[Closed] new orange 5 or orange alpine 160 ?

Where you riding? This country...... if yes forget the Alpine go for the Five, our hills ain't big enough to warrant that bike

yeh uk , Todmorden area where singletrack are based, tell me more why the 5 over the alpine ? is this bike heavier ?

I had an Alpine and it was about 8lb heavier than my 5. Rode exceptionally well in the right envoironment.

The 5 is faster everywhere except down; then by only a smidge. The 5 is a capable descender and a good climber. The Alpine is a great descender and a fair slog upwards.

Which is best for you? Only you know.

Not a huge amount of difference in bare frame weights, but once the Alpine's kitted out with heavier wheels,tyres,forks and all the other heavier duty componentry then you will notice a difference. I'd guess that we sell about eight 5s to every one Alpine for use in the UK, but saying that, one of my riding buddies uses his as a general trail/xc bike with no problems. Both are excellent bikes, but as mentioned above, one may suit you better so try for a test ride on both.

I went to buy an alpine and came away with an 5am. Alpines are fantastic bikes but for everyday uk riding then the 5 would prob suit better.

The 5 handled load's of stuff I'm sure other 'normal FS' wouldn't - I really liked the maxle rear too.

Mine weighed about 30lbs which ain't bad considering:

[img] [/img]

I have an Alpine and love it. It's by far the best bike I've owned and is just huge fun. I use it for natural riding, trail centres and in the Alps. It's a little slow on the climbs, but the downs make up for it. I've built in with a good mix of componets including some light wheels (Fulcrum Red Zones) which makes it pretty versatile. I guess it comes down to your priorities as I'm happy to spin to the top and blast down the otherside. If you want to be first to the top then the 5 makes more sense. I have a Trek EX8 as well which I hardly ride anymore as the Alpine fits 95% of what I need.

Sounds exactly the same when i demod a Marin attack trail gosh that was a heavy bugger to get uphills! i went out with my mates and they absolutely caned me to the top and i was struggling to get up but on the downhills it was a different story, it sounds similar to what you guys are talking about, i live in an area full of climbs and descents, its probably got more climbs saying that, id have to demo the 2 bikes in a few weeks time and see how i get on as im a xc/am rider , well i guess i have to be round here lol

i,ll second that ! singletrack land is full of hills (lots of climbs ... we are so lucky to live here !
so wud this Alpine bike be more suitable for the Alps...thats what i always thought... and is it harder than the 'five ' for climbing ?

nah just cause its called alpine doesn't mean its for the alps , its just one of those bikes that are better for the downhills rather than the ups where at the orange 5 is all rounder good for ups and downs, people were just saying you would only buy the apline if you lived in an area with alot of downhills and don't mind struggling to get up em lol which is why i mentioned the attack trail similar situation i had

no it does mean its only for the alps but it is for alpine style riding. which i'd see as lift assisted riding. it can go up hill but not the best and it's main strength is for blasting back down.

get the 5 AM (with cane creek)

ah so alpine does mean its for the alps, it just sounded daft lol i dont know much about orange as this is as far as ive looked into em, but i am considering the new 5 though just waiting for a demo version first

bloody hell are you having a joke ? with cane creek ? +400 people think i crap money these days lol

ha ha ha wondered what your response to that would be! I'm still tempted by it!

/late edit - oh, in that post up there i meant "no it does[b]N'T[/b] mean its only for the alps but it is for alpine style riding.)
long challenging descents are its thing. I think if you did a fair amount of non-racing DH along with trail rides the alpine would be best. but for all sorts of trail riding the 5 is right.
don't over bike yourself.

lolz well i wouldent know as ive always ran an rp23 shock and there amazing 🙂

I have the 5 AM 08 model and I put a Manituo IXS 6 rear shock
on and have recently sent my FOX talas 160 forks back to MOJO
and turned them into a Float and also converted to 150 mm travel.
Dont need the Alpine 160 over here in my eyes

My FOX RP23 is in the drawer as a spare best place for it !!
Stick the Manituo IXS 6 on the rear of the 5 and you have an
even harder hitting downhill / trail bike.

