New Cotic Rocket is a steel frame ebike with external battery

Now this is going to be one heck of a polarising pushbike. Kudos to Cotic for continuing to plough their own furrow. I, for one, am really pleased to …

By ben_haworth

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New Cotic Rocket is a steel frame ebike with external battery

It’s not a looker with that battery, but having read the full article (the ‘development history’) and the rationale behind it all I get the reasons why. It’s going to split opinion for sure.

The thought of a full-power e-bike that weighs <22kg, in the XL/C5 size I need, with geometry I know works for me, from a company I like…

The rocker link setup, I think looks much nicer than the droplink. However to counter that, the battery looks like it’s off a carrera, with it’s ‘roofbox’ styling.

You would have to be very “function over form” to buy that. I’m a huge cotic fanboi (currently on a Jeht) but i really cant see them selling many of these.

Plus with the industry focusing so much on getting the weight down on ebikes, is steel really the best choice???

It looks great for an ebike…aside the battery but it obviously needs one so kind of stuck with that. Either design the battery so it blends in more or some sort of custom frame bag that effectively incorporates the battery in it and hides it away whilst also adding some storage around it

I’m more offended by the saddle on the orange bike than the battery.

But it’s an original 90s Flite!

@blackflag It’s 2kg lighter than the aluminium prototypes we had built. 21.5kg for a full power bike ain’t exactly heavy!

Are there any options for a colour-matched battery, @cy? 🙂

@blackflagIt’s 2kg lighter than the aluminium prototypes we had built. 21.5kg for a full power bike ain’t exactly heavy!

that is good going, but thats not with a full fat battery.

@chipps – yes, if you want a black frame 😀

I always laugh when I read “hand built” in marketing materials. What, they don’t have any tools in their workshop? How can it have CNC machined parts if it’s “100% hand built?”

@chipps We tried that. Looked weird, but I’m sure we can paint things if people want them 😉

@nuke Thanks

Holy mackerel!

I think I may have seen someone testing the rhubarb bike around blacka moor. Probably a few years ago now.

If it wasn’t that it was some other cotic prototype with a wacky paint job.

@blackflag 22kg with 630Wh. Or just hot swap the small batteries if you have a couple of them.

I do like the development story, that it’s built in the UK and that the battery, being black, seems to disappear in the ride pics.. Not so keen that it looks like a 5 year old Haibike but the reasons behind that are very valid.

Any idea why the internal batteries are heavier than the externals? It’s very counter intuitive given the externals need to be self supporting and have structural mounting points on one side only.

Hope you sell a decent amount Cy. Thumbs up emoji. ;o)

Hot swapping batteries sounds great but how much are the additional batteries? If it’s anything like range extender pricing then you’re going to be looking at £500 for the small one and maybe £800 for the big. It’s a lot to drop on a spare/different ride option.

Any idea why the internal batteries are heavier than the externals?

It’s probably not the battery itself which is heavier but the cavernous tube which is needed to contain them.

I trust Si to know what he’s doing when it comes to handling, but surprised the battery being where it is doesn’t upset things. Integrating battery into the downtube puts the weight a lot lower.  A friend with an Orbea Wild which has that type of battery as the piggy back for an internal (but can be run with just the piggy back and an empty downtube) says the handling was noticeably worse when it was fitted.

Shimano external batteries are quite a bit lighter than the internal ones for some reason

That is odd. I wonder if it’s that internal batteries can be used as structural element or that they need more heat management/heat-sink “stuff” as they’re going to be trapped inside a tube

I like that bike and the rationale behind an external battery, I’ve always thought enclosed, non removable batteries a bad idea. I don’t like the new phrase that appeared along with the bike “hot swap”, it sets my jargon klaxon going like for “cockpit, mid-stroke support, full fat” etc!

@mrhoppy

Quick Google suggests £550 for the big one before any shopping around.

 

https://www.singletrackbikes.co.uk/m7b619s536p84530/Shimano_STEPS_BT-E8016_STEPS_battery_630_Wh_frame_down_tube_mount_black_/Electric_Drive/RS_GB/199912?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwveK4BhD4ARIsAKy6pMIXWkq0gtiNxu1WsnzQGMG4YqUqcL0tK_sX55darRipoMW_uj5OhQsaApdsEALw_wcB

Big respect to Cotic for doing something different.

Very difficult to get around the battery being fugly. Could you perhaps use two of the bottle-style ones with one under the top tube?

Pretty sure my Wild fs weighs more than that.

I’m not able to drop that kind of money on a new eeb any time soon but I think it’s great that Cotic are doing something a bit different.

I miss my Rocket 275 that had to go to make way for the Wild (that I rarely ride)

The external battery is totally acceptable in order to achieve a steel framed eeb, IMO.

But as I said on the other (closed) thread, the pricing is pretty steep and the frame-only pricing is actually shocking.

And with Shimano seeming a bit unreliable and lagging on performance… hmmm.

My wife has an alu framed ebike from another company, complete with 650wh battery.
It’s a hard tail, and weighs around 23kg.
So a steel fs bike at 22kg doesn’t seem too bad to me.

@b33k34 The battery weight being concentrated in a single place seems to the thing you notice. The 418Wh battery makes the bike feel very “normal”. No runaway train feeling, normal braking points etc. Just adding 0.7kg for the 630Wh definitely gives it a more ‘ebike’ feel, although nothing like the 24-25kg previous prototypes we had. Your friend adding the extra range extender is probably just feeling the extra weight rather than where it is. Plus, although a little lower if it was internal, it is much further forward, so you feel that mass much more acutely when trying to turn. It’s why I went mullet on the bike, as it made the black prototypes (with internal batteries) turn much more easily. The Rocket is much more wieldy, but still likes the mullet setup for turn in.

