers don’t give a toss – some don’t, I’ve no doubt, there are lazy and feckless people in all walks of life. But not all, not by a long chalk.
Can you clarify[/quote]
Sure. In response to –

In my experience it is the teachers that don’t give a toss about them.

I said –

Funnily enough, I’m writing this now because it’s the Monday after half term and Mrs Pondo has spent the last couple of evenings in tears after working all day Friday, Saturday and Sunday (we were away before then, had to chose the holiday we could afford because teachers can’t take leave to take holidays when they’re cheaper – hey, it’s just how life is, right?), and faces another term of monster workloads trying to get kids grades they (and their parents) don’t seem interested in working for, because if the kids don’t get the grades, that affects her career. So, you know, I wouldn’t say teachers don’t give a toss – some don’t, I’ve no doubt, there are lazy and feckless people in all walks of life. But not all, not by a long chalk.

Despite my deeply held inverse snobbery about skiing, I honestly don’t think I would feel too guilty about taking my four year old out of school for a week.

I’m sure she will be able to catch up on her finger painting later.

GrahamS – Member

Not according to her school. Their advice was that they wouldn’t report us for a “first offence”, but it would “be held on record” and considered if there were further offences in future years.

(which there probably will be )

FFS! When are schools given the power to decide if the parents have broken the law? Why are they given the power to judge? Are they trying to emulate the private parking charges?

When are schools given the right to decide if the parents are offenders just because they decide to take them out for holidays.

You lot are truly screwed by the bureaucrats who intend to place blames on parents …

Anyone here think that the bureaucrats i.e. education system, should take responsibility for their children well-being are simply delusional. They don’t give a toss about your children apart from blaming you for their own job security. Wake up!

🙄

The kids who miss my lessons to go on holiday get given any worksheets they missed, are reminded that they have a copy of the textbook and access to Google, and that they need to understand what they missed in order to understand the following work. Then told to have a nice evening/weekend.

why the spurious justification? Just admit that’s it and agree to disagree with those who don’t.

I’m happy/settled with our decision to take her out.

I started the thread because I was interested to hear what others thought and get alternate points of view, even if I don’t agree with them.

To my mind the justification is only “spurious” in that it isn’t required.

I believe that taking her out was a net benefit to her. That’s my honest “justification” to myself and I wouldn’t have done it if I thought otherwise.

Are the rules different in that Scotland? As if she was 4 she’s not mandatory anyway. Wouldn’t think twice about it at that age.

When I added up the possible fines for my lot it looked like holidaying in holidays was sound economic sense 😀

Not according to her school. Their advice was that they wouldn’t report us for a “first offence”, but it would “be held on record” and considered if there were further offences in future years.

Check, and double check the rules. Then tell them to do one.

<official advice from Mrs B, Foundation Stage Leader of 20 Early Years experience>

and faces another term of monster workloads trying to get kids grades they (and their parents) don’t seem interested in working for, because if the kids don’t get the grades, that affects her career

I know a few teachers, and have huge sympathy with them, but it’s the career they chose at the end of the day. Looking at it the other way, should you expect parents to fork out an extra 2k for a holiday in order to make the teachers life a little easier and to show solidarity with them? The problem is silly target-based educational methods, not selfish parents.

miketually – Member

The kids who miss my lessons to go on holiday get given any worksheets they missed, are reminded that they have a copy of the textbook and access to Google, and that they need to understand what they missed in order to understand the following work. Then told to have a nice evening/weekend.

You have done good there by reminding them. If you don’t you are still in the right because the parents decide to have their children miss class so it is their responsibility to catch up themselves.

I know a few teachers parents, and have huge sympathy with them, but it’s the career lifestyle they chose at the end of the day.

should you expect parents to fork out an extra 2k for a holiday in order to make the teachers life a little easier and to show solidarity with them

They could always take up a less expensive hobby?

..but it’s up to the parents to decide if they want their children to be taught. Simple

You are right, that is simple.

It is also however, complete and utter rubbish.

It is also however, complete and utter rubbish.

Not at 4yr old it isn’t

They could always take up a less expensive hobby?

Maybe yes. But it’s no business of schools or the government what hobbies I take up. The fact that inflated skiing holiday prices is the main cause of complaint is irrelevant.

nealglover – Member

..but it’s up to the parents to decide if they want their children to be taught. Simple

You are right, that is simple.