And stick a gravity seat dropper on it.

....and guess what ...the 'majority' of bikes at the classic weekender trials at 'Lee Quarry' today were........ORANGE FIVE BIKES ! yehaaaaa..amazing 😉

The five ticks all boxes on paper, gotta get a go on one soon.
Very nice bikes but the Knolly is still seriously doing it for me, so I have no excuse to buy one!
I'd be tempted to buy a '10 model though if you can get one cheap(er), I don't think the '11 model is much to shout about with minimal improvements on an already great bike.

hmmm i was just about to ask why the 'five Am 'is abit dearer than the 'pro model'... then again the 'five am' is a go between the five and the Alpine apparently i just read ... just copied this extract :

The Five AM is for the big boys, a harder riding version of our iconic trail model. Meant for epic climbs and terrifying descents, the AM is the bridge between the Five and Alpine 160
so chris : the five AM it possibly is then... 😉

[i]Where you riding? This country...... if yes forget the Alpine go for the Five, our hills ain't big enough to warrant that bike [/i]

errrm, doesn't that rather depend on what and how you ride?!

An Alpine is going to be a lot more fun if the rider dabbles in DH, or doesn't mind slogging uphill for an epic descent in say the Lakes or even the Dark Peaks.

Not only that but people's riding style varies so much that it's impossible to generalise and say the Alpine is too much bike - regular 5' drop offs anyone? Then I'd rather have the Alpine!

25/30 mile all-days - I'd take the 5!

LOL Ropey some fair points but the Orange 5 can
take upto a 8 ft drop off But if your a harder
ridder then go for the Alpine 160 if you want to
do 8 ft drop offs

OP for around Tod etc I'd say you'd happily get away with a hardtail as a compromise between climb and descent. Therefore I'd say Orange Five.

I've ridden with blokes far more technically-adapt than me who ride hardtails and they aren't underbiked on rocky sections.

Apart from the Marin what else have you tried out?

What's all this slogging, compromise and no to 30mile days talk? I've done 70mile off-road days on mine, I climb fast, descend fast and am rarely caught going-up. For the sake of comparison and to give a trail centre-oriented example, if you like shooting up the Twirch, playing in the park and then heading up to the top for the downhill run back down this bike is for you. This is the most versatile bike I've owned and I'm in no hurry to replace it.

My angle is around Calderdale a hardtail is more than bike enough.

how much heavier is the new 5am to the new 5? http://www.orangebikes.co.uk/bikes/2011/five_am/

This might sound really really stupid but i actually didn't know they remade the other orange bikes such as the (5am)(5s)(5pro) i thought it was just the pro they remade, as i was saying a few posts back i was looking into the orange alpine but people were saying its only good for the downs ans not so good on the ups and just basic alpine riding etc etc and looking into it just now the Orange 5am sounds exactly what im looking for, something with bigger trvl (160mm) and is still great on the ups ( a harder hitting bike) as ive had a FS 140trvl for nerly 3 year now and jsut want something more, this this area (calderdale) would this be a suitable bike? i just need to know the weight between the am and the 5 pro

If you are not doing a fair bit of downhill type riding then i think the 5 will be fine for you.I have an alpine with coil front and rear built up fairly stout as i do everything from long rides to uplifts with it.I find it climbs better than my turner tnt 5 spot i had before even though it is about 6lbs heavier.On the downs though it is amazing and really comes into its own where it feels most at home.It can be a little bit hard work in slow tight singletrack due to the slack head angle but i can live with that.