@sharkattack No idea why they’re so different, but the 630Wh external is 0.5kg lighter than the internal one we have. Weighed on our scales. The internal ones aren’t structural. They’re specifically designed not to be. They have a mounting rail that you have to set to stop them moving around.

Absolutely gopping. Quite like the layout apart from the battery and motor – like a modern, steel Turner Burner…

Just like normal (well, full fat and not Haibike) ebikes, I bet you get over the appearance pretty quick when you see it in the flesh. And ride it of course.

Damn expensive though

I actually really like this, good on Cy & Cotic! I think the form-follows-function industrial vibes we generally get from Cotic suits this and plays well into the steel ethos. They don’t make  big beautiful hydrofrmed ali or autoclaved carbon aeronautical designs, but rather simple steel triangles (which I love).  I’ve had 5 Cotics and still have one. In fact I’m still hovering over the buy button on a FlareMax.

I just don’t understand the price..

The builds are pretty much identical, but the E version is £3275 more..
> Motor: £725
> Battery: £500
> Loom & Display: £300
= £1,525

What’s the remaining £1700 for?
I guess some additional machining for the CNCd motor mounts  & battery holder?
Is it a mark-up to cover R&D costs or the future warranty issues for the motor?

I also don’t get the name. The Rocket is their original rowdy FS, that’s changed into the MAX with 29″. Going back to Rocket is confusing I think. It would benefit from a new name to denote the e-line up.

I like the look compared to a aluminium frame with a huge down tube.

Once I’d read the reasoning for the layout it makes sense.

There’s a lot of cost, despite the somewhat budget look – all UK production won’t make it cheap.

• Five Land Bikes do the steel fabrication. Matt and Callum are quite simply some of the best steel welders we have ever seen. The paint finish is unsurpassed and they have been bringing the small scale production expertise to Cotic suspension bikes since 2018.
• Coal Bikes do the aluminium fabrication and are a key local Cotic partner, with Gavin having huge experience welding all types of material. When he’s not making swingarms for the Rocket he makes our Escapade UK853 gravel bike frames.
• Reynolds Technology in Birmingham supply the Cotic exclusive shaped top and seat tubes in their top spec 853 material. It’s some of the best steel available, with over 100 years of heritage behind it. Cotic’s have always used 853 tubes in some way, shape or form, and these Cotic exclusive tubes for the Rocket are the fruits of a long and successful partnership.
• Rideworks do all the CNC machined parts for the rocker and swingarm. Paul and his team do their work with incredible precision and diligence.
• 76 Projects are our 3D printing partner, helping us with the custom motor cover and cable management parts. Rob’s been instrumental in helping us realise the parts we need to bring the level of detail we wanted for the Rocket.
• Bear Frame Supplies are also local friends, based in the heart of the Peak District. Aaron makes the turned parts such as pivot bosses and axles that are key to the precise fit of all the moving parts of the frame.
• Black Cat Custom Paint do all the A La Carte custom painting. Stu finishes frames to an incredible standard, so if you want to individualise your Rocket even further, he will be bringing your dream to life.

how about a “universal” mount with adaptor plates for different motors ?
(I have no idea who else makes suitable systems for bolting on but, you know…)

Yes that’s a lot of sub-contract manufacturing or the components required to make the frame and if everyone is adding profit and low volume mark ups to that then it’s going to get expensive. The good thing is that this looks like a made to order kind of thing so Cy can do that.  I hope they do well.

Has made me rethink my idea of getting the Nicolai MGU though (at some point in the future) as that’s something like 27kgs . . .

I like it. Like how it’s made too.

Always wondered why more E-MTBs aren’t this format. Integrating the battery might look smooth but there’s a whole load of reasons not to bother (which I expect Cotic have covered in the launch). ‘But fashion’.

Is it just me, or is the black prototype the best looking bike up there, nothing like a Cotic though,

@cokie You’ve undercooked the drive system price a little, but I see your point. The main difference is that a droplink rear end is made in Taiwan, whereas the entire Rocket frame down to the cable guides is UK made, and in the case of some of the rear end parts, considerably more complex to machine than a regular Rocket. Add in all the motor yoke parts and fabrication, and that is where the price difference comes in. It takes nearly as long to weld the yoke on it’s own than an entire droplink front end. It saves nearly 1kg compared to the horrid cast off the shelf yoke, so I felt it was worth it. Hopefully some others do too.

@jameso Thanks.

If motors and battery mounts were more closely related that would be great, but unfortunately not the case. Could do with the EU giving all these suppliers a kick and making them agree a universal mounting standard.

@cy have you spoken to DJi at all, no one want a shimano motor (though I understand the rational).

I think the bike looks great, too many bikes with fat downtubes, trying to hide batteries & making them impossible to remove

@z1ppy We haven’t spoken to any other motor suppliers for a couple of years since we committed to Shimano. We haven’t had any problems with our Shimano stuff, and the EP801 motors are a totally different beast to the EP8 motors that used to cause some trouble for some users. Although we haven’t had any problems with the EP8 motors we have had for nearly 4 years either. I think a lot of these big swoppy carbon things enclose the motor so much that if any water or muck does get in it sits there causing trouble. My mate has a Santa Cruz and they as good as told him that trapped moisture gets boiled by the hot motor and fritzes it. Even though the power cable is properly sealed by our motor cover, water and muck can drain out of ours. We wouldn’t have used Shimano if we didn’t think it was up to the job.