It is also however, complete and utter rubbish. [/quote]

Why is it rubbish?

Who give them right to dictate to you about how you educate your children? Are we communists now?

Are you responsible for your children education? If you wish them not to be educated then that is your choice is it not?

🙄

Why is it rubbish? Who give them right to dictate to you about how you educate your children? Are we communists now?

Because schools are not for learning or enlightenment, they’re for churning out economic producers and taxpayers.

dazh – Member

Why is it rubbish? Who give them right to dictate to you about how you educate your children? Are we communists now?

Because schools are not for learning or enlightenment, they’re for churning out economic producers and taxpayers. [/quote]

Yes, they are conveyer belt for mass production but that does not extend their rights to that of a private life style. If you are fee paying then they certainly do not have the rights to dictate your future good or bad.

My parents have a small shop in a seaside town, if the hadn’t taken us out of school in June / September every year by brother and I would have never of gone on a summer holiday with them (and they certainly could not have afforded a winter holiday abroad). 80% of the the shops income comes during school holiday time so they couldn’t just shut it for a week as they would go bust.
It wasn’t a problem when we were growing up and the school was very flexible, now the school doesn’t have a choice to be flexible so my brother who now runs the family shop will need to pay the fines or his kids will never go on holiday.

It never did me any harm, well at least much less harm then never having a summer holiday with my parents. Doing it to save a few pounds on a skiing holiday is not really the same thing but I’d still agree with it.
Like many other things in life, decent people all get dragged down to the lowest common denominator by the few that take this piss.

Why is it rubbish?

Because it’s not true.

Who give them right to dictate to you about how you educate your children?

The law

Are we communists now?

No.

Are you responsible for your children education?

Yes

If you wish them not to be educated then that is your choice is it not?

No.

nealglover – Member

Why is it rubbish?

Because it’s not true.[/quote]

Or because you have given up your rights?

Who give them right to dictate to you about how you educate your children?

The law[/quote]

Yes, because individuals have given up rights to be responsible by letting the state dictate/responsible for their life style. You vote for it you now tighten your own neck.

Are we communists now?

No.

[/quote]

But it sounds exactly like one because the state take over the “caring” of your children.

Are you responsible for your children education?

Yes[/quote]

But you seem to want to dictate your views on others too why so? Chill man … that’s their children.

If you wish them not to be educated then that is your choice is it not?

No. [/quote]

It is hypothetical as in if you don’t want your children to eat rubbish food at school do you have a say even if the rubbish food is detrimental to your children future health?

Who give them right to dictate to you about how you educate your children?

The law only states that a child must be educated, it doesn’t state have to send them to a school. If parents choose to send their child to a state school then it is not unreasonable to expect the parents to abide by the rules.

You’d think that expensive holidays during the school holidays was a new phenomena and not something that has been the case for decades and an inevitable consequence of the economic system that we choose to have.

The OP is right. Let’s have more free-thinking individuals who are prepared to Stick it to the Man by taking skiing holidays whenever they feel like it.

I love reading the squabbles of the middle classes

gonefishin – Member
The law only states that a child must be educated, it doesn’t state have to send them to a school. If parents choose to send their child to a state school then it is not unreasonable to expect the parents to abide by the rules.

Just to avoid playing with words I equate going to school/home schooling as in educating.

Yes, yes, law and human rights etc … Yes, if it is state school i.e. non-fee paying then you abide by their rules because you get it for “free” and you are on their terms. That I agree. If you are fee paying then i.e. not loan or borrow from govt, then individual freedom should be up hold.

You’d think that expensive holidays during the school holidays was a new phenomena and not something that has been the case for decades and an inevitable consequence of the economic system that we choose to have.

Yes, holidays are expensive. As a kid I never traveled away for holiday in my entire life except visiting and staying with my grandparents. Not even once did we have holidays so it is rather alien to me that children need to go for holiday to be honest. It is a western concept that is catching up rather quickly with the affluence people in the far east nowadays.

but my view is that people/society has given too much power to the state.

Chewkw,

Your version of “how I want things to be”

isn’t the same as the real world version of “how things actually are”

But you need to understand, I based my answers on “the real world”

Rather than your version of reality.

Hope that helps.

nealglover – Member

Chewkw,

Your version of “how I want things to be”

isn’t the same as the real world version of “how things actually are”

But you need to understand, I based my answers on “the real world”

Rather than your version of reality.

Hope that helps.

You are absolutely right.