I think there is around 2 lb weight dif between the 5 and alpine frames when fitted with the rp23 shock,the extra overall weight of an alpine compared to a 5 will be how it has been built up with tougher parts.

yeah, well i do alot of uphills and downhills but i prefer my downhills but dosent everyone? i just need something a bit more tougher to really thrash it on the trails 😀

how about the 5am with cane creek double barrel ;p

if you put 160mm forks an a modern five frame it takes it slacker head angle wise than an alpine 160. I've got pikes on mine and regularly ride dh as well as regular trails and never thought i've needed more travel. If you've got the cash i'd say go for the ccdb though.

400 quid is alot for that rear shock though, ill probably just go for the rp23 in the end with the 160trl am id have to test ride it also

Alpine and the Five are both great for Calderdale, but the Alpine will really come into its own on the bigger, rougher descents in the Lakes and places. Also, it's not true that 'Alpine' means it's just a lift bike. Plenty of the best Alps trails can't be accessed by lifts alone, so the Alpine's been developed to do the climbs and traverses that get you beyond the lifts to the lesser-known (and IMO best) descents. If you hit the Alps once a year, or ride in the Lakes and places, I'd go for the Alpine. If you're sticking to Calderdale and trail centres, I'd pick a Five, probably an AM version.

WL- that's exactly what i mean m8, i don't ride the lakes Ive only been once infact, ive never been to the alps and i am just intending riding Calderdale and other trail centers etc, therefor im not looking into the alpine. the AM is in-between the pro and the alpine which is what im after, i need to demo the 2 bikes and pick which is best for me 🙂

If you'd like a coil but not up for spending £400 why don't you think about getting a fox van r from tf tuned and getting it push tuned? Will cost about £250 but you'd have the rp23 that comes with the five to sell and make it a cheap upgrade.
I'm getting a pushed van r for mine soon, keeping the rp23 for all day in the hills rides and fitting the coil for dh and local shorter rocky riding,jumps,drops etc.
If you have any doubts about the fives capabilities, mtbcut rider joe barnes even occassionally races dh on his. Watch mojo trail diaries on mtbcut and you'll see what sort of terrain the five excels in.

i used to ride my patriot as a general trail bike - a good work out uphill and magic downhill. Do you really care what other people think about your bike choice? You'll always be pissed if your under-biked but you'll never be pissed off at having too much suspension when you're doing steep up's and downs. Get the Alpine and enjoy 🙂

nah steve im happy with that it comes with on the (am) the rp23 is great as i have one on my prophet, like i said after demoing the 5 and the am ill make a decision 🙂

Personally, I'd get the Alpine and make a point of hitting the Lakes and the Alps. Anyway, there are some super-steep and technical descents in Calderdale - you'll be glad of slack angles if you fancy riding them. Five's still a great bike though.

Ive got the Alpine 160 and its dogs nuts to ride. Ive got a Cotic Soul for general xc duties tight twisty single track stuff but the Alpine is used in the peaks and around the bigger stuff in the lakes and North wales I would shy away from on my Soul. Its been to the Alps too.
It weighs 32lbs only a couple of pounds heavy than a Five with a similar spec. The five am in my mind is flawed unless it has a talas because the geometry is to slack to climb. The Alpine is a very good climber too, the geometry works up and down. I have out climbed mates on fives and hecklers on steep climbs and it leaves them for dead on the downs.
In saying all that the new 5 looks fantastic and the upgrades make it look like a trail weapon. If I only had one bike it would be a new Five but if you can afford more than one bike for different days a Alpine is alot of fun.

repatriot you werent in a group riding down Chapel Gate one really early weekend morning a few weeks ago? (circa 8am)- On Alpines and other big bikes, some wearing Oakleys, armour and fancy Fox forks.

I had a giggle as I felt scruffy/under-dressed!!

Should probably add, although the Alpine is good to go for all sorts of riding up and down, I do have a Stiffee for titzing around trail centres, jumpy duties and riding that an Alpine (and I guess most FS's?) can flatten.

hora,
Wasn't me, 8am I am normally still in bed on a weekend...

im going to demo the new 5 and the orange (am) and if i can get hold of the alpine too ill have a go and i will make a decision, but guys.. dont confuse me too much haha

the bikes in my mind are

Orange Apline 160

Orange 5 pro

Orange 5 AM

the 5 pro and the AM are the main 2 that are on my list due to what people said about the apline being just for alps/lakes and not as good for uphills where as the other 2 are both

The 5 is an awesome climber! I was on the 2011 demo one yesterday & Friday & I ran out of legs before I ran out of traction.
Mine should be ready by the end of the month. 😆

wayhey good for you...thats another Orange rider hooked then !!!! 8) 😆

how is it on the downs essel?

and was that the 5 pro ?

[i]how is it on the downs essel?[/i]
dunno, I was riding Nidderdale.
Oh... you mean 'going down' as opposed to South Downs!
Honestly, it/we fu**ing flew down the descent into Ramsgill without any bother at all. As I've posted on other threads, I felt completely at home with it & that's on the first ride. can't wait for mine.

[i]and was that the 5 pro ?[/i]

It was a demo bike, bit of a mix n match I reckon & not what the pro is specced at. Fox 32 Float fork, RP23XV shock (I think!), SLX chainset, Thompson stem & s/p, EA70 bars, Hope V2 brakes, Maxle back end, not QR.
Anyway i wasn't arsed about that stuff & just wanted to see how it rode.
The one I've ordered is a custom build, £3800 down to £3200 for my cheek!

ah right well ill be demo-ing the new one to see how it rides and then the other 2 bikes im also interested in, glad u liked the one u tried though hehe

Let us know how you get on eh?

yea its going to be a while yet as the lbs are still getting these bikes in as they have just come out etc so yeah ill keep ya updated essel hehe

I've got both and got to admit the 5 feels slightly more nimble than the Alpine. I've got 160 Floats on the Alpine and it doesn't feel that unpleasant to climb at all - quite surprising.
I've taken both to the Alps and not a huge amount in it, though the Alpine does come down very well indeed.
I've also done a couple of enduro races with them both and again theres not a lot in it.
The 5 feels super sweet when I'm back on it. To be honest it really does take some beating. I've got 36 Talas on it and trim the travel when climbing & descending.
The one thing I do like about the Alpine is the external routing for the rear mech cable. Keeps the back end much quieter. My 5 feels noisy when I ride it now.

yeh thats what got me, the alpine having 160 forks where as the 5 has 140 which is why i thought it would make it slightly harder for technical climbs etc, frostie have you been on a AM ? this is also what im going to be trying out thx

My 5 has 150mm Fox 32's with the QR15. It closes the gap on the Alpine with little weight penalty.

Try it.

Chris I haven't got a stock bike - I bought the frames and built both bikes myself. The Alpine only weighs a tad more than the 5.

IMO its all down to what sort of riding you're going to be doing. If its general XC and trail centres I'd get the 5. If you're after regular trips to the Alps, uplift days and more aggressive use I'd consider the Alpine.

Having said that, I took my 5 to the Alps in 2007, gave it a really good pasting and it coped admirably, embarassing some much bigger bikes in the process, and I wasn't hanging about 😛

[IMG] [/IMG]

Sometimes when I ride my 5 I wonder what the point was of me building the Alpine. It seems to jump better than the Alpine, but the Alpine does land pretty sweet with that extra bit of travel.

I honestly think if I did an enduro event on both bikes there would be nothing between them.

The Alpine does look pretty sweet though, even with rental forks 😛

[IMG] [/IMG]
Here's what it should look like;
[IMG] [/IMG]

Go and demo them, but if you genuinely don't know which one you ought to get it's probably the Five pro that you need IMO...

There's being capable and fun and then there's being overbiked and being overbiked is no fun...