It is really scary to see the entire society sleep walks into giving up their individual freedom for bureaucratic control.

Bear in mind you have fought hard (your ancestors) for centuries for freedom yet I have noticed increasingly the state/authority is gaining more power because we “collectively” decide one size fits all or because we are so stress/tense that we give up our own freedom. Yes, freedom has limitation but at the moment I think we are given them up bits by bits.

😯

edit:

Sancho – Member

I love reading the squabbles of the middle classes

Nothing to do with middle classes here but rather the individual freedom to take responsibility of their lifestyle. Some rich some poor and I am definitely not the former but to me education is important and definitely not letting the state dictate my learning and knowledge.

sleep walks into giving up their individual freedom for bureaucratic control

I find I have all the freedom I need.

I also have quite a lot of protection that’s been gained by limiting certain “freedoms” in general.

I went on two skiing trips with my school. Both were in term time, no lessons just skiing. Can’t see how that was right and going with your family is somehow wrong ?

nealglover – Member

sleep walks into giving up their individual freedom for bureaucratic control

I find I have all the freedom I need.[/quote]

Of course you do but it is slowly being chipped away bits by bits and by the time you feel it you are stuck.

I also have quite a lot of protection that’s been gained by limiting certain “freedoms” in general.

That’s the problem. Protection and freedom. i.e. your protection might be someone else restriction. Where do you draw the line?

LOL at taxi25 – away with your sensible observations 🙂

Don’t we go over this every year?

I went on two skiing trips with my school. Both were in term time, no lessons just skiing. Can’t see how that was right and going with your family is somehow wrong ?

Freebie for the teachers so definitely right 😉

Anyway, no one at our school ever had trips like that, best I remember was Robin Hood’s Bay looking at rock formations and groping Beverly Crawford on the bus home.

No read the thread but have this conversation with people regularly. Its just middle class people trying to justify taking their kids out of school. If skiing is so important take them in the holidays, if not you can’t afford it so don’t go. Same people who’ll condemn poor people for taking kids out to go to Magluf in summer.

In both cases its about saving money and nothing else. The only difference is that for those poor families its probably their only chance of a holiday as a family. For the skiers its just a way to do their hobby on the cheap.

Surely you already know the answer to this? If your kids will struggle missing the week then it’s a no. If you can help them make it up, then do it in heartbeat.

The problem is that some parents who didn’t care about their kids education abused the rules, and so all schools lost sensible discretion.

That said, there is no right to a cheap holiday, only a right to time off work/school. Kids are only in school something like 190 days a year out of 365. If you can’t afford the holiday you want in school holidays, find a cheaper holiday or save up for longer.

And when their school trips are hitting £300 a pop, family holidays get scaled back even more 🙄

Yes, if it is state school i.e. non-fee paying then you abide by their rules because you get it for “free” and you are on their terms.

Sorry but that’s rubbish. It’s still none of the state’s business if I want to take my kids on holiday at a time of my choosing as long it doesn’t affect their long term development, which is my prerogative to judge. I couldn’t care less if they have SATs or whatever, or if it impacts the school’s ratings in silly league tables.

For the skiers its just a way to do their hobby on the cheap.

Too right. Why wouldn’t I want to make it cheaper? Is there any other area where some arbitrary and largely ineffectual policy costs individuals so much? I’m not trying to dress it up, I want to take my kids skiing and if I can save 2k by doing it in term time then why wouldn’t I want to do that?

Taking my 4 yr old son out of school in 2 weeks time to go skiing. He can’t wait. He does French in school and will be able to put it in to practice.

Plus he is at private school, and there are not the same restrictions as state… Not sure why to be honest?

I wouldn’t take my kids out of school for holidays and I don’t give a shit what other parents do with their kids

Of course you do but it is slowly being chipped away bits by bits and by the time you feel it you are stuck.

It’s a good job you are here to bang on about it all the time then so us sheeple dont get in too deep 🙄

I also have quite a lot of protection that’s been gained by limiting certain “freedoms” in general.

That’s the problem. Protection and freedom. i.e. your protection might be someone else restriction. Where do you draw the line?[/quote]

I’m quite happy to be protected from certain people by the laws that our Evil Overlords have forced on us.

And back on the subject at hand.

I’m also quite happy to be protected from having a future generation of unemployable illiterate numpties running around because our Evil Overlords decided it should be a legal requirement for parents to provide an education for their children.