The Five pro is very capable but rarely do you feel overbiked, even in the flat woodland of Bristol it's a hoot, yet I'll quite happily do Cwmcarn DH on it.

yeah nice pics frostie i can see what your saying, i do more xc/am thats why i was suggesting the 5am as its inbetween the alpine and the pro, but like i keep saying i need to keep demo the bikes and see how i get on

Ive just sent my 36r talas to MOJO and turned them into Floats
and reduced the travel to 150 on my 5 AM which really feels
bang on and dont feel to high at the front as it did set
at 160 travel

so 160 feels to high ? unless ur seat was to low xD

so are you saying 160 travel feels too much on the five AM.... lol the longer this thread goes on the more intriguing it becomes..

its all about adding to my decision on the 3 bikes i have in mind i dont care lol

are you sure its 3 bikes.... you could go for (five) bikes.. 😆

I'd say look at the options from Giant, Specialized, Trek, Santa Cruz etc (any of the big names) because they know what their doing when it comes to suspension and they use sus designs that actually work, as opposed to a single pivot. Plus they are better value for money.

saying orange aint big?

saying orange aint big?

Yeh, I think they only have about 10 employees or something like that, a small bike brand compared to the ones I listed.

its not the staff its how they ride ;p

Nope not to much travel? But as I turned the Talas into a Float fork
and being I dont only use this bike for going downhill all the time more
a rough all rounder I wanted to balance the bike more and it works!
and if I was doing the Alps or CwmCarn I can take these spacers out just for that.
And when I do the trail riding I will put the spacers back in.

i do a bit of both, xc/am trail centers etc, just want something stronger xD

chris_mbuk Go for the AM version the difference of stiffness
between the 36 to the 140 float fork is very noticeable which swung
it for me.
But then the 5 AM 08 spec had all the upgrades I wanted at the
time which was cheaper than buying the pro version and selecting
upgrades.

well yep there are some big names up there like spesh and giant but when it comes to ORANGE ... they just know how to build bikes...better stronger faster... ("built to last".. (you dont see hairline cracks in 'orange bikes' within the first few weeks of riding them like others !
own up : whose ever had a crap orange bike ?????? lets have a poll... 😉

dont start another thread mum ;p

agreed grant i cant wait to demo a AM

I'd say look at the options from Giant, Specialized, Trek, Santa Cruz etc (any of the big names) because they know what their doing when it comes to suspension and they use sus designs that actually work, as opposed to a single pivot

Wow what a load of old tosh that was. Do you work for Halfords ? 😮

I could write chaper and verse about how my 5 has lasted much longer at the back end than my mates Stumpy and how much stiffer it is but you sound like you've already made your mind up.

Whats wrong with single pivot ? You saying Orange have had it wrong all this time ? You mentioned Santa Cruz - despite your claim they use a single pivot so what exactly is your argument ?

You know, thats the main thing I love about my Oranges - absolutely simple at the rear, 2 bearings, any play change them and not have to worry if you've picked the right pair of bearings to change out of 16 or so. Whats the issue with single pivot when clearly (and very clearly) it works perfectly ?

dont forget to keep on my subjectxD

lol a 'chris_ mbuk' thread only....
i guess you just have to demo the bikes soon..... come on 'Blazing saddles'...these demo bikes need to get here like yesterday.... we need good Demo results and excellent feedback A,S,A,P.. lol dont ya just luv this thread...
Next::: 😉

75 posts in total lol

Whats the issue with single pivot when clearly (and very clearly) it works perfectly ?

I always thought single pivot very clearly didnt work perfectly, thats why they need to use fancy shocks with platform damping etc.

Seemed to ride a lot more perfectly than my Spesh did!

seems to ride 50 times better than my spesh did too ! 😉

I always thought single pivot very clearly didnt work perfectly, thats why they need to use fancy shocks with platform damping etc

Why does the 5 keep winning trail bike of the year then ?

Don't get suckered into believing that all these linkages are required. I had a Trek Liquid before my 5 with a mulilink back end and the 5 is unquestionably